The Little Thread Which Grew - the Apollo '73 to Everything But

[lkwdblds]

Can the models be part of one's "demo kit?"

Cramming Mister!

You need to star rate every copy of Playboy Magazine from day one to present.

Can the Playboy Playmates be part of one's "Demo Kit"? Remember, in the early 70's there was a period where if you were not continuously manipulating and fondling your demo kit, then you would be flunked. The course sup, Scooter Bennett, at CCLA was totally into the demo kit having to always be in action while reading or listening to a tape.

Then do clay demos on ......

after that, at your expense, we'll get you an inflatable doll

There was a joke going around in the 60's before I got "in." The gist of it was if you were in school and someone asked you what you were taking, you would answer, in a totalling serious manner with no laughing, "Braille anatomy, coed Braille anatomy." The other guy might not realize yet that this is a joke and ask that since you are not blind, why are you taking the Braille version of Anatomy and you would answer with a straight face, "I like the lab work of the Braille version of the course better than the course given to sighted people. The other guy would ask what makes the lab work in the Braille class more interesting and you would answer, "Oh, its more hands on, you know, you learn a lot more by groping the real thing than by just looking at it.
Lackey

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

Well, here I am, standing in a line that has to be two hundred feet, waiting for Guy Fieri (from "Diners, Drive Ins, and Dives" on the Food Network) to come out from back stage and sign books, t shirts, etc.

We're at the Wiltern Theater on Wilshire.

In 1964, when I was 13, I saw Bob Dylan here. That was before he was famous. He drew about 600 that night. We sat right up close on the floor in front of the stage. Way back in the dark ages this used to be "the place."

Tonight we saw a show that **just may** be the future of performance art.

There were two opening acts, neither of whom, I had ever heard of. The first guy, whose name I've already forgot, apparently has been on the Today Show. He made a Jamaican jerk sandwich. At least part of my description is true.

The second guy was fantastic. His name was Woody. He's from Oz. He juggled booze bottles and mixed drinks in open glasses. He made some martinis and margaritas. He was phenomenal.

All of this was done with club music driving the show with the beat. Audience members were invited to imbibe and eat what was made.

Guy's act is basically talking some smack, mixing up some food, bantering with the audience, telling tales of his growing up as a chef in training. Guy had a DJ (a local guy) doing appropriate music tracks and mixes to whatever was going on.

The audience was all over the demographic place. Ages ran from 6 to 90. Lots of families - three generations all together. Lots of buddy groups, male and female. It was not like any audience i've ever seen.

and he was LOVED!

Plus Which all through the auditorium, you could smell what was being cooked on stage. Amazing. better than Dolby.

The show is a new concept, to say the least. I think it needs some more work, but I can see this being HUGE.

I went to Altamont, The Monterey Pop Festival, and the Big Sur Folk Festival when I was younger.

Twenty years from now, I'll be able to tell my great grandchildren that I saw the birth of this style of performance. Before it hit Vegas.

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

It is said that just being in the presence of a great healer is healing, or just being in the presence of a great teacher is transformational. Being in the presence of a "big being", in our lingo here. I would add that just having their thoughts rest upon you is pretty damn powerful, too, in my humble experience.

Some of us on this thread have direct personal experience of this! Hi Lakey! It's all about really connecting with someone who is a caring person.


I think that qualifies me as "trustworthy", by this narrow definition! Should we create a secret handshake for the Old Guard?

(This is so the reverse of "never trust anybody over the age of 30" )

That's it, Carmelo! From now we can call you "Scarlet", after the Pimpernel! Male or female, what does it matter, attractive is as attractive does! Carmelo is one attractive being!

S & L,

I was reading on another thread, I thought you were from Riverside, but apparently, you're from Lake Wobegon.

I was going to ask you, and anybody reading this, near the Inland Empire or LA, etc if they need a carpenter, handyman, window installer.

I have a friend, who is mid thirties, with two kids and a wife, who just lost his house to foreclosure in the Central Valley. I've known him for ten years and he's a good hard worker.

Ahhm, he is missing a green card. It seems that when you go through tunnels and sewers to get into the land of the free, sometimes they don't stamp your papers. His kids are citizens, born in the USA (anybody hear The Boss). And soon his mother will have citizenship, which means soon he can apply too.

But right now, he's camped out at his brother's in Riverside looking for work. He had worked for a long time doing window installs for Home Depot, and he did maintenance for apartments for a couple of years.

If anybody has any work that they need done for a reasonable price in a timely professional manner, please PM me.

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

So when "processing" is delivered to a client for the benefit of the organisation, rather than the client, the "processor" and the organisation become greater than the client. This is a negative process and is, in fact, implanting.
Dart

After having left scientology in 1976, I remember being sucked back in for one week in 1979. I went to Flag (The former Jack Tar Hotel), The Fort Harrison. An old sweetie was a Sea Org muckey muck there, and the auditing was supposed to be great.

I gave them $17K. I got there, ate dinner in the restaurant, talked with lots of old friends. The story i heard over and over in an hour was "We gave them money. We got here. They wanted more money."

So the next day I'm told by the DofP that i need to pony up some more bucks before they'll start me. I tell her (with a smile on my face and F/N in my heart) that, "sure, I'll just go home now, earn more money, and come back soon"

After routing out with very good indicators and F/Ns wherever necessary, i flew home, and asked for my money back. And I got it.

Most everybody else just paid some more.

As Mr. Rogers might say, "Can you spell sucker? I knew you could."

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

Blue - I was looking at the "Class" of one's auditor. If an auditor is "Standard", and he or she is runing you on a particular thing such as Dianetics or the Grades 0-IV, I believe it should not make any difference if that auditor is merely that class which is required or of a higher class. Based on what sort of affinity is able to be establish between the pc and the auditor, that could possibly lead to one auditor getting better results than another but the determining cause would not be "class" but rather ARC and standardness of the auditor's TR's and comm cycle.

One area where class could conceivably play a part is if something goes wrong. A higher classed auditor has more tools available to spot the oupoint which occurred, pull out the appropriate list and do the needed correction and do this all "seamlessly" with no jerks and without pulling the pc's attention off the session. When I was only a Dianetic auditor I was not able to do correction lists or fly ruds or pull withholds, etc. and there lingered in the back of my mind the question, what if something goes wrong, what will I do? This probably manifested itself as a bit of uncertainty showing through my TR's.

Probably this is what my former nemises and now respected Class VIII mentor, Don Keeler, probably saw when he pulled me off the interneship and said I lacked certainty. In those days, C/S'es did not tape an auditor's sessions so he could not see me being nervous or apprehensive but he could probably detect it in my after session write ups. Don was perceptive to see that I was nervous and uncertain in worrying about something going wrong.

Since I blew all my charge on Don the other day I will not natter but I believe that without any reactive content involved behind my statement I can still give my opinion that if I had been in his position I think it would have been better if he had gone after improving my certainty in cramming rather than booting me off the course. Anyway, he was the C/S and a Class VIII C/S. no less, and it was his call to make and he made it as he saw fit.

SUMMARY Theoretically, if you get a Class IV action from a fully standard Class IV or a Class VI, VIII, or even a XII, it should not make any difference as to the kind of results you get. If there are differences, the IV can get better results than the VIII and vice versa and if this consistently happens, then if both auditors are standard it would be intangibles which cause the difference to occur. The intangible probably would concern the pc feeling "safer" with one auditor than the other. Safeness could be caused by gender, someone not wishing to discuss their 2D with a person of the opposite sex for example, or "bedside manner" or some intangible such as one of the auditors being an old friend of the family. I hope this helps!
Lakey

When you were in high school, the guys , who bragged most about their sex lives, weren't getting any.

In Scientology, the one(s) who brag most about being Class Xll, are incompetent at auditing "YOU" as a person. He / they can audit cookie cutter stuff.

if you want somebody to help you handle your fear of spiders, then get somebody who is a journeyman -- a person doing it because they like / love to do auditing. It is in their bones... someone, who would audit for free rather than not audit at all.

Don't get somebody who has the cert but doesn't care about you.

-- a cowboy, who is "all hat, no horse"

 

[lkwdblds]

Vintage Carmelo, really priceless posts.

When you were in high school, the guys , who bragged most about their sex lives, weren't getting any.

Yes, you are right! For guys we used the baseball analogy; getting to 1st base meant things went well, the guy held hands with his date and maybe kissed just by smooching with the lips. 2nd base meant heavy "French" kissing and getting to feel the girl's breasts. 3rd base meant reaching each other's genitals with the boy usually getting jacked off by the girl. Hitting a home run, well, we know what that meant.

In many cases, the guy never thought about how the girl viewed things. He just knew that she seemed to like it as much as he did and guys really viewed the whole thing as a conquest. Guys did not have to confront what their partners actual emotions and feelings were, at least not in the initial stages.

In Scientology, the one(s) who brag most about being Class Xll, are incompetent at auditing "YOU" as a person. He / they can audit cookie cutter stuff.

if you want somebody to help you handle your fear of spiders, then get somebody who is a journeyman -- a person doing it because they like / love to do auditing. It is in their bones... someone, who would audit for free rather than not audit at all.

Don't get somebody who has the cert but doesn't care about you.

-- a cowboy, who is "all hat, no horse"

I think that the word journeyman is a great simile for a skilled Class IV, V or VI auditor who just loves auditing people and helping them. I've been very fortunate to have had quite a few of those during my Scn tenure. Ty Dillard, Soo Forbes and Denise Mulkey come to mind. Also, at Flag, Alex Siberski struck me as one of those people. Kenny Lipton was only on the Dianetic Interneship when he gave me my Dianetics and he very much fell into that category. Denise Mulkey was a higher classed auditor who could deliver NOTS. She really was a natural born auditor, I really felt her pervade my space and she was really tuned in to me and what was happening to me in session. It was very safe to be audited by her. She was married to Jerry and they were having marital troubles. At the same time, early 90's they had a young baby. Denise routed off of AOLA lines, her indicators did not look that good. I did not know about the new 2D laws forbidding children in the Sea Org, but that must have hastened her departure. What a great auditor she was/is, and a journeyman to boot.

Your post #502 was a return to our restaurant and entertainment review which we did a few weeks ago. I was going to say a long time ago, it feels like months if not years but is probably less than a month ago. I remember the beautiful Wiltern theater and enjoyed your review of the show and also being made aware that there is new tech coming in entertainment.
This should become a regular activity of this website, tips, recommendations, negative opinions, anything which has to do with eating, entertainment and sports venues which any of you encounter.

Do you have any opinion on the well known class XII who was a top producer at Flag for many years, Pierre? I read a lot of his stuff and learned some things reading his website. The man is obviously extremely intelligent and knows his auditing. His site lists 5000 people whom he has audited by name, a veritable who's who of Scientologists. He tries to maintain a lot of Ethics presence and appears quite aloof but he has the credentials and stats to demand respect. I wrote to him twice and received no answers. Do you believe he audits as a journeyman would audit, even though he is not one?
Lakey

 

[lkwdblds]

Dart's post is incredigle!!

After having left scientology in 1976, I remember being sucked back in for one week in 1979. I went to Flag (The former Jack Tar Hotel), The Fort Harrison. An old sweetie was a Sea Org muckey muck there, and the auditing was supposed to be great.

I gave them $17K. I got there, ate dinner in the restaurant, talked with lots of old friends. The story i heard over and over in an hour was "We gave them money. We got here. They wanted more money."

So the next day I'm told by the DofP that i need to pony up some more bucks before they'll start me. I tell her (with a smile on my face and F/N in my heart) that, "sure, I'll just go home now, earn more money, and come back soon"

After routing out with very good indicators and F/Ns wherever necessary, i flew home, and asked for my money back. And I got it.

Most everybody else just paid some more.

As Mr. Rogers might say, "Can you spell sucker? I knew you could."

Dart's quote is new to me, I find it totally descriptive and completely true! I will be adding that to my vernacular!

Similar to you I went to Flag in late 1977 and had a tech estimate for $12K and scraped together everything I had to come up with the $12K. When I arrived, I was told my new tech estimate was $28 K. I told the story somewhere earlier on this thread. That practice is just "bait and switch" and is actionable in a court of law as committing Fraud. I did not know that all of us were having this done to us.

Whoever was behind this fraudulent practice, I assume it was LRH, sacrificed word of mouth advertising, growth and long term expansion for short term financial gain, severely crippling the finances of the public they were serving. It took a long time, but finally, just over 30 years later, the chickens are coming home to roost. Their reputation is in the gutter, and their academies are empty. Had they delivered to us their product and exchanged in abundance with us the last 30 years, they might well have the 10 million members they are now claiming instead of numbering only 40,000 or 50,000 and inflating it to 10,000,000. A friend of mine, Ken, who did HAS back in early 1971 just as a favor to me to try it out, was recently called on the phone twice and they tried to get him "back in" though he was never "in" in the first place. Of course, in their eyes, he is a Scientologist. Tell him that.
Lakey

 

[Ted]

Do you have any opinion on the well known class XII who was a top producer at Flag for many years, Pierre? I read a lot of his stuff and learned some things reading his website. The man is obviously extremely intelligent and knows his auditing. His site lists 5000 people whom he has audited by name, a veritable who's who of Scientologists. He tries to maintain a lot of Ethics presence and appears quite aloof but he has the credential and stats to demand respect. I wrote to him twice and received no answers. [...]
Lakey

I have read that he travels quite a bit. Write again. If still no response, that is your answer.

 

[lkwdblds]

Good advice, Ted!

I have read that he travels quite a bit. Write again. If still no response, that is your answer.

I think that is excellent advise, Ted and I will write him again. I will be invoking a 3 strikes and you're out rule, another baseball term. Two posts using baseball terms in one day, how about that sports' fans!

I've already done the above action with Tory, when I first came on line in 2005 I replied to her e mail with words of praise for her and then have done some follow up replies, one here on ESMB to a post which she made to the board members. None of perhaps 4 or 5 posts were ever answered so I quit reading her stuff completely or watching any of her videos after her last no-response perhaps 4 months ago. It's really strange because I was at every Org she was at but always just missed her. For example, she was on the CCLA switchboard and was working for Yvonne when I arrived at CCLA, I remember seeing her there but we never spoke. A week or two after she did the switchboard, I was made to work the switch board for a week by the G.O. rep for writing a check with for Org Invoices afther the P.O. committee turned down my Purchase Order 3 weeks in a row. So it went, we were at ASHO within weeks of each other and AOLA as well. I beleive she looks upon herself as a Celebrity now and may have an agent and stuff. More power to her but I ain't going to read or view anybody's stuff if they can't return a post.

One last note, somebody I PMed with, said that Piere received an enormous amount of mail and he has filters on his computer which would filter out posts from a source such as mine as Spam. Whenever he comes out with something on his on again, off again website, I am going to read it but will send no more replies.
Lakey

 

[lkwdblds]

Re: Big Beings

LOL!!! Carmelo's a composite personality! Ar, har har har!

Roger, thanks for chiming in , you are so right about the loaded word "confront" vs, practicing presence, which I think all the Spiritual traditions worldwide adhere to, nurture and foster. Trust Corporate Scientology to get that wrong.

Dart, so good to hear your perspective, always.

It is said that just being in the presence of a great healer is healing, or just being in the presence of a great teacher is transformational. Being in the presence of a "big being", in our lingo here. I would add that just having their thoughts rest upon you is pretty damn powerful, too, in my humble experience.

Some of us on this thread have direct personal experience of this! Hi Lakey! It's all about really connecting with someone who is a caring person.

....Snip,,,,,

(This is so the reverse of "never trust anybody over the age of 30" )

That's it, Carmelo! From now we can call you "Scarlet", after the Pimpernel! Male or female, what does it matter, attractive is as attractive does! Carmelo is one attractive being!

Sweet - Great post. I am glad you are benefiting from some of the "pearls of wisdom" which you are getting here on this thread. We have a great cadre of people of wisdom here who want to share that wisdom with others. This leads to a rise in tone level for all of us.

I wanted to comment of the term "BIG BEING" which is used fairly loosly on this board and around Scientology and ex Scientology in general. To me a BIG BEING HAS TO DO SOMETHING BIG NOT JUST TALK ABOUT IT!

A great example is Gandhi of India, a man of small physical stature was so big as a being that he stood up against the entire British Empire in the 19th century and made them change their policies toward ruling India. He talked, they listened and complied. That man is a BIG BEING! Thomas Edison produced so many inventions that enhanced the lives of billions, he has to qualify. Abe Lincoln saved the union and eliminated slavery. Martin Luther King broke down long standing racial barriers in the South. These are great men and BIG BEINGS.

Just being an armchair philosopher and spewing forth words of wisdom, does not qualify one to stand with the likes of the people I have mentioned above. Even living a life of virtue, raising a family, runing a business, being charitable, etc. are not sufficient to be called a BIG BEING in my opinion. Following such a path and treating others with respect are virtues of greatness or godliness which we can all achieve, BIG BEINGS, AVERAGE SIZE BEINGS and SMALLER BEINGS (The common man who Abe Lincoln cited).

In Scientology, I once considered LRH the biggest being of all but I have abandoned that concept but still consider him a BIG BEING for doing as much as he did and getting as far as he got. He had to have a lot of elan vital or theta endowment to create as big an effect as he did. This brings up the subject of what can happen if a big being goes out of control and pursues courses of action which damage people rather than help them. That is too big of an area to tackle in a post such as this. It would make a great topic for a new thread. Scientology and Hubbard were fortunate enough to attract a lot of BIG BEINGS to them. Its hard to tell who they were because if they got too big, LRH would get rid of them. I don't know, John Mc Masters, Yvonne Jetnzch, maybe Otto Roos, maybe even David Mayo, Ken Urquhart, Jane Kember and people such as that would qualify. I don't have enough first hand info to say for sure one way or another except for Yvonne who I would classify definitely as a BIG BEING! I feel there are several BIG BEINGS here on ESMB. I am not going to name names because it would not be wise to do so. One trait of a true Big Being is that they do not have to be stroked and seek acclaim from others. In C of S, most if not all of them would have left by now. Perhaps some of them are still there but have been reduced from being big beings to a lower state by receiving negative processing or going into agreement with false doctrines.

To summarize the concept it has to do with DOINGNESS, getting things done of a large nature which benefits mankind, usually against fierce oppostion.
Lakey

 

[DartSmohen]

I think that the word journeyman is a great simile for a skilled Class IV, V or VI auditor who just loves auditing people and helping them. I've been very fortunate to have had quite a few of those during my Scn tenure. Ty Dillard, Soo Forbes and Denise Mulkey come to mind. Also, at Flag, Alex Siberski struck me as one of those people. Kenny Lipton was only on the Dianetic Interneship when he gave me my Dianetics and he very much fell into that category. Denise Mulkey was a higher classed auditor who could deliver NOTS. She really was a natural born auditor, I really felt her pervade my space and she was really tuned in to me and what was happening to me in session. It was very safe to be audited by her. She was married to Jerry and they were having marital troubles. At the same time, early 90's they had a young baby. Denise routed off of AOLA lines, her indicators did not look that good. I did not know about the new 2D laws forbidding children in the Sea Org, but that must have hastened her departure. What a great auditor she was/is, and a journeyman to boot.

Your post #502 was a return to our restaurant and entertainment review which we did a few weeks ago. I was going to say a long time ago, it feels like months if not years but is probably less than a month ago. I remember the beautiful Wiltern theater and enjoyed your review of the show and also being made aware that there is new tech coming in entertainment.
This should become a regular activity of this website, tips, recommendations, negative opinions, anything which has to do with eating, entertainment and sports venues which any of you encounter.

Do you have any opinion on the well known class XII who was a top producer at Flag for many years, Pierre? I read a lot of his stuff and learned some things reading his website. The man is obviously extremely intelligent and knows his auditing. His site lists 5000 people whom he has audited by name, a veritable who's who of Scientologists. He tries to maintain a lot of Ethics presence and appears quite aloof but he has the credentials and stats to demand respect. I wrote to him twice and received no answers. Do you believe he audits as a journeyman would audit, even though he is not one?
Lakey

The vast majority of ClX11's I have encountered have been obsessed with their "status". How many of them are actually processing nowadays?

I know a few of them meet as the "Council of X11's", but what do they actually DO?

I remember Alex Sibersky as being touted as "the" person to be processed by. Well, if you look in the book of Case Remedies, what does it say about a pc only wahting to be processed by one auditor? It tells you that the auditor EVALUATES for the client.

So, when Alex came to run me on L 12 (btw, he was a friend of mine), he chose to process me, I did not have to pay any "preference" BS to have him.

Anyway in the middle of the session, (about 3 minutes in) he suddenly tries to tell me what I should be thinking about. I stopped the session and said "Alex, this is me you are processing, don't try any of that eval on me". He stopped, blinked and began apologising. I told him to give me the process concept and I ran it by inspection until it was gone.

After the session I went to Art Webb (D of P) and instructed him to cram Alex on auditor evaluation. This was done forthwith.

I remember arriving at Flag. Boy, were they "antsy". Ron Anderson, Public MAA sat in his office, complete with his SO hat on. I sat down and said "I didn't know you were Jewish". He took his hat off. I told him I had come to do L12, was that all ok with him? He assured me it was.

David Light, in the Reg office, tried to bump me for "setups". I told him I had paid for L12 and that is what I was going to receive. Any "set ups" could come out of the hours I had paid for. Did he have a problem with that?

Er, no, everything was simply fine etc. He remembered me from when I had "visited" Boston org on behalf of Sibersky.

All in all, my L12 trip went very smoothly. I was given an upgrade on my room, sessions were scheduled according to my schedule, everyone was very helpful.

Dart

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

[/B]Do you have any opinion on the well known class XII who was a top producer at Flag for many years, Pierre? I read a lot of his stuff and learned some things reading his website. The man is obviously extremely intelligent and knows his auditing. His site lists 5000 people whom he has audited by name, a veritable who's who of Scientologists. He tries to maintain a lot of Ethics presence and appears quite aloof but he has the credentials and stats to demand respect. I wrote to him twice and received no answers. Do you believe he audits as a journeyman would audit, even though he is not one?
Lakey

I thought my opinion was pretty clear.

Who brags a lot?

Did his most recent high profile brag give him permission to do so?

What category would a high school braggart have been in?

Lakey,

When you were in high school a decade before me, things were very different. The pill had not been released. The chances of a girl getting pregnant were huge. So many girls, older than me, got pregnant and went to Tijuana, Nogales, etc. for abortions. Some more than once. Others had babies in their teens. It was hormones gone wild.

The Ls, to me, are like hormones gone wild. The results are big blow outs. But the real crucial question is : DID YOUR LIFE CHANGE GREATLY FOR THE BETTER AFTER the Ls?"

A lot of people got hooked on that big blow out EP effect. That's OK, but coke, grass, espresso, and wine are a heck of a lot cheaper.

As an old stick in the mud (read this as curmudgeon), tell me how much your abilities to interact with people, your abilities to get things done, your abilities to handle more of your dynamics (that's those other seven) were before and after the Ls.

Personally, I'm more interested in the success stories that are six months after the auditing. The ones where the person details how their actual day to day life has changed.

Co$ success stories are all about how great I feel right this second after my last session, and I want to get out of here (Flag, Freewinds, etc) and go home without any more poking around for more money to be spent.

The good auditors recognize that the PC needs or wants help for a certain area (anything from asthma to work related issues). The PC gets processes based on what they are sitting in.

The cookie cutter auditing that the church promotes is "You need this"- It is upside down.

I got into scientology to help people. I didn't get in to get something fixed for myself (the ruin). But, on the PC side, I was complaining about (what turned out to be) GPMs. The lower level auditing was OK. I got exterior, da da da, but what I wanted handled, I finally found in the blackand white LRH grade six solo course movie. He described to a T what I was looking at, was bothering me, and that I wanted handled. Grade 6 and Clear changed my life forever. I would have gladly paid hundreds of times more for the results of grade six and Clear, if I had known the effects of those levels. It was truly a good ROI (Return On Investment).

Alan Walter has processes that handle what bothered me, that had I gone to his center(s) thirty years after my brush with Scientology, complaining of what I complained about, they would have cleaned me up on the spot.

That is the difference between auditing the person in front of you and auditing the grade chart.

Of course, you can squeeze a lot more money out of the suckers by auditing the grade chart.

 

[lkwdblds]

Awesome post Dart!

The vast majority of ClX11's I have encountered have been obsessed with their "status". How many of them are actually processing nowadays?

I know a few of them meet as the "Council of X11's", but what do they actually DO?

I remember Alex Sibersky as being touted as "the" person to be processed by. Well, if you look in the book of Case Remedies, what does it say about a pc only wahting to be processed by one auditor? It tells you that the auditor EVALUATES for the client.

So, when Alex came to run me on L 12 (btw, he was a friend of mine), he chose to process me, I did not have to pay any "preference" BS to have him.

Anyway in the middle of the session, (about 3 minutes in) he suddenly tries to tell me what I should be thinking about. I stopped the session and said "Alex, this is me you are processing, don't try any of that eval on me". He stopped, blinked and began apologising. I told him to give me the process concept and I ran it by inspection until it was gone.

After the session I went to Art Webb (D of P) and instructed him to cram Alex on auditor evaluation. This was done forthwith.

I remember arriving at Flag. Boy, were they "antsy". Ron Anderson, Public MAA sat in his office, complete with his SO hat on. I sat down and said "I didn't know you were Jewish". He took his hat off. I told him I had come to do L12, was that all ok with him? He assured me it was.

David Light, in the Reg office, tried to bump me for "setups". I told him I had paid for L12 and that is what I was going to receive. Any "set ups" could come out of the hours I had paid for. Did he have a problem with that?

Er, no, everything was simply fine etc. He remembered me from when I had "visited" Boston org on behalf of Sibersky.

All in all, my L12 trip went very smoothly. I was given an upgrade on my room, sessions were scheduled according to my schedule, everyone was very helpful.

Dart

Dart, Thank you for all the inside skinny you posted above as well as the keen incites which you expressed. I must have had Siberski after the cramming cycle on auditor evaluation because I do not remember him evaluating at all for me. The sessions occurred October of 1977 and I do not remember too much about it but if he had evaluated for me, I would have remembered that for sure and I don't so he must have been corrected by then.

Interesting what you mentioned about Class XII's. The only one I ever new was Ron Shaffran who transfered to CCLA with his girlfriend the lovely Linda Power. Ron C/Sed me on my Expanded Dianetics and did a great job!! he also replaced Don Keeler which made me like him. I wrote the pay checks and Ron stood in line to get his check every week and he was very cordial to me. He was back at Flag when I arrived there and I ran into him and Linda in Funchal Madeira while on libs and they both said hi to me and we exchanged small talk for maybe a minute or so. Ron was a down to Earth nice guy and I felt he was an excellent C/S based on the limited information which I had.

That quote of yours which Carmelo cited: "auditor and Org being greater than the pc" is just a fantastic quote. It keeps bearing fruit, the more one thinks about it. Blue Spirit recommends I read your leaving story in a new unit of time and I may do so soon. One time I read about 12 pages into it and felt I had the gist of it and stopped but Blue insists I need to read all 132 pages.

Question of the day, if a Jew is also a Sea Org officer, is he allowed to wear his Sea Org Officer's hat to services in place of the traditional yarmulke?
Lakey

 

[Blue Spirit]

LRH Policy

Dart's quote is new to me, I find it totally descriptive and completely true! I will be adding that to my vernacular!

Similar to you I went to Flag in late 1977 and had a tech estimate for $12K and scraped together everything I had to come up with the $12K. When I arrived, I was told my new tech estimate was $28 K. I told the story somewhere earlier on this thread. That practice is just "bait and switch" and is actionable in a court of law as committing Fraud. I did not know that all of us were having this done to us.

Whoever was behind this fraudulent practice, I assume it was LRH, sacrificed word of mouth advertising, growth and long term expansion for short term financial gain, severely crippling the finances of the public they were serving. It took a long time, but finally, just over 30 years later, the chickens are coming home to roost. Their reputation is in the gutter, and their academies are empty. Had they delivered to us their product and exchanged in abundance with us the last 30 years, they might well have the 10 million members they are now claiming instead of numbering only 40,000 or 50,000 and inflating it to 10,000,000. A friend of mine, Ken, who did HAS back in early 1971 just as a favor to me to try it out, was recently called on the phone twice and they tried to get him "back in" though he was never "in" in the first place. Of course, in their eyes, he is a Scientologist. Tell him that.
Lakey

According to the new poster "Billheichert" on a recent post he said exactly that, Lakey, that it WAS LRH policy to grab for more after the first strained payment. According to LRH's own reference, "GREED is a mental disease."
(I don't have the reference but it stuck in my mind)

 

[Blue Spirit]

NOW YOU TELL ME

I thought my opinion was pretty clear.

Who brags a lot?

Did his most recent high profile brag give him permission to do so?

What category would a high school braggart have been in?

Lakey,

When you were in high school a decade before me, things were very different. The pill had not been released. The chances of a girl getting pregnant were huge. So many girls, older than me, got pregnant and went to Tijuana, Nogales, etc. for abortions. Some more than once. Others had babies in their teens. It was hormones gone wild.

The Ls, to me, are like hormones gone wild. The results are big blow outs. But the real crucial question is : DID YOUR LIFE CHANGE GREATLY FOR THE BETTER AFTER the Ls?"

A lot of people got hooked on that big blow out EP effect. That's OK, but coke, grass, espresso, and wine are a heck of a lot cheaper.

As an old stick in the mud (read this as curmudgeon), tell me how much your abilities to interact with people, your abilities to get things done, your abilities to handle more of your dynamics (that's those other seven) were before and after the Ls.

Personally, I'm more interested in the success stories that are six months after the auditing. The ones where the person details how their actual day to day life has changed.

Co$ success stories are all about how great I feel right this second after my last session, and I want to get out of here (Flag, Freewinds, etc) and go home without any more poking around for more money to be spent.

The good auditors recognize that the PC needs or wants help for a certain area (anything from asthma to work related issues). The PC gets processes based on what they are sitting in.

The cookie cutter auditing that the church promotes is "You need this"- It is upside down.

I got into scientology to help people. I didn't get in to get something fixed for myself (the ruin). But, on the PC side, I was complaining about (what turned out to be) GPMs. The lower level auditing was OK. I got exterior, da da da, but what I wanted handled, I finally found in the blackand white LRH grade six solo course movie. He described to a T what I was looking at, was bothering me, and that I wanted handled. Grade 6 and Clear changed my life forever. I would have gladly paid hundreds of times more for the results of grade six and Clear, if I had known the effects of those levels. It was truly a good ROI (Return On Investment).

Alan Walter has processes that handle what bothered me, that had I gone to his center(s) thirty years after my brush with Scientology, complaining of what I complained about, they would have cleaned me up on the spot.

That is the difference between auditing the person in front of you and auditing the grade chart.

Of course, you can squeeze a lot more money out of the suckers by auditing the grade chart.

NOW YOU TELL ME !!! Where were you when I needed you ?

 

[purple haze]

down with cults and cult makers

The person you refer to (EW) is typical of a handful of "processors" who use "knowledge" (or what they think is knowledge) to try and establish some form of control over another. In each case (of the few) I have encountered, they are low self esteem, have major insecurity issues, crave acknowledgement and usually have a personal agenda, particularly in reference to the opposite sex. They want to become "gurus to a small but misguided bunch of followers and wallow in the "adoration" they think they deserve. In other words they try and form a cult around themselves.

In almost every case they manage to fail. They are incapable of creating a positive future, but parasite off those who align with them. Pretty soon their "followers" see through them and split off, often a lot poorer both financially and spiritually.

The true measure of a good processor is that they can and do create a future, having lots of clients they themselves have found and developed. Poor processors either have no developed clients of their own, or they try and hive off clients from a practice they were connected to.

Alan was a master processor. He would go to a new place, hire a room, get people in, give them a talk and from that first night develop a bunch of clients, to the point where he had to set up a centre just to handle the flow of people coming in.

Dart

Testing the waters, and, thanks Dart, they're just fine; altho where I'm at just now it's frozen over = time to ice skate then.

Ditto on everything re processors. I especially liked someone's reference to Journeymen and agree wholeheartedly. Much like the idea of the Waterman regarding surfers and bodyboarders = surfing to their heart's content, not just doing it to boost their egos or show off or pick up a purse full of money.

Yawn, still jet laggy but sooo happy to be hanging out with family.

Blessings be.

 

[purple haze]

P. E.

I think that is excellent advise, Ted and I will write him again. I will be invoking a 3 strikes and you're out rule, another baseball term. Two posts using baseball terms in one day, how about that sports' fans!

I've already done the above action with Tory, when I first came on line in 2005 I replied to her e mail with words of praise for her and then have done some follow up replies, one here on ESMB to a post which she made to the board members. None of perhaps 4 or 5 posts were ever answered so I quit reading her stuff completely or watching any of her videos after her last no-response perhaps 4 months ago. It's really strange because I was at every Org she was at but always just missed her. For example, she was on the CCLA switchboard and was working for Yvonne when I arrived at CCLA, I remember seeing her there but we never spoke. A week or two after she did the switchboard, I was made to work the switch board for a week by the G.O. rep for writing a check with for Org Invoices afther the P.O. committee turned down my Purchase Order 3 weeks in a row. So it went, we were at ASHO within weeks of each other and AOLA as well. I beleive she looks upon herself as a Celebrity now and may have an agent and stuff. More power to her but I ain't going to read or view anybody's stuff if they can't return a post.

One last note, somebody I PMed with, said that Piere received an enormous amount of mail and he has filters on his computer which would filter out posts from a source such as mine as Spam. Whenever he comes out with something on his on again, off again website, I am going to read it but will send no more replies.
Lakey

Are having lunch tomorrow and will mention the above. Will post reply after that, possibly Sunday.

 

[lkwdblds]

Welcome aboard!

Purple Haze, Thanks for your post. Its always nice to have some new blood posting here. Hope to read more posts from you once you get settled in.
Lakey

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Over and Under for Safety's Sake!

Lakey, to answer the question of the day, I would say wear the yamulka under the hat for services, just as the Hasidim or Orthodox Jews do, the Sea Org being so "elite" in the SPiritual heirarchy of Corporate Scientology!

 

[purple haze]

Excellence

I thought my opinion was pretty clear.

Who brags a lot?

Did his most recent high profile brag give him permission to do so?

What category would a high school braggart have been in?

Lakey,

When you were in high school a decade before me, things were very different. The pill had not been released. The chances of a girl getting pregnant were huge. So many girls, older than me, got pregnant and went to Tijuana, Nogales, etc. for abortions. Some more than once. Others had babies in their teens. It was hormones gone wild.

The Ls, to me, are like hormones gone wild. The results are big blow outs. But the real crucial question is : DID YOUR LIFE CHANGE GREATLY FOR THE BETTER AFTER the Ls?"

A lot of people got hooked on that big blow out EP effect. That's OK, but coke, grass, espresso, and wine are a heck of a lot cheaper.

As an old stick in the mud (read this as curmudgeon), tell me how much your abilities to interact with people, your abilities to get things done, your abilities to handle more of your dynamics (that's those other seven) were before and after the Ls.

Personally, I'm more interested in the success stories that are six months after the auditing. The ones where the person details how their actual day to day life has changed.

Co$ success stories are all about how great I feel right this second after my last session, and I want to get out of here (Flag, Freewinds, etc) and go home without any more poking around for more money to be spent.

The good auditors recognize that the PC needs or wants help for a certain area (anything from asthma to work related issues). The PC gets processes based on what they are sitting in.

The cookie cutter auditing that the church promotes is "You need this"- It is upside down.

I got into scientology to help people. I didn't get in to get something fixed for myself (the ruin). But, on the PC side, I was complaining about (what turned out to be) GPMs. The lower level auditing was OK. I got exterior, da da da, but what I wanted handled, I finally found in the blackand white LRH grade six solo course movie. He described to a T what I was looking at, was bothering me, and that I wanted handled. Grade 6 and Clear changed my life forever. I would have gladly paid hundreds of times more for the results of grade six and Clear, if I had known the effects of those levels. It was truly a good ROI (Return On Investment).

Alan Walter has processes that handle what bothered me, that had I gone to his center(s) thirty years after my brush with Scientology, complaining of what I complained about, they would have cleaned me up on the spot.

That is the difference between auditing the person in front of you and auditing the grade chart.

Of course, you can squeeze a lot more money out of the suckers by auditing the grade chart.

Such an excellent post and so totally brings me up to date with the past thirty years: missed all the pain and the gain of the third dynamic case of Co$, whilst hard at work on my second dynamic. Hats off to you guys and dolls, renegades to robots, and all points in between.