Blood Church State

[Wants2Talk]

This is a film states that the SS was a religious order practicing a religion. How can the United States justify action against the SS and not the SO?

I know this film is long and no one will probably watch much of it. But even the first few minutes are interesting.

I hope I can find somebody with whom I can discuss parallels between the State of Scientology as described in the HCOPLs and the Nazi Blood Church.

[video=youtube;EYug7hTvI-s]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYug7hTvI-s[/video]

 

[Commander Birdsong]

please, TL, there was a very proper well provoked DoW against the SS. and they could have religious freedom today subject as is CoS to public law

but thanx for the post! cool documentary. lots fim clips i've never seen etc.

there's a lot more on the subject not well known...

 

[Wants2Talk]

Song

Your assessment seems sound. Thanks for watching the video. I know it is long. When I watched it I learned some stuff I did not know about the religious raison d'etre of the third Reich.

There was a quote from Hitler I found interesting. He said something like: "Force without spiritual purpose brings [ruin] (something bad I forget his exact word)".

And I found it interesting that they felt that the "theta" or life force was in the blood. I can see how that could make sense to folks.

I also found it interesting that Fuhrer (Founder) recognized the apparent ruthlessness of his policy of human disposal but felt that the future would thank him for taking responsibility for the dirty work for the sake of mankind. They essentially felt that if they could get the blood-lines purified, mankind could and would return to it's native OT state.

I know that this is not a popular subject. Its very negative and distasteful. But, I am fascinated by the similarities between the Nazi experience and ours.

Look at the crowds. The emotions are genuine. These guys are not saying "I am evil and I want to dominate the word." They are saying: " I am willing to do the greatest good for the greatest number [of dynamics] and save mankind from the dwindling spiral so that our descendents can live as homo-novis."

Hip hip Hurray [Heil Hitler]

 

[Commander Birdsong]

actually i didn't watch the whole thing. yet. i am eager for the chance to do so and i for one won't find it long. i'll be riveted to it. thanx for putting it up

 

[Smilla]

Yes, Nazism was, and is, very much a cult.

 

[Wants2Talk]

Yes, Nazism was, and is, very much a cult.

Yes-but they sincerely believed it was a religion. So scary - disconnection as the "acceptable" gas chamber.

As Cruise said: "Imagine a future with no SPs."

 

[Smilla]

Yes-but they sincerely believed it was a religion. So scary - disconnection as the "acceptable" gas chamber.

As Cruise said: "Imagine a future with no SPs."

It's alive and well today. Not as a mass movement, but with more people involved than most would believe.

 

[Wants2Talk]

It's alive and well today. Not as a mass movement, but with more people involved than most would believe.

One could say: similar to the independents. Or even the SO, I suppose. The use of force is currently politically incorrect.

So "we" must keep the flame alive so that some day in the future [after the collapse of the current power structures] "we" can rise to power and secure the true destiny of man! [Not my voice - just in case someone misreads me]

 

[Smilla]

One could say: similar to the independents. Or even the SO, I suppose. The use of force is currently politically incorrect.

So "we" must keep the flame alive so that some day in the future [after the collapse of the current power structures] "we" can rise to power and secure the true destiny of man! [Not my voice - just in case someone misreads me]

Yeah, that's it.

 

[looker]

Fascinating video. Thanks for putting it in your post.

Yes to me is seems that the common thread is Spiritual destiny, Hope and feeling a part of something bigger than life. In addition, the justification and forgiveness of guilt for victimizing opponents as if they some how deserve it or pulled it in. The hubbard descriptions of SPs and the antisocial personality is similar to Hitlers descrpition of the Jews and Gypsies.

The videos of Hitler are highly interesting. He was a master of controlling an event. The pause at the beginning building to a fever and crescendo. He also had fabulous event planners. Excellent execution organization and visual presentation.

I think I saw somewhere where he had people working the crowds afterwards looking for the ruined, desperate and enthralled. Looking for more recruits who could join and create more recruits.

Really similar.

 

[Wants2Talk]

Fascinating video. Thanks for putting it in your post.

Yes to me is seems that the common thread is Spiritual destiny, Hope and feeling a part of something bigger than life. In addition, the justification and forgiveness of guilt for victimizing opponents as if they some how deserve it or pulled it in. The hubbard descriptions of SPs and the antisocial personality is similar to Hitlers descrpition of the Jews and Gypsies.

The videos of Hitler are highly interesting. He was a master of controlling an event. The pause at the beginning building to a fever and crescendo. He also had fabulous event planners. Excellent execution organization and visual presentation.

I think I saw somewhere where he had people working the crowds afterwards looking for the ruined, desperate and enthralled. Looking for more recruits who could join and create more recruits.

Really similar.

Thank your for taking the time to watch this video and respond with your insight.

I came across this video as I was reading a book on Modern Architectural Theory (60 years old back in school after "getting off track" to save the world, if you know what I mean). It makes reference to many architects,art historians, philosophers and philosophies from the Enlightenment to WWII. I still apply my study tech (hey I can't help it-it works for me) and so when I come across a name, word or idea I don't get, I chase it down. I find getting a face shot of a guy I whose name I need to know helps for example.

So this starts with Ledoux (french architect) and the influence Kant and Rousseau had on him. No this is where it gets interesting. Kant promoted the concept of autonomy. We each get to have our own code, but we must have some code. This duty is the moral price of freedom. This sounds much like self-determinism. Well please note that Kantian autonomy lead to the French revolution which devolved into the Committee of Public Safety and its Reign of Terror - another case where the promise of personal freedom and a perfected state produce the opposite the promise.

It was my purpose to be The Scientology Architect and apply the axioms, factors and logics to the field of architecture. I was going to show the way-the truth that design should align the counter efforts of the environment to the purpose(s) of theta. At 24 during my third time back at school, I was writing my thesis on my flow, ridge, dispersal theory of design. Ofcouse I was

 

[Wants2Talk]

only in 2nd year studio at the time since I had previously left to help Hubbard. Further, asserting the application of the religious philosophy of Scientology to architecture was scoff-able. My professors suggested I find a different major.

Fast forward 35 years (wow-that hurt). Now I am at a point in my studies where I must prepare and defend a thesis - my theory of design. I am now lost -except for my invisible friend, and he is so high so much of the time!

So yes I dreampt of being Hubbard's Albert Speer. Can you imagine-talk about Davey's butt buddy.

Life rescued me from my self-phew.

 

[AnonyMary]

I'm watching it now and will have to do it in segments but I thought readers should know the origin of the film:

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopediaJ

Nazis: The Occult Conspiracy, directed by Tracy Atkinson and Joan Baran, narrated by Malcolm McDowell, is an English language 1998 Discovery Channel documentary regarding Nazi occultism.
[..]
Television and DVD releaseThe documentary was originally shown on television and subsequently released on VHS in the USA on April 6, 1999 by the BMG Distribution and in the UK on 20 Jan 2003 by the Lace International Ltd studio. The running time is 90 minutes.[1]

In Italy the documentary was released on DVD under the title Nazismo: La Cospirazione Occulta in 2003 by Medusa Video.

In Germany the documentary was released on DVD under the title Nazis: Die okkulte Verschwörung on the 8th November 2005 by M.I.B. - Medienvertrieb in Buchholz. The documentary was also shown on TV in a shortened version called Hitlers Mystiker.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazis:_The_Occult_Conspiracy

 

[Div6]

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_occultism

That Hitler was possessed by the devil is also believed by some members of the Catholic Church. Father Gabriele Amorth, an exorcist of the Vatican is "convinced that the Nazis were all possessed. All you have to do is think about what Hitler did. Almost certainly they were possessed by the Devil."[14] There even are documents that state that Pope Pius XII tried to perform an exorcism on Hitler at a distance, but failed.[14]

An argument could be made that it was a "mass dramatization", stemming from the irrational forces that Freud stated abound in every man. Of course, for something to be "dramatized" there has to be an "earlier, similar"....which in the Hubbardien milieu of "bank agreement" would make the R6 and OT III material a prime candidate. In a '61 BC lecture, he made the point that if you want to stimulate "creativity" on a reactive level, just run a massive "cant-have" on a group. Post WWI Germany would fit that bill.


Also, for additional context, the BBC documentary "A Century of Self" shows how at the beginning of the rise of the Nazi's, they were looking to Roosevelt's "New Deal" as a model of social control (governance) going forward. The beginning of Part II has a clip of Anna Freud, discussing how dreams are an entrance to one's "suppressed desires" that sit underneath consciousness "rumbling underneath the surface, like lava in a volcano" (her words, not mine).

[video=google;-678466363224520614]http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-678466363224520614[/video]

 

[Div6]

Century of Self part 1 is here:

[video=google;9167657690296627941]http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=9167657690296627941[/video]

Covers the turn of the century through the End of WW II.

 

[R6Basic]

Thanks for posting this. I have heard that Hitler and the Nazis had occult trappings but never seen anything in depth until now.

 

[Wants2Talk]

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_occultism



Also, for additional context, the BBC documentary "A Century of Self" shows how at the beginning of the rise of the Nazi's, they were looking to Roosevelt's "New Deal" as a model of social control (governance) going forward. The beginning of Part II has a clip of Anna Freud, discussing how dreams are an entrance to one's "suppressed desires" that sit underneath consciousness "rumbling underneath the surface, like lava in a volcano" (her words, not mine).

[video=google;-678466363224520614]http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-678466363224520614[/video]

I am watching the Anna now. Looks interesting. Freud had a close friend who was an architect or art historian. I forget and can't find my bookmark. Tonight I will watch this your video and I will find guy I am thinking of. Damn-this reading stuff is hard.

 

[looker]

Here is a new documentary about the Dollar bill. I find the history of the occult in the United States during the time hubbard was formulating DMSH fascinating.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JI9asFZZ02A&feature=related

 

[BunnySkull]

Yes-but they sincerely believed it was a religion. So scary - disconnection as the "acceptable" gas chamber.

As Cruise said: "Imagine a future with no SPs."

No, the higher ups did not, maybe they convinced the young ones but they were merely intent on inventing Tuetonic alternative religion to the "Jew tainted" Christianity.

I've read countless books on the SS and Nazism. The fact is they decided they needed to "invent" a religion to give some historical basis to Nazism. Most Germans were Christians and they didn't want divided loyalties among the ranks. Most high ranking Nazis were atheists - Bormann, Hilters right hand man, hated Christianity and felt it's removal should be a central aim of nazism.

So they came p with a hodgepodge of occultist stuff, old "Teutonic" lore (much of which they just made up as they went along) and a big focus on "blood" which fitted their needs and idelogy quite well. They even financed many "anthropology" expeditions to try and give some credence to the BS about "Aryans" they were making up - unfortunately most findings merely disproved their theories. Real anthropologists and scientists considered the Nazi research a farce. (They were quite keen on proving Aryans were a super-race, which they descended from, and decided it's origins were to be found in Tibet - things didn't really pan out to well. Also far more has been read into this expedition by conspiracists than was really there - it was not some holy Grail search for Aryan roots.)

The occultism or a Aryan religion of the Nazis was merely an invention to help them consolidate power and give it some historical/religious significance. It's been found again and again you cannot remove a religion from a people with out replacing it with something else. I would argue the Nazis didn't try to replace the church with a blood religion, but with a cult of personality around Hitler. Hitler worship as a cult was far more successful than any blood religion.

I would say of all the Nazis in power Himmler and Hess may have been the only true believers - and they were both considered a bit nutty. Goebbels was happy to use the stuff when it could further his propaganda aims. How they fed this stuff to the lower ranks (esp of the SS) to get them to do their bidding and remain loyal, and how much they ranks actually believed in it, is a matter of debate.

 

[Div6]

<snipped for Brevity>

I would say of all the Nazis in power Himmler and Hess may have been the only true believers - and they were both considered a bit nutty. Goebbels was happy to use the stuff when it could further his propaganda aims. How they fed this stuff to the lower ranks (esp of the SS) to get them to do their bidding and remain loyal, and how much they ranks actually believed in it, is a matter of debate.

The SS were "the chosen ones", anf were mandated to produce as many offspring as possible. With appropriate social engineering to provide women and child care for such unbridled "creativity". With that kind of gig, who sweats the details?