What went wrong with idea of OT

[SchwimmelPuckel]

A better example of 'misuse' of the 'case' concept would be that registrars are trained to consider any and all resistance to hand over the dough as 'case'. - And any and all disagreement with tech/management/seniors is also 'case'.

Summed up.. YOU are one banky bastard!!!

 

[Tanstaafl]

It seems to me we're getting a little lost because case is so broadly and sloppily defined.

In order to help clarify this aspect of Scn dogma, I've provided a few examples below so people can get a better handle on it:-

Bookcase - a fear of study
Briefcase - a fear of lingerie or underwear
UPPER CASE - fear of heights
lower case - fear of falling
flight case - obvious
showcase - a fear of public exposure
"just in" case - fear of ridicule from having a short penis
overnight case - fear of the dark

 

[Escalus]

It seems to me we're getting a little lost because case is so broadly and sloppily defined.

In order to help clarify this aspect of Scn dogma, I've provided a few examples below so people can get a better handle on it:-

Bookcase - a fear of study
Briefcase - a fear of lingerie or underwear
UPPER CASE - fear of heights
lower case - fear of falling
flight case - obvious
showcase - a fear of public exposure
"just in" case - fear of ridicule from having a short penis
overnight case - fear of the dark

Cool. My needle is floating now...

 

[Zinjifar]

Zinjipoo - what are your thoughts on the subject of "bank"?

'Bank' is like 'Case' but worse. It's the generalization from the particular to the universal as in 'everybody has this' (But Me; Ron, who 'rose above the 'Bank')

The problem with these 'terms' is that they'd be perfectly acceptable as metaphors or analogies or similes or things like that, but, instead, they're presenented as completely literal-intended descriptions of reality. Once you buy them and use them you are constrained to accept the *implications* of their reality; such as that 'case' is the result of 'engrams', 'implants' bla bla bla bla. And, once you've swallowed that, then you're 'in' the Hubbardian mindset and that's a mindset with very rigid walls and few windows.

It's like a guy saying 'Life is like a game of checkers'. Maybe he can support his metaphor, but, eventually it'll begin to break down. Them metaphors can only stretch *sooooooo* far before they begin to hink.

Ron's terms are presented not as metaphors, but as stark raving reality, and, eventually you're in the position of having to defend (to yourself) how you're a little round wooden disk in the game of life.

Ron's metaphors are not only hinky and drawn by the hair and overextended; they're *tendentious* and carry a lot of deliberately disguised and hidden baggage. Like anyone 'under 2.0 on the Tone Scale' having 'bad breath and BO'. Holy shit.

Zinj

 

[Tanstaafl]

'Bank' is like 'Case' but worse. It's the generalization from the particular to the universal as in 'everybody has this' (But Me; Ron, who 'rose above the 'Bank')

Interesting that he rose above "the" bank. Maybe he did rise above "a" bank but crashed and burned on the other 9,999,999?

I've made attempts in the past on ESMB to get help in clarifying what aspects of case are not bank, with little success. The Book One definition and explanations (lock, secondary, engram) have some workability - but then there is the matter of "who's?".

The problem with these 'terms' is that they'd be perfectly acceptable as metaphors or analogies or similes or things like that, but, instead, they're presenented as completely literal-intended descriptions of reality. Once you buy them and use them you are constrained to accept the *implications* of their reality; such as that 'case' is the result of 'engrams', 'implants' bla bla bla bla. And, once you've swallowed that, then you're 'in' the Hubbardian mindset and that's a mindset with very rigid walls and few windows.

Kinda like Vegas then. Are there any clocks?
I don't agree, but you do have to be on the qui vive.
However, the closer you are to Scn the more merit your point has, because of the group-agreement that Hubbard was right about everything.

It's like a guy saying 'Life is like a game of checkers'. Maybe he can support his metaphor, but, eventually it'll begin to break down. Them metaphors can only stretch *sooooooo* far before they begin to hink.

Ron's terms are presented not as metaphors, but as stark raving reality, and, eventually you're in the position of having to defend (to yourself) how you're a little round wooden disk in the game of life.

Ron's metaphors are not only hinky and drawn by the hair and overextended; they're *tendentious* and carry a lot of deliberately disguised and hidden baggage. Like anyone 'under 2.0 on the Tone Scale' having 'bad breath and BO'. Holy shit.

At least, in your last example one can go out and test it for oneself.
Sadly, nothing will protect some people from the impulse to then assume everyone with bad breath and BO must be below 2.0
If one can easily test the datum then there is no problem. We have to take responsiblity for our own thoughts and beliefs. People tend to get some wins early on in Scn and then take the rest on faith and because continued membership in the group relies on it.

Don't underestimate the effect of a strong group and the sense of belonging as a major part of the attraction of Scn. People do all kinds of shit (morris dancing, histroical battle reenactment) and my guess is that 90% of the attraction is "to be different" while being in a group.

BTW, I trust Zinji's personal hygiene is above approach!

 

[Escalus]

You're all nuts.

Everybody knows if you run your bards through the glens you get Shakespeare, but if you were to run the bards through the dales you'd have something earlier up the escalator like Thucydides or something. Anyway it's a matter of dirtbags and black holes. Somebody stood in a nuclear pond knee deep in muck and said "blue" and the next thing you know entire galaxies were being sucked into boxes. You can straighten this out by touching the subject's gonads - so obviously women can't do this until they get in the right body. well maybe Jamie Lee Curtis can but that's a result more of the bad glens again. Once you get the right bard through the right kind of field you will find that just ignoring it won't be enough to make it go away. This is exactly the point. Once you trace back the genetic make-up that blew out of the rickshaws like a line of bubbles going pop pop pop you end up with something like a god.

Gimmee money.

 

[Zinjifar]

Believe me, I'm not trying to convince a Scientologist Just suggesting that it's this acceptance of tendentious and flawed concepts and taxonomies that *makes* a person a Scientologist.

If you want to say that 'Case' is a *description* of a set of qualities or attributes, I'll go along with the gag and agree that there is a 'Case' as a *description*. A particularly hinky and tendentious and truncated description of the marvelously broad and marvelous human condition, but, still, there is a 'Case'.

To take it out of the clammy arena, I have some of the same objections to the term 'meme', which, as a metaphor for the viral transmission of information has some value. But, once you start treating 'memes' as things floating around in the physical atmosphere it's time to find the butterfly net.

Zinj

 

[Escalus]

Memes are handled by running the squod off the lime. You do this by repeatedly holding onto the jellum and asking the subject if he's Frank yet. then when you get globules coming up from the left ear, meme blows.

 

[Zinjifar]

Memes are handled by running the squod off the lime. You do this by repeatedly holding onto the jellum and asking the subject if he's Frank yet. then when you get globules coming up from the left ear, meme blows.

How does this tie in with frazimmling the frumpistan? Will there be a quiz? Star Rated?

Zinj

 

[Tanstaafl]

You're all nuts.

Everybody knows if you run your bards through the glens you get Shakespeare, but if you were to run the bards through the dales you'd have something earlier up the escalator like Thucydides or something. Anyway it's a matter of dirtbags and black holes. Somebody stood in a nuclear pond knee deep in muck and said "blue" and the next thing you know entire galaxies were being sucked into boxes. You can straighten this out by touching the subject's gonads - so obviously women can't do this until they get in the right body. well maybe Jamie Lee Curtis can but that's a result more of the bad glens again. Once you get the right bard through the right kind of field you will find that just ignoring it won't be enough to make it go away. This is exactly the point. Once you trace back the genetic make-up that blew out of the rickshaws like a line of bubbles going pop pop pop you end up with something like a god.

Gimmee money.

At last! A post that makes sense!
I can feel it - we're close to finding the answer to life the universe and everything.

 

[Tanstaafl]

Believe me, I'm not trying to convince a Scientologist Just suggesting that it's this acceptance of tendentious and flawed concepts and taxonomies that *makes* a person a Scientologist.

If you want to say that 'Case' is a *description* of a set of qualities or attributes, I'll go along with the gag and agree that there is a 'Case' as a *description*. A particularly hinky and tendentious and truncated description of the marvelously broad and marvelous human condition, but, still, there is a 'Case'.

To take it out of the clammy arena, I have some of the same objections to the term 'meme', which, as a metaphor for the viral transmission of information has some value. But, once you start treating 'memes' as things floating around in the physical atmosphere it's time to find the butterfly net.

Zinj

Okey dokey, Zinj.

 

[Escalus]

That'll be $210,987

 

[Tanstaafl]

That'll be $210,987

Have you got change for a plip-plop?

 

[Escalus]

Have you got change for a plip-plop?

OUTNESS! HCO bring order!!

 

[Tanstaafl]

OUTNESS! HCO bring order!!

No need to be like that, it was just a misunderstanding.

You see, when you ftumched by previous glopple I interfrastically redoppled my splodgett. This resulted in me having to extricate my cordwangle from the splunge.

Sorted!

 

[Zinjifar]

"We are The Scientific People," Joseph said. "I am Joseph;
these are my brethren."

He gestured. Foyle gazed at the grinning crowd surrounding
his litter. All faces were tattooed into devil masks; all brows had
names blazoned across them.

"How long did you drift?" Joseph asked.

"Vorga," Foyle mumbled.

"You are the first to arrive alive in fifty years. You are a puissant
man. Very. Arrival of the fittest is the doctrine of Holy Dar¬
win. Most scientific."

"Quant Suff!" the crowd bellowed.

Joseph seized Foyle's elbow in the manner of a physician tak-
ing a pulse. His devil mouth counted solemnly up to ninety-eight.

"Your pulse. Ninety-eight-point-six," Joseph said, producing
a thermometer and shaking it reverently. "Most scientific."

"Quant Suff!" came the chorus.

Joseph proffered an Erlenmeyer flask. It was labeled: Lung,
Cat, c.s., hematoxylin & eosin. "Vitamin?" Joseph inquired.

When Foyle did not respond, Joseph removed a large pill
from the flask, placed it in the bowl of a pipe, and lit it. He puffed
once and then gestured. Three girls appeared before Foyle. Their
faces were hideously tattooed. Across each brow was a name:
JOAN and MOIRA and POLLY. The "0" of each name had a tiny
cross at the base .

"Choose," Joseph said. "The Scientific People practice Natural
Selection. Be scientific in your choice. Be genetic."

As Foyle fainted again, his arm slid off the litter and glanced
against Moira.

"Quant Suff!"

Zinj

 

[alex]

This is where Scientology departed from the Eastern approach to spirituality. Take a look at the following article from the perspective of a free being:

THE ESSENCE OF HINDUISM

What is most telling is the following excerpt:

"The goal of worldly desire, the glittering objects for which all men long, the celestial pleasures they hope to gain by religious rites, the most sought-after of miraculous powers -- last but till the morrow."

Not understood, this would only lead to failure in one’s desire to be an OT

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Yes what went wrong with the idea of OT was that we tried to define it in terms of space time and energy rather than as the creator of such. And then judged it thus, rather than in terms of awareness, love and potential.

alex

 

[Snuffy]

We all have tracks going back both in East and West. An exception could be "rednecks."

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Their track only goes South.

 

[Hanover Fist]

An exception could be "rednecks."

I gotta ask Vinaire, what do you mean by rednecks? I have seen you use this epithet a number of times now and I just would like a bit of clarification.

Hanover Fist

 

[Vinaire]

I gotta ask Vinaire, what do you mean by rednecks? I have seen you use this epithet a number of times now and I just would like a bit of clarification.

Hanover Fist

Before I explain that, I have to ask you first,

"What color is your neck?"
"Are you by any chance American?"
"Have you ever lived in the South?"

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