Vegans/Vegetarians Unite!

[myrklix]

I've been a semi-vegetarian for some 30 years. Occasional fish & especially sushi. Same goes for the spouse. My young child gets the same at home but is free to eat what he wants and will when visiting others. At the cousins he'll sometimes have some meat. For protein there's plenty of vegetables, protein (beans, tofu, some fish), oh, and the OTHER dark meat -- chocolate, plenty of it.

 

[nozeno]

WTF?

Are those bacon wrapped turtles?

Bacon wrapped turtle burgers......yum!

 

[Kathy (ImOut)]

I've been a semi-vegetarian for some 30 years. Occasional fish & especially sushi. Same goes for the spouse. My young child gets the same at home but is free to eat what he wants and will when visiting others. At the cousins he'll sometimes have some meat. For protein there's plenty of vegetables, protein (beans, tofu, some fish), oh, and the OTHER dark meat -- chocolate, plenty of it.

Yes, the only dark meat I eat. Gotta have organic chocolate. Especially if it's really Dark at 70 - 77%

 

[mate]

I am a vegetarian/vegan but I do eat yoghurt, Greek-style. I favour raw food but she-who-expects-to-be-obeyed is an "omnivore". When I am served with steamed vegetables, I endeavour to eat some raw vegetable to start, Why? Because cooking, including steaming, destroys the enzymes in the vegetables. Cooking at a temperature over 120F or 45C, will destroy the enzymes. The enzymes are important as they are part of the digestive process.

Another problem for the unwary, is the enzyme inhibitor in all nuts, legumes and grains. This a defence mechanism against being eaten and when eaten there is incomplete digestion resulting in flatulence and other digestive problems. The approach is to turn off the enzyme inhibitor by soaking it, thus creating a natural growing environment. For grains, overnight soaking is sufficient, for nuts and legumes, 24 hours is necessary. This is true even if the grains have been ground.

Taking these points into consideration, here is a recipe for porridge or oatmeal. For an individual serving, soak six heaped dessertspoon fulls of rolled oats overnight. Thoroughly rinse and strain. Place six heaped dessertspoon fulls of oat bran in a mixing bowl. Cover it with boiling water and stir adding more as necessary, to produce a slightly liquidy gruel. Fold the oatmeal into the oat bran.

Enjoy!

Here endth the lesson!

 

[apple]

Two easy to make and delicious salads for lunch are:

1. Finely shreded cabbage, sweet apple and some hemp hearts. Mixed together. Olive oil and sweet red grapes added.

2. Diced fresh tomatoes, cucumber and some apple with hemp hearts. Mixed together. Olive oil and some salad dressing added.

I found if one eats nutritious food it fills me faster then eating less nutritious food. So portions are less. Hemp hearts bring out the flavour in the food.

 

[Voltaire's Child]

What does IOW mean ?

In Britain it means the Isle of Wight.

"in other words"

 

[Voltaire's Child]

Are you offering to come over and cook for me then?

Ax

That would be fun!

 

[La La Lou Lou]

May I suggest something for Veggies. If you miss bacon, crave a slice or two, try using smoked paprika. It has the same taste, it's so yummy! It has no fat and all the flavour! Sprinkle it on your Humus, marinate your torfu, stir it into your stir fries!

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

barbeque portabellos yum

I took the stems off some portabellos, painted them in olive oil, and threw them on a hot Weber.

Delicious

 

[zeropointreference]

Plants don't make vitamin B12. Thus it's impossible to be a true vegetarian and be healthy. B12 suppliments besides yeast ones are produced from animal products so if a vegan takes one of those, they are not true vegans anymore. Most who know this dilemma usually eat certain yeast for B12. But it's a very very very poor source of digestible B12 and because of such it's almost useless as a source. And vegetarians are having to face that Science is also starting to recognize that fungus isn't a plant, but it's own life form (ie animal-plant-fungus-mineral) which will have interesting effect on how vegans and other vegetarians move forward.

A teacher I had who was a hindu taught me an interesting fact. Back in India, vegetarianism is widely practiced and highly thought of. And often they think that meat isn't necessary because they, India's vegans, are proof of how well one can live without meat (and dairy for those vegetarians that eat yogurt and other dairy).

But in the US, practicing vegans didn't do so well. Upon investigation it was found in India the food production isn't as clean as it is in the US and consequently bug parts were getting mixed into the food supplying the necessary missing B12 in food produced in India. But in the US where food production is cleaner, there was less bug protein in the food and consequently less B12. Indian vegetarians were doing well because they were unknowingly eating bug supplements. US vegetarians suffered because of cleaner food.

There is one other work around tho I would consider it cheating. If one fertilizes their garden with animal poo that is partially meat or bug protein, those plants will absorb some of that animal B12 from the poo. It's possible to get enough B12 this way but like I said, it's cheating because technically that B12 is produced by an animal.

Personally, I can't kill so if it came down to me having to kill to obtain meat, I would instantly be transformed into a strict vegetarian (yes I know, the scream of the vegetables).

 

[mate]

Hi ZPR,
Your statement about B-12 is incorrect. Both chlorella and spirulina do provide an excellent source of B-12. Daily intake of 3 gm chlorella, a slightly heaped teaspoonful, provides 4 mcg of vitamin B-12, 70% of the U.S. RDA. Chlorella is tiny, single-celled water-grown green algae. Spirulina, a blue-green algae, is also extremely rich in vitamin B-12, containing 250 percent more than beef liver, previously thought to be natures richest source. So there is nothing to stop you becoming a vegan.

Regards, David

Plants don't make vitamin B12. Thus it's impossible to be a true vegetarian and be healthy.
...

 

[The Great Zorg]

Plants don't make vitamin B12. Thus it's impossible to be a true vegetarian and be healthy. (snip)

Hi ZPR, Your statement about B-12 is incorrect. Both chlorella and spirulina do provide an excellent source of B-12. (snip)

I was reading this thread and your comments and I'd like to throw my 2¢
in the rink if I could...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_B12 :
(big snip)
Vitamin B12 cannot be made by plants or animals.[5] Only bacteria have the enzymes required for its synthesis.
(more snipping)
Finally, so-called Pseudo-B12 refers to B12-like substances which are found in certain organisms, including Spirulina (a cyanobacterium) and some algae. These substances are active in tests of B12 activity by highly sensitive antibody-binding serum assay tests, which measure levels of B12 and B12-like compounds in blood. However, these substances do not have B12 biological activity for humans, a fact which may pose a danger to vegans and others on limited diets who do not ingest B12 producing bacteria, but who nevertheless may show normal "B12" levels in the standard immunoassay which has become the normal medical method for testing for B12 deficiency.

I also believe that in India they cook with ghee, or clarified butter which has the milk protein component removed leaving the oil products. I do not know if vegs there cook with this.

1¢+1¢=2¢

 

[Kutta]

My son's partner has been a strict, no-compromise vegan for over 20 years. She regularly has her blood tested for B12 and has never been out of the normal range. She eats absolutely no animal products whatsoever. I have no idea how she gets her B12.

 

[zeropointreference]

I was reading this thread and your comments and I'd like to throw my 2¢
in the rink if I could...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_B12 :
(big snip)
Vitamin B12 cannot be made by plants or animals.[5] Only bacteria have the enzymes required for its synthesis.
(more snipping)
Finally, so-called Pseudo-B12 refers to B12-like substances which are found in certain organisms, including Spirulina (a cyanobacterium) and some algae. These substances are active in tests of B12 activity by highly sensitive antibody-binding serum assay tests, which measure levels of B12 and B12-like compounds in blood. However, these substances do not have B12 biological activity for humans, a fact which may pose a danger to vegans and others on limited diets who do not ingest B12 producing bacteria, but who nevertheless may show normal "B12" levels in the standard immunoassay which has become the normal medical method for testing for B12 deficiency.

I also believe that in India they cook with ghee, or clarified butter which has the milk protein component removed leaving the oil products. I do not know if vegs there cook with this.

1¢+1¢=2¢

I knew about the bacteria but from what I last learned was the bacteria wasn't a source of B12 for animals. But from what you posted it seems that very bacteria is responsible for all viable B12 production?

Interesting.

I can see it too. Herbivores poop on the ground and the plants absorb some of the B12 from the feces which they eat and the same feces is a source of B12. Predators eat herbivores and ingest their B12 along with the bacterial B12 in the prey's colon.

If this is true, then it's funny isn't it? That animals have come to depend on bacterial that lives in their ass to maintain good nutritional health? With revelations like this it serves to break down my old views on how the world is into what the world "is". Such as when I was growing up poop was pure evil. But in reality, poop is life giving. Still don't want to stick my hands in it and muck around tho.

 

[La La Lou Lou]

That's very interesting about B12 and the diet of countries that use insecticides.

Now how about the diet of beans and rice, with occasional brown bread and peanut butter with some raw cabbage, maybe some milk with the oats. That was pretty much the long term diet of the sea org, when I was around.

The saviour of mankind new everything there was to know about diet, he told us so. So why did he want the most valuable people on the planet to be undernourished as well as deprived of sleep and exercise?

There are two or three possibilities.

He wanted to make us week.

He wanted to experiment on us.

He couldn't give a damn.

He knew nothing.

 

[La La Lou Lou]

So this is how the SO members should be...



From the BUPA fact sheet on B12 deficiency...

As well as the symptoms of anaemia, vitamin B12 deficiency may cause neurological symptoms due to inflammation of the nerves (neuritis). This is called vitamin B12 neuropathy. It affects movement and sensation, especially in the legs, and causes numbness or pins and needles. It can also cause confusion, depression, poor concentration and forgetfulness.

 

[KnightVision]

I love vegetables. They are a perfect compliment to a Filet Mignon.

 

[fortymarriedandbalding]

I was reading this thread and your comments and I'd like to throw my 2¢
in the rink if I could...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_B12 :
(big snip)
Vitamin B12 cannot be made by plants or animals.[5] Only bacteria have the enzymes required for its synthesis.
(more snipping)
Finally, so-called Pseudo-B12 refers to B12-like substances which are found in certain organisms, including Spirulina (a cyanobacterium) and some algae. These substances are active in tests of B12 activity by highly sensitive antibody-binding serum assay tests, which measure levels of B12 and B12-like compounds in blood. However, these substances do not have B12 biological activity for humans, a fact which may pose a danger to vegans and others on limited diets who do not ingest B12 producing bacteria, but who nevertheless may show normal "B12" levels in the standard immunoassay which has become the normal medical method for testing for B12 deficiency.

1¢+1¢=2¢

Another common misconception is the arguement that bacteria in the human gut produce B12 that we can use. While it is true that they produce B12, they live too far down the gut for us to absorb these vitamins.

There is also a theory that pseudo-B12 competes with B12 for co-factors and may lead to a functional definiency even when enough B12 is present.

 

[La La Lou Lou]

There are very strict Indian Vegans (Jains) who make sure they lift all grubs out of the rice as they harvest. They certainly wouldn't use any dairy ghee, or clarified butter as it's known in English. They would use coconut oil or whatever is available for fats.

I have no information about their health though.

 

[fortymarriedandbalding]

There are very strict Indian Vegans (Jains) who make sure they lift all grubs out of the rice as they harvest. They certainly wouldn't use any dairy ghee, or clarified butter as it's known in English. They would use coconut oil or whatever is available for fats.

I have no information about their health though.

Do not forget there is also a lot of bacteria in the ground and old fashioned shit fertiliser also provides many of these bacteria. It is argued that the harvesting, cleaning and preparation methods in much of India lead to consumption of B12 on vegetable produce. In the "Developed World" this does not work because of our unhealthy obsession with excessive hygiene. This is basically an extension of the bug arguement.