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Introduction from a newbie.

M

Moonchild

Patron with Honors
Hello all.

I've just recently joined this board and would like to offer a little about myself beyond my profile.

To keep it reasonably brief...I attested "Natural Clear" in the summer of 1980, which I now discover is considered a virtual "impossibilty"...however, at that moment, I experienced a release of charge...a total re-energisation of myself, some of which has persisted to the present day. Maybe it was just a "release-point"? If so, it was a tremendous one...the stuff of which "success-stories " are made. My earlier history in Scn was miserable and depressing; maybe attesting put me into ARC with the area and hence, the release of which I speak.

Did the "Purif" in autumn 1980, had wins and cogs on that, and promptly proceeded to the Student Hat, on which I was an "F/Ning student" throughout.

All of this was in the London Foundation at 68 Tottenham Ct. Rd. 01-580-3601 as it then was.

Had financial issues i.e., no money...in debt, (surprise!) and just had to get back to the small formality of earning some dosh.

In 1983, various issues in life persuaded me to go back on lines...was invited to do "OT Preps" at Saint Hill EG.

At the conclusion of this, I was "cordially invited" to pay in for OT1-3 and get started on same. However, I had reservations. Just didn't feel right..the "why" is perhaps for another discussion.

So...I expressed my feelings and these were not well-received; got carted-off to the MAA via a rather unpleasant interview with someone or other, and the upshot was that I was virtually bludgeoned into signing-up for the PTS/SP Detection R&H course.

I limped back, tail between legs to the London Foundation....I think I'd been labelled "DB", and eventually we managed to agree that there was no way I was going back on lines ( my choice, not theirs) and as a "way out", I agreed to use the money in my account to buy the "Philadelphia Doctorate Course"...a bunch of audio cassettes in those days.... rather than be doomed/damned forever....

Despite many 'phone calls from Ldn Foundation and SH...you know :eyeroll: ?...never went back.

But still can't get the whole shebang out of my mind. Not that I'm a "tortured being" or anything but I still cling to the belief that there is much of value in Scientology, whatever its sins. In fact I know there is....but how to reconnect? Who can I trust? There seems to be much dissension even in the "Independent Field".

Just wanted to say all this to "de-mystify" myself; expect you've heard similar before....hope I haven't bored y'all too much.

In time, if I manage to settle-in here would be nice to hook-up with any old chums from no. 68 that might be around.

Thanks for reading....ARC M.
 
Tom of Helatrobus

Tom of Helatrobus

Patron Meritorious
Welcome to ESMB Moonchild!

You know, I had the same thing about clinging to the idea that Scientology might have SOME value to it. I explored it a bit and wrote some on it. One links in my signature lines is the result of that. There was a lot of Power of Positive thinking type stuff that I really liked from Scientology. Even the idea that you can change your moods by will, of course it doesn't always work. But stuff like that.

If your more into the tech, then Freezone is the way to go. There are Freezoners everywhere (not me though) who would love to talk with you about standard tech or squirrel tech - what ever you like!

Good Luck. I hope you find what you are looking for.
 
gomorrhan

gomorrhan

Gold Meritorious Patron
Thanks for the summary. It is true that there is dissension in the independent field. This is actually evidence of FREEDOM to dissent. It might make it hard to decide who you can trust, but I think it's better than a whitewash or PR job, or bogus qualifications. Your best bet is to trust yourself, ask a lot of questions, and figure out who you think isn't talking out of their ass. My assessment of the situation, back when I first got out, and read all the stuff I could find, was that David Mayo seemed to have the right of it. He started the Advanced Ability Centers, which delivered Scientology outside the Church until they were harassed and sued out of existence. Later, he worked with Sarge Gerbode and several others to create the subject of metapsychology, and then he bowed out of the scene in 1994/1995, probably as part of a settlement with the Church. That subject, metapsychology, has a lot of differences from scientology, so many and so profound that they really are different subjects, but there are striking similarities in the area of the Grades, and in the way that the session is run.

Have you read the critical books? Messiah or Madman, Piece of Blue Sky, that sort of thing? If not, I'd advise it, because it might give you pause about involving yourself with scientology again. Personally, I think that scientology has some toxic elements that I can't tolerate, but that there are also some very interesting and useful things, like the logics, the axioms, the TRs, and a lot of the grades processes. If you really want to foray strictly back into scientology, I'd suggest you might want to have a look at the ClearBird website, which is LOADED with information, checksheets, you name it. It has the added advantage of being free, without membership needed. All you might want to do is find a co-auditor, and a supervisor of your training to work with (BB/Terril can probably help you find that), and you could do the whole Bridge, other than the OT levels (which I think are toxic), without paying a cent to an auditor, other than for review, if there was some trouble (students run into trouble: it's part of how we learn!). http://freezoneamerica.com/Clearbird/Clearbird2004/index.htm
 
Boldgirl

Boldgirl

Patron Meritorious
Hello Moonchild,

I am pretty new myself.

Watch out though...there is still kool aid being given out for 'free' here in this here 'zone'. Read first, I still am..there is so much. Decide if SCN truly has value. Then decide if you feel having an unlicensed 'mind practitioner' (SCN auditors) is the way to go.

I am amazed at the 'underworld' that exists.

I have also been tremendously helped by the people who write in these forums...it has been riveting, and captivating and has helped me to really look at things with my own opinions. They have all helped me to feel myself again.

Have fun.
 
Mark A. Baker

Mark A. Baker

Sponsor
gomorrhan said:
Thanks for the summary. It is true that there is dissension in the independent field. This is actually evidence of FREEDOM to dissent.
Click to expand...

In addition to numerous TIR (Traumatic Incident Reduction) & Metapsychology practioners in England there are several highly regarded freezone & independent groups & auditors.

The lists below contain a few such:

http://internationalfreezone.org/certifiedauditor.shtml

http://internationalfreezone.org/auditor.shtml

Ron's Org UK:
http://www.arovast.co.uk/

Ron's Org International:
http://www.ronsorg.com/


Mark A. Baker
 
Neo

Neo

Silver Meritorious Patron
Moonchild said:
Just wanted to say all this to "de-mystify" myself; expect you've heard similar before....hope I haven't bored y'all too much.
Click to expand...


Whether we've heard similar before, or not, we haven't heard your story. And I would guess that it's unique enough to be told. Don't sell yourself short :)

Reading peoples true experiences in Scientology helps me see past all the PR nonsense. I have my own experiences (which I haven't told yet, but will one day), but I have an emotional involvement in my own story that can cloud my judgment.

So reading your story, and others is very helpful. :)
 
Pixie

Pixie

Crusader
Welcome Moonchild. My personal advice is to take your time first of all, and above all, listen to your OWN advice. All the answers you seek are within yourself after all at the end of the day, you are after all an individual are you not. It is sometimes difficult to get an unbaised viewpoint as most that are now out, have had extremes of experiences inside the 'church'. Those that are still 'inside' the church, have been stripped of their critical thinking faculties but cannot see it as this is what it's designed to do. Hubbard pertaining to be 'Source' after all. I think the best way to go is to read some books, Messiah or Madman being the first and anything by David Mayo as he was around with Hubbard from the start. People here can only speak from their own experiences, and from what I've read so far, their lives inside the 'church' were nothing short of torture. I am pretty new here too and although this forum has helped me a great deal and in such a short space of time, I feel still unable to write my own personal story as there is still too much emotion involved, and when human 'emotion' is not encouraged within the 'church' particularly when you are on staff, there is, for me anyway, a build up which has to be diffused. Spending almost twenty years acting and thinking like a robot has made it difficult for me to be a normal human again with my OWN viewpoints in life as well as reconnecting with my normal 'human' emotions.

Personaly, if I were to come into this or any other similar forum without any knowledge of scientology, I for sure could not bring myself to even read anything this man wrote never mind study and apply it. Read people's stories, especially those who were working close to Hubbard on the ship, I think, or at least I hope this will be enough for you to make an instinctive desicion. When an organization is set up with an undercurrent of telling you that there's something wrong with you in the first place, that something about you needs 'fixed', I hear warning bells, just like you did when they tried to sell you the 'OT' package. Do this again, use your own instinct. You will hear and read all sorts of opinions both here and elsewhere, but they don't have to be your opinions. We are all individuals are we not, we are also, each and every single one of us, unique, therefore, how on earth can one persons 'theory' sort all these individuals 'problems' out? It's up to us to find our own path, and perhaps that's the problem, why do we .. any of us feel we need a 'path' in the first place? If indeed we all for example just lived in the 'now', we may not feel the need to search or strive for anything, perhaps we'd be happier just to.. be. I hope this helps you somewhat, and I hope you find what you're looking for.
 
Free to shine

Free to shine

Shiny & Free
Pixie said:
Welcome Moonchild. My personal advice is to take your time first of all, and above all, listen to your OWN advice. All the answers you seek are within yourself after all at the end of the day, you are after all an individual are you not. It is sometimes difficult to get an unbaised viewpoint as most that are now out, have had extremes of experiences inside the 'church'. Those that are still 'inside' the church, have been stripped of their critical thinking faculties but cannot see it as this is what it's designed to do. Hubbard pertaining to be 'Source' after all. I think the best way to go is to read some books, Messiah or Madman being the first and anything by David Mayo as he was around with Hubbard from the start. People here can only speak from their own experiences, and from what I've read so far, their lives inside the 'church' were nothing short of torture. I am pretty new here too and although this forum has helped me a great deal and in such a short space of time, I feel still unable to write my own personal story as there is still too much emotion involved, and when human 'emotion' is not encouraged within the 'church' particularly when you are on staff, there is, for me anyway, a build up which has to be diffused. Spending almost twenty years acting and thinking like a robot has made it difficult for me to be a normal human again with my OWN viewpoints in life as well as reconnecting with my normal 'human' emotions.

Personaly, if I were to come into this or any other similar forum without any knowledge of scientology, I for sure could not bring myself to even read anything this man wrote never mind study and apply it. Read people's stories, especially those who were working close to Hubbard on the ship, I think, or at least I hope this will be enough for you to make an instinctive desicion. When an organization is set up with an undercurrent of telling you that there's something wrong with you in the first place, that something about you needs 'fixed', I hear warning bells, just like you did when they tried to sell you the 'OT' package. Do this again, use your own instinct. You will hear and read all sorts of opinions both here and elsewhere, but they don't have to be your opinions. We are all individuals are we not, we are also, each and every single one of us, unique, therefore, how on earth can one persons 'theory' sort all these individuals 'problems' out? It's up to us to find our own path, and perhaps that's the problem, why do we .. any of us feel we need a 'path' in the first place? If indeed we all for example just lived in the 'now', we may not feel the need to search or strive for anything, perhaps we'd be happier just to.. be. I hope this helps you somewhat, and I hope you find what you're looking for.
Click to expand...

Excellent advice Pixie! :clap:
 
gomorrhan

gomorrhan

Gold Meritorious Patron
This may be true, Paul, but he did say "highly regarded", whereas I think you are "regarded as high".

Just kidding.
 
Dulloldfart

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
gomorrhan said:
This may be true, Paul, but he did say "highly regarded", whereas I think you are "regarded as high".

Just kidding.
Click to expand...

I meant "then" in the sense of "on the other hand".

No need to say you're kidding. I know many think what I do is preposterous.

Paul
 
gomorrhan

gomorrhan

Gold Meritorious Patron
What the Wright Brothers did was also thought of as preposterous. Drive on with your bad self.
 
M

Moonchild

Patron with Honors
Thanks to all for the replies, welcomes and advice. Some of the links have proved helpful and thought-provoking already, which is what I was hoping for.

"Rub and Yawn" eh? Well....why not? If it works, it works. Will continue to browse.

Should mention, I have in fact read "Piece of Blue Sky" and "Bare-faced Messiah" (both of which I take seriously) as well as a whole bunch of stuff on-line, much of which I don't; seems to me that a lot of the black PR on the 'net comes from folk who wouldn't know Scn from, erm....well.....a clambake? :duh:
 
Pixie

Pixie

Crusader
Moonchild said:
Thanks to all for the replies, welcomes and advice. Some of the links have proved helpful and thought-provoking already, which is what I was hoping for.

"Rub and Yawn" eh? Well....why not? If it works, it works. Will continue to browse.

Should mention, I have in fact read "Piece of Blue Sky" and "Bare-faced Messiah" (both of which I take seriously) as well as a whole bunch of stuff on-line, much of which I don't; seems to me that a lot of the black PR on the 'net comes from folk who wouldn't know Scn from, erm....well.....a clambake? :duh:
Click to expand...

Yes, good one Moonchild. Most of the 'actual facts' are when you read all the personal stories, and for the skeptic, there are way too many consistencies for it all to be 'made up'. I wish they were made up as they are nothing short of heartwrenching, inhumane torture not to mention blatant disgregard for basic human rights.

Glad you've read those books already, that should be enough for you to decide what to do for yourself. I've been trying to go.. 'somewhere' all my life, but lately, I'm realizing that there isn't really anywhere TO go. The best place, for me anyhow, is just right here. The problems only loom when I'm trying to 'go somewhere', or 'gain' something, or 'loose' something I don't like about myself which is really kind of crazy really, and while I stay in the 'flow', everything just seem to fall into place. Look forward to more of your posts Moonchild.. :thumbsup:
 
Wisened One

Wisened One

Crusader
Welcome, Welcome, Moonchild! :)

I look forward to reading your experiences....Finding boards like ESMB has been instrumental for me gaining more and more sanity, personal strength and ability to sort out everything about my own experiences. (Hubby and I were Div 6'er at a Class V Org in early to mid nineties..our stories are in 'Leaving The Church' thread).

Keep posting and reading! :thumbsup:
 
Voltaire's Child

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
I greatly prefer iced tea with extra lemon and sweet n low to "koolaid"...though it has been said you're never too old for Koolaid...
 
T

The Oracle

Gold Meritorious Patron
Moonchild said:
Hello all.

I've just recently joined this board and would like to offer a little about myself beyond my profile.

To keep it reasonably brief...I attested "Natural Clear" in the summer of 1980, which I now discover is considered a virtual "impossibilty"...however, at that moment, I experienced a release of charge...a total re-energisation of myself, some of which has persisted to the present day. Maybe it was just a "release-point"? If so, it was a tremendous one...the stuff of which "success-stories " are made. My earlier history in Scn was miserable and depressing; maybe attesting put me into ARC with the area and hence, the release of which I speak.

Did the "Purif" in autumn 1980, had wins and cogs on that, and promptly proceeded to the Student Hat, on which I was an "F/Ning student" throughout.

All of this was in the London Foundation at 68 Tottenham Ct. Rd. 01-580-3601 as it then was.

Had financial issues i.e., no money...in debt, (surprise!) and just had to get back to the small formality of earning some dosh.

In 1983, various issues in life persuaded me to go back on lines...was invited to do "OT Preps" at Saint Hill EG.

At the conclusion of this, I was "cordially invited" to pay in for OT1-3 and get started on same. However, I had reservations. Just didn't feel right..the "why" is perhaps for another discussion.

So...I expressed my feelings and these were not well-received; got carted-off to the MAA via a rather unpleasant interview with someone or other, and the upshot was that I was virtually bludgeoned into signing-up for the PTS/SP Detection R&H course.

I limped back, tail between legs to the London Foundation....I think I'd been labelled "DB", and eventually we managed to agree that there was no way I was going back on lines ( my choice, not theirs) and as a "way out", I agreed to use the money in my account to buy the "Philadelphia Doctorate Course"...a bunch of audio cassettes in those days.... rather than be doomed/damned forever....

Despite many 'phone calls from Ldn Foundation and SH...you know :eyeroll: ?...never went back.

But still can't get the whole shebang out of my mind. Not that I'm a "tortured being" or anything but I still cling to the belief that there is much of value in Scientology, whatever its sins. In fact I know there is....but how to reconnect? Who can I trust? There seems to be much dissension even in the "Independent Field".

Just wanted to say all this to "de-mystify" myself; expect you've heard similar before....hope I haven't bored y'all too much.

In time, if I manage to settle-in here would be nice to hook-up with any old chums from no. 68 that might be around.

Thanks for reading....ARC M.
Click to expand...


Don't concern yourself.

I really was a DB when I signed up for my first course, HQS.

Although most people saw it as cute because I had just turned 16.

Sixteen year olds can get away with being DB's.

Now I am solo auditing.

It took me 35 years to get here and I wasn't any kind of clear when I started.

Time goes on forever and you have to be doing something it.

You can be, do or have whatever you want.

Oddly, it sounds like you had an SP on your lines forcing you to do the SP course!

Stranger things have happened!

I did the sp pts detection course under orders too, as public, I hated every minute of it as it really put a damper on my party mood. But once I was done with it I was glad I did it. When I was in the Sea Org it had been removed from all the Sea Org members hat packs, so nobody there knew what suppression was but me. Because I had done it I remained un pts while watching entire orgs fold. O.K. course it did bug people if I wrote a KR saying, "Hey, such and such Commanding Officer is an SP." I guess none of them had done pro tr's either because they really got disturbed just about a KR about an sp.

I'll never regret my years as a DB.

You develope extra perceptions like animals. Learn to see in the dark and know what is behind you without turning around and things like that.

The good thing about having been a db is that I am undegradable now. It's like a vaccine. People try to dergrade me now once in a while by saying something or doing something and I don't go anywhere but with the flow, and then they get a puzzled look on their face. It kind of spooks them.

Welcome to ESMB, the greatest talent show on the internet and a good spot for a few laughs about it all.

Whatever we weren't there, most of us are lucky at love.

http://music.clevver.com/video/31854/mick-jagger-lucky-in-love.php

T.O.
 
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