Scientologist attacking other scientologists

[Leland]

I had to leave scientology because some within the hierarchy of the cult spiritually attacked me.

Some here, may laugh at this.

IMO, due to OT 7......this spiritual attacking is possible.

AS AN EXAMPLE: (but not why I left the cult)

I was hanging out with a friend one day, a well known Field Auditor and C/S in Los Angeles.

He had been on OT 7 for awhile....(years).

We were at his new apartment, in the Valley.....and he stated that he had to go "into session." He proceeded to go upstairs to do a session.

I remained downstairs....and hung out.

Shortly there after....I perceived a "beam" come down at an angle, from upstairs....and "fish" around in my space......"find" something.....and "altered it."

I won't go into details about what exactly happened to me. But of course, I thought my friend upstairs had done this.

IMO, those on OT 7.....are kinda playing at "Wild wild west" and cowboying.......and doing as they choose...as far as "auditing things in their space."

IMO, Upper Level, and the Cult in general have made a grave error.....and don't really understand the ramifications of what they are doing....and have made some major errors in their OT 7 technology.

IMO, I don't think OT 7's or the Cult....or the Courses that the Cult teaches......really understand about a singular individual's space....or what a person's space is.....

IMO, the cult is in the process of causing a Spiritual Holocaust ......with there OT 7s auditing the technology that they are practising.

IMO , this could be a reason, that some are soooo angry at the cult....but might not realize why. (just my opinion)

IMO, so say that those that have left, perhaps won't come out against the Cult....due to family members and such still in. Sure that is possible. But IMO some are scared to talk about the Cult....and it is because of what I have posted above.

I in no way think that OT 7's "auditiing" can "bring down the Berlin Wall" of some such nonsense. But I do think, that they can attack SOME individuals and or manipulate some individuals..on a personal level, spiritually, adversely........ And this must be stopped.

 

[La La Lou Lou]

I had to leave scientology because some within the hierarchy of the cult spiritually attacked me.

Some here, may laugh at this.

IMO, due to OT 7......this spiritual attacking is possible.

AS AN EXAMPLE: (but not why I left the cult)

I was hanging out with a friend one day, a well known Field Auditor and C/S in Los Angeles.

He had been on OT 7 for awhile....(years).

We were at his new apartment, in the Valley.....and he stated that he had to go "into session." He proceeded to go upstairs to do a session.

I remained downstairs....and hung out.

Shortly there after....I perceived a "beam" come down at an angle, from upstairs....and "fish" around in my space......"find" something.....and "altered it."

I won't go into details about what exactly happened to me. But of course, I thought my friend upstairs had done this.

IMO, those on OT 7.....are kinda playing at "Wild wild west" and cowboying.......and doing as they choose...as far as "auditing things in their space."

IMO, Upper Level, and the Cult in general have made a grave error.....and don't really understand the ramifications of what they are doing....and have made some major errors in their OT 7 technology.

IMO, I don't think OT 7's or the Cult....or the Courses that the Cult teaches......really understand about a singular individual's space....or what a person's space is.....

IMO, the cult is in the process of causing a Spiritual Holocaust ......with there OT 7s auditing the technology that they are practising.

IMO , this could be a reason, that some are soooo angry at the cult....but might not realize why. (just my opinion)

IMO, so say that those that have left, perhaps won't come out against the Cult....due to family members and such still in. Sure that is possible. But IMO some are scared to talk about the Cult....and it is because of what I have posted above.

I in no way think that OT 7's "auditiing" can "bring down the Berlin Wall" of some such nonsense. But I do think, that they can attack SOME individuals and or manipulate some individuals..on a personal level, spiritually, adversely........ And this must be stopped.

I thought OT 7 and 8 were all about BTs?

I don't think there's anything in their teck that would enable them to fiddle around in your mind, I'm not saying that you didn't feel something, but then I think we can all be aware of when someone is thinking about us, I just don't believe they have any oaty powers.

 

[arcxcauseblows]

I've had very similar things happen

This combined with the abuse of critics and disrespect for homo sapiens in general, to be forcefully replaced with homo novis is a big red flag

 

[Leland]

It is my opinion that there is a Secret Cult,,,,,within the Cult of Scientology.

IMO, one of the avenues of attack, that this secret group, within the C of $ uses.....is to attack one's sexuality.

For me.....as a heterosexual man.....that was to try to "spiritually sodomize" me....And or shove stuff "down my throat," as in some sort of spiritual " falacio."

Another avenue of attack.....was to try to get me, as a spiritual being to "eat."

IMO....this Secret Cult within the Cult of Scientology......"thinks" that there can ONLY be one "Man" or "Male Figure" within Scientoloty.

AND that all others.....must therefore, not be heterosexual males.....but rather homosexual males....or women.

 

[Leland]

I thought OT 7 and 8 were all about BTs?

I don't think there's anything in their teck that would enable them to fiddle around in your mind, I'm not saying that you didn't feel something, but then I think we can all be aware of when someone is thinking about us, I just don't believe they have any oaty powers.

Well, I don't really know or understand HOW it is done.

Was I made to "see" another's picture?

Was it another's "theta body" doing it.

Are there certain "Main BT's" that upper level scientologist know about....that can be programed to harm an individual....or that can be manipulated in some way to harm an individiual?

All I know is that I was fine for 45 years....and then some REALLY weird shit started to happen.

And I don't know how to combat it.....effectively.

Some here might say, well, he's had a pyschotic break or gone off his rocker.......I just don't think this is the case.

But I do think that this is one of the purposes of these attacks.....to drive people crazy.

 

[Leland]

Not to de-rail my own thread....

But, I just don't see how it is possible to audit for 5, or 7 or 10 or 12 or 15 YEARS on OT 7........and then come to ESMB and say "well, its all a bunch of shit."


That just is too much for me to believe.

Something else is going on IMO.

 

[Leland]

Not that I know much about this person...or have read much about what he went through.....BUT

Ken Ogger, if I am not mistake, did write that he was attacked with sodomy.....and he was found dead. (thought I believe he stated he was drugged and it really happened to his physical body.)

at the bottom of a swimming pool, with cinder blocks tied around his ankles with duct tape.

There have been some others that have talked about this also, though I haven't taken notes about it.

 

[Good twin]

their

 

[Leland]

And would like to point out that Debbie Cook, former CO of Flag....stated in her sworn Court Testimony.....that she was made to wear a sign that said Lesbian.

Not that this is the same thing as I'm posting above.....BUT

It is attacking ones sexuality....

When has this ever happened within Scientolgoy? HubTub....as far as I know, didn't even come up with this tactic, or method, or button....to cave someone in.

IMO it is something "new."

 

[Dean Blair]

I was a NOTS auditor and CS for many years. I audited and C/Sed people on the levels that deal with BTs and Clusters. I believed in it and thought that it was a workable technology. We used to handle BTs and Clusters in the body, on the body, and various distances from the body. You could put your attention on someone far away and locate one of these BTs and then handle it until it realized something and left.

The main thing here in my opinion is that agreement with L Ron Hubbard's delusion that all of these body thetans and clusters exist in the first place makes you susceptible to being the effect of them. One can mock up an infinity of BTs and Clusters. You can imagine them or mock them up, grant "beingness" to them, agree with Hubbard and all of the OTs that they exist, and you will then become effect of it all.

Voodoo in Haiti works in much the same way. The Haitians believe in it and are in agreement with it so when someone puts a curse on them, creates a doll in their likeness, and then sticks pins in it the person goes effect. If one were to make this doll in my likeness and stuck pins in it nothing would happen because I don't agree with it and don't believe in Voodoo.

Having been an Oat Tee for a very long time I have concluded that it is all false data and a fraud that L Ron Hubbard got us to agree with.

About four years ago I started to look at this in a new unit of time and realized that it was all bullshit. I don't believe in BTs and Clusters. I did believe in it at one time and because of that I could be affected by things such as you have mentioned in your post. However if you or another were to try and create an effect on me now by focusing your attention on BTs and Clusters in my space it would have absolutely no effect on me or the body. The reason I am no longer affected is that factually BTs and Clusters don't exist and I am no longer in agreement with Hubbard's statements about them.

By you believing in them and assigning truth to this lie you are bringing about a persistence that will continue until you realize you have been tricked, lied to, and coerced into believing in this fraud called Scientology and that includes BTs and Clusters.

 

[Leland]

I was a NOTS auditor and CS for many years. I audited and C/Sed people on the levels that deal with BTs and Clusters. I believed in it and thought that it was a workable technology. We used to handle BTs and Clusters in the body, on the body, and various distances from the body. You could put your attention on someone far away and locate one of these BTs and then handle it until it realized something and left.

The main thing here in my opinion is that agreement with L Ron Hubbard's delusion that all of these body thetans and clusters exist in the first place makes you susceptible to being the effect of them. One can mock up an infinity of BTs and Clusters. You can imagine them or mock them up, grant "beingness" to them, agree with Hubbard and all of the OTs that they exist, and you will then become effect of it all.

Voodoo in Haiti works in much the same way. The Haitians believe in it and are in agreement with it so when someone puts a curse on them, creates a doll in their likeness, and then sticks pins in it the person goes effect. If one were to make this doll in my likeness and stuck pins in it nothing would happen because I don't agree with it and don't believe in Voodoo.

Having been an Oat Tee for a very long time I have concluded that it is all false data and a fraud that L Ron Hubbard got us to agree with.

About four years ago I started to look at this in a new unit of time and realized that it was all bullshit. I don't believe in BTs and Clusters. I did believe in it at one time and because of that I could be affected by things such as you have mentioned in your post. However if you or another were to try and create an effect on me now by focusing your attention on BTs and Clusters in my space it would have absolutely no effect on me or the body. The reason I am no longer affected is that factually BTs and Clusters don't exist and I am no longer in agreement with Hubbard's statements about them.

By you believing in them and assigning truth to this lie you are bringing about a persistence that will continue until you realize you have been tricked, lied to, and coerced into believing in this fraud called Scientology and that includes BTs and Clusters.

Thanks, you could be right about this.

Hoisted by one's own petard .....so to speak. (of course with a lot of help)

 

[Pheryn]

I was a NOTS auditor and CS for many years. I audited and C/Sed people on the levels that deal with BTs and Clusters. I believed in it and thought that it was a workable technology. We used to handle BTs and Clusters in the body, on the body, and various distances from the body. You could put your attention on someone far away and locate one of these BTs and then handle it until it realized something and left.

The main thing here in my opinion is that agreement with L Ron Hubbard's delusion that all of these body thetans and clusters exist in the first place makes you susceptible to being the effect of them. One can mock up an infinity of BTs and Clusters. You can imagine them or mock them up, grant "beingness" to them, agree with Hubbard and all of the OTs that they exist, and you will then become effect of it all.

Voodoo in Haiti works in much the same way. The Haitians believe in it and are in agreement with it so when someone puts a curse on them, creates a doll in their likeness, and then sticks pins in it the person goes effect. If one were to make this doll in my likeness and stuck pins in it nothing would happen because I don't agree with it and don't believe in Voodoo.

Having been an Oat Tee for a very long time I have concluded that it is all false data and a fraud that L Ron Hubbard got us to agree with.

About four years ago I started to look at this in a new unit of time and realized that it was all bullshit. I don't believe in BTs and Clusters. I did believe in it at one time and because of that I could be affected by things such as you have mentioned in your post. However if you or another were to try and create an effect on me now by focusing your attention on BTs and Clusters in my space it would have absolutely no effect on me or the body. The reason I am no longer affected is that factually BTs and Clusters don't exist and I am no longer in agreement with Hubbard's statements about them.

By you believing in them and assigning truth to this lie you are bringing about a persistence that will continue until you realize you have been tricked, lied to, and coerced into believing in this fraud called Scientology and that includes BTs and Clusters.

I think you're exactly right, Dean. This is exactly what I was gonna reply with, although I do believe you said it much better than I could have.

 

[Leland]

The rumors of DM 's anger....punching....and yelling.

The rumors posted here....and joking about his saying SCOHB and Csucker....

are some pointers to what I am saying......

Has DM come to believe that he is the "only" male in scientology?

Has he a method to attack.....(while still in the orgs) anyone that he feels his masculinity is threatened by......and get them to leave.....or cave in? (or put them in the Hole?)

Just using THUGS.....and employing others to use a thug's beingness (on his enemies ) might be a part of this.

 

[Leland]

I think you're exactly right, Dean. This is exactly what I was gonna reply with, although I do believe you said it much better than I could have.

Sure its possible.

But this started in the Summer of 2001.....I was fine until then.

And it has gotten worse....not better.

One would think that 13 YEARS away....and not messing with anything Scientology......this would have calmed down somewhat.....

Of course, I suppose it could be said, that I had a "break down."

But then why did the C of $ send a THUG to the group home I lived in....and tell me to get out now?

And I believe the C of $ orchastrated my being drugged too.

 

[Pheryn]

The rumors of DM 's anger....punching....and yelling.

The rumors posted here....and joking about his saying SCOHB and Csucker....

are some pointers to what I am saying......

Has DM come to believe that he is the "only" male in scientology?

Has he a method to attack.....(while still in the orgs) anyone that he feels his masculinity is threatened by......and get them to leave.....or cave in? (or put them in the Hole?)

Just using THUGS.....and employing others to use a thug's beingness (on his enemies ) might be a part of this.

I'm sure there is a whole host of reasons why DM behaves in the manner that he does. It is my understanding that he's behaved in this way his entire life, he just has power now which seems to have magnified his existing behavior. Hate to over-simplify here, but, I think at it's core it boils down to his own insecurities and projecting them onto others.

 

[Leland]

I'm sure there is a whole host of reasons why DM behaves in the manner that he does. It is my understanding that he's behaved in this way his entire life, he just has power now which seems to have magnified his existing behavior. Hate to over-simplify here, but, I think at it's core it boils down to his own insecurities and projecting them onto others.

I do think you are over-simplifing.....quite a bit.

To put the entire Executive Strata of Scientology in the Hole.....and get away with it.....to me is a bit more complicated than just DM's " insecurities."


It is my opinion, that an OPERATION is being conducted. Now what it is....or how its being done....I don't know. (considering we are talking about the C of $, I don't think this is very far fetched! )

 

[TheSpectator]

I in no way think that OT 7's "auditiing" can "bring down the Berlin Wall" of some such nonsense. But I do think, that they can attack SOME individuals and or manipulate some individuals..on a personal level, spiritually, adversely........ And this must be stopped.

You're welcome to your opinions but don't confuse them as fact.

There's yet to be any objective testing of OTs and their powers. For example, any OT could be an instant millionaire with the James Randi Educational Foundation's "Million Dollar Paranormal Challenge" just by proving his powers.

No, OT VIIs can't attack or manipulate individuals. Most OT VIIs can't even handle their marriages, families, or finances let alone find time to spiritually attack someone!

Don't worry, you're safe.

You should cultivate better critical thinking skills. Skeptoid is a good start.

 

[Dean Blair]

David Miscavige is in a safe environment surrounded by staff members who are not used to experiencing such violence. These staff members have been brainwashed and hobbled by Hubbard's technology and policy letters. As far as I know, no one has ever defended themselves from DM or physically retaliated. Most people are rather civil in their behavior and it is a rare person who is so violent and Psychopathic.

If he were to find himself in a different environment such as a legitimate business or corporation in the "Wog" world, he would utterly fail because the employees would not tolerate it. David would be fired almost immediately and charges would be filed against him for assault. He most likely would also be sued in Civil court for a sum of money.

If David Miscavige were to end up in a prison, things for him would also be a lot different. Should he direct his bullying towards the inmate population they would surely kick his ass. He would have absolutely no altitude in the prison where as in Scientology he does. He would also be surrounded by Sociopaths and Psychopaths who would have no qualms about doing to him the very things he as done to others.

 

[Leland]

After "my accident" and After, IMO a problem had occurred, and it was known about by some in the church...., ( the summer of 2001)

I went to an event, at the Shrine.

I was invited to go there by an OT 8......and we went together. (She was my friend....but I was being manipulated into asking her to marry me. IMO)

When I arrived at the Shrine......and was walking down an aisle to our seats....I saw my FSM, another OT 8

This guy, this OT 8....put out a beam and tried to "hit me with it."

Now, there were hundreds and hundreds of people at this event. I did not see "beams" anywhere.....

But just that one. And that OT 8, looked SHOCKED when I was able to bat it away.


Now there are several possibilities.......

#1. I hallucinated it.

#2..That OT 8 did put out a beam and try to hit me.

#3. That OT 8 did put out a beam toward me, just to see what would happen, what I would do with it.

#4..I did something.....and caused that OT 8 to put out a beam? (don't know about that)

 

[Leland]

David Miscavige is in a safe environment surrounded by staff members who are not used to experiencing such violence. These staff members have been brainwashed and hobbled by Hubbard's technology and policy letters. As far as I know, no one has ever defended themselves from DM or physically retaliated. Most people are rather civil in their behavior and it is a rare person who is so violent and Psychopathic.

If he were to find himself in a different environment such as a legitimate business or corporation in the "Wog" world, he would utterly fail because the employees would not tolerate it. David would be fired almost immediately and charges would be filed against him for assault. He most likely would also be sued in Civil court for a sum of money.

If David Miscavige were to end up in a prison, things for him would also be a lot different. Should he direct his bullying towards the inmate population they would surely kick his ass. He would have absolutely no altitude in the prison where as in Scientology he does. He would also be surrounded by Sociopaths and Psychopaths who would have no qualms about doing to him the very things he as done to others.

If any CO of ANY ORG I have ever been in acted even remotely like the stories ( which I believe) that are told on EXSMB. ......He would be stopped IMO....

To say that he can get away with it....because of this or that policy.....just doesn't hold water IMO

To say other staff are cowed to such an extent.......just blows me away.

The stories about Birthday and Xmas gifts to DB.....PROVES to me that the ENTIRETY of the SO is being GROOMED to "pay homage" to DM. And some are in on it.....and some are not.

Something else is going on IMO.