What Happens to the Victims of CoS Human Trafficking?

Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by Demented Hubbatd, Sep 20, 2017.

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  1. Demented Hubbatd

    Demented Hubbatd Patron with Honors

    There are multiple media reports about the people who were brought by CoS to the USA, the UK and Australia, and forced to do very hard manual work. It is clear that the victims enter the destination countries as tourists. However the details of their detainment are not entirely clear.

    There are several possibilities:

    1. The victims are sent to RPF right after they enter a country.

    This is a risky strategy: the other RPF members could easily figure out what is going on. Besides, this policy defies the rule of accepting into RPF only those SO members whose stats are low.

    2. CoS had established a separate Org for the human trafficking victims.

    This strategy would work if the victims do not speak English. However, if they have even a rudimentary command of the English language, there is a good chance that they will slip out of the building during the work hours, and notify the authorities about their detainment.

    Frankly, I do not know how this goal of enslavement is achieved. Does anyone know? Has anyone seen the victims?
     
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  2. ThetanExterior

    ThetanExterior Goldenrod SP

    You say "It is clear that the victims enter the destination countries as tourists." but that isn't true. They enter using "religious worker" visas.

    Here is how Tony Ortega explains it: https://tonyortega.org/2017/08/23/s...its-use-of-religious-visas-for-foreign-labor/

    They obviously buy into the whole "saving the planet" stuff that we all did so they will go along with the punishment and enslavement just like any other Sea Org person.
     
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  3. Demented Hubbatd

    Demented Hubbatd Patron with Honors

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  4. Francois Tremblay

    Francois Tremblay Patron with Honors

    You seem to have a lot of misunderstandings about human trafficking... by and large people cooperate because they are promised better jobs, new places to live, etc. There is no issue of them trying to run away... until it's too late.
     
  5. Demented Hubbatd

    Demented Hubbatd Patron with Honors

    If there were no issue of them trying to run away, this wouldn't be called "human trafficking" by the FBI; this would have been regular entrance into the SO the way many of current members of this board did, including myself.
     
  6. Francois Tremblay

    Francois Tremblay Patron with Honors

    Again, I don't think you understand what it is. People who are trafficked, most of the time, DO cooperate willingly because they have been TOLD they would get a great job, a good position, etc. It's based on deceit.
     
  7. Demented Hubbatd

    Demented Hubbatd Patron with Honors

    Apparently, you didn't understand my reply. I don't argue with the fact that they were duped. But deceit alone doesn't classify as a human trafficking.

    Take myself for example -- I was duped into joining Sea Org. I knew that the salary was low, about $20 a week at that time, and the working conditions were hard. But they promised to put me on a fast track to the Class V Auditor level, and, possibly, to even Class VIII. They said that getting to Class V would take somewhere between 5 and 6 months. After reaching Class V was planning to leave SO; frankly, I didn't give a damn about saving the world. Considering my salary at that time, if I would have stayed in SO for 6 months, I would have lost approximately $20K. But the cost of the Bridge classes leading to Class V was about $40K, so I would have saved $20K. After that I was planning to use my own money to get to Class VIII. My plan was to get to the highest non-OT level and open my own Scientology franchise in my native New York City (there was plenty of Scientology franchises in the LA area, but none in the NYC area). Well, they didn't fulfill their promise, so I left SO after 4 months of useless work; no one tried to stop me. The point is that I cannot be classified as a victim of human trafficking, although they gave me a false promise.

    My friend also joined SO, his Org of choice was so called Sales Org whose members were selling Bridge courses and e-meters to public Scientologists. They promised that he will be making about 100K a year. That was also a lie, so he left SO after 5 months of work. But this is not a case of human trafficking

    My other friend had MS in Economics and 8 years of experience in the field; he was a public Scientologist. The Flag people promised him huge money if makes their Org and a bunch of other lesser Orgs solvent. He even had his own office after he joined them. But normal economics practices disagree with Hubbard's Management Series. My friend could not do anything, so he left SO in total frustration. Again, this was not a case of human trafficking.

    In order to classify an illegal activity as "human trafficking", certain criteria must be met. Giving false promises, as you said, is one of them. But false promises are not the sole criterion for such classification. Among other criteria are unlawful detainment, cruel and unusual punishment such as RPF, confiscation of foreign passports, etc.
     
  8. ToeOut83

    ToeOut83 Patron

    Here's a little-noticed facet of entering into the USA and staying long enough to qualify as a "resident", whether documented or not: Immigrant boys/men between the ages of 18 and 26 (yes, even undocumented ones) are required to register in the Selective Service System. I doubt the Co$ bothers to get that done because it has nothing to do with Cherch goals.

    If men who entered the country before age 26 don't register before their 26th birthday, they become forever ineligible for citizenship in the USA, and ineligible for any federal aid program of any kind, or any federal government job. One day, some of those men may escape from the Co$ to find their options considerably more limited than the women.
     
  9. Demented Hubbatd

    Demented Hubbatd Patron with Honors

    I met a person from Hong Kong when I was in EPF. His tourist visa had expired, but a CoS official said that the church will help him to acquire legal status. After he finished EPF and worked for 5 months for Sea Org, he was told that he shouldn't expect to have a legal status, but he could still stay in SO. He went back to his country, and then he returned to the USA as a religious worker for some small Christian church. I don't know if they helped him to obtain a work visa.
     
  10. Demented Hubbatd

    Demented Hubbatd Patron with Honors

    When I was a Scientologist, CoS didn't have the status of a religious organization, all its foreign SO members had tourist visas. The CoS "foreign" policy" was irrational. There was a group of Israeli woman who came to Big Blue to be trained as "ministers". The training lasted for 6 months, and after that they returned to Israel. I thought it would be much cheaper to train them in Israel.

    There was also a large group of South Africans who worked at EPF with us. After they graduated EPF (surprisingly, they all managed to finish EPF program on the same day) they all worked for SO for about 3 months, and after that they were sent back to his country. At first I thought that they had to go because their visas had expired. However, there were Europeans who stayed in SO even after their visas expired.

    At that time I haven't heard that anyone was held in SO against their will. My friend Leslie got homesick and returned to his native New Zealand after a brief stint in SO; his brother Chris returned home after the hard work that lasted for 2 years.
     
  11. Maria

    Maria Patron

    I came to the States in 1999, back then, we were helped to get religious visas to enter the country. Mine was granted for 5 years, my ex-husband's for only 6 months.

    Every foreign SO that entered the country had religious visa and was sent directly to the EPF, not RPF. We were everywhere, my ex-husband and I were supposedly going to be sent to FL, but end up in NYC. There is no separate Org.

    We came voluntarily, we signed the contract and left our lives and families behind because we were convinced we were going to save the world. But in reality we didn't understood what we were getting into. No one told us about the EPF or what it was, and that we couldn't sleep together until we finished it. No one told us we were going to be paid $20 a week. They asked for my passport 'for safe keeping', which I never gave it to them, but my ex did. We didn't speak English but understood enough to get by. After 3 months, they 'realized' that something in my ex's life story made him unqualified to stay in the SO. After I refused to divorce him for their mistake, they offered us the option of me going to work at a Class V Org. And that's how we left the SO. We were lucky but we were trafficked. We were brought to the country with deceitful promises, the biggest of all, that we were going to clear the planet, in reality, they only needed the cheap labor. If you did the EPF, you know is not fun work. You are overworked must of the time which makes you tired most of the time, so moving fast on the EPF is not that easy. By the time you finish, you are just happy to be out of the bottom of the totem pole.

    After leaving the SO, it took me 3 years to leave the org and a total of 12 years since I first came to the states to realize what a big bag of sh1t scientology really is. When I left the org, they try to scare me by telling me that they were going to send me back to my country, that should had been my third big red flag after their ignoring my husband's life story to get us to fly here and then trying to force me to divorce him.

    I know they sent people back that didn't 'work out.' EPF was a revolving door of people coming and going, but we, foreigners didn't have much options, especially since we were left without our passports. How is that not human trafficking, I don't know. At least we weren't force into sexual work!
     
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  12. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Your story may predate this but when LA Org converted to a Sea Org org my first thought was that they didn't like the security risk of having non-SO staff with regular access to the the complex through the LAO building. But it seems LAO is now being used as an international training org. This would make a lot of sense, especially if income has dropped off significantly due to lower public attendance. As an ITO staff from orgs all over the world can be essentially ordered to take training from LAO as a captive revenue stream to offset the loss of public.
     
  13. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Interesting story. Can you estimate what the percentage of EPF were who were on religious visas at that time?

    Since adopting the strategy of using unqualified SO as coins for trades with outer orgs, I would assume that recruiters are under less restriction to avoid recruiting people who they know will eventually be fitness boarded. They always played fast and loose with the rules but this would be a whole new level of deviousness. Recruiters only need to get a prospect routed onto the EPF to get their stat - after that it is all ancient history to them.

    New recruits go directly to the EPF but I have seen lots of EPFers routed directly to the RPF for things like non-compliance, overt product makers, missing targets, non-producers, out-2d (having sex or heavy petting), rockslam emeter reads, or violating the Leaving and Leaves policy by talking about wanting to leave to unauthorized people, etc. You can still be RPFed even for demanding to leave from an authorized person. In many ways the EPF is simply a neutral zone between a staff posting and the RPF. It used to be that a person asking to route out would be sec-checked and routed out between 24 hours to 3 days depending on how equally motivated the Church was to get rid of someone but we are hearing now that they may keep a person isolated from other crew and doing study (indoctrination) and MEST work (unskilled labor) for 6 months or more while they do sec-checking for a very long time or don't get sec-checked at all because they don't schedule an auditor to allow the person to pass the sec-check on the routing form.

    TIP: The routing form is only for people who want to maintain "good standing" with the Church. If they sense that you want to remain in good standing then they can interpret this as an opportunity to "salvage" you. But if you threaten to go to the police and charge them with kidnapping or false imprisonment then you will probably be out of there ASAP.
     
  14. Demented Hubbatd

    Demented Hubbatd Patron with Honors

    I was involved in Scientology in the late 1980s. At that time LA Org was still a Class V Org. I guess, the rules were much more liberal back then -- no one was sent to RPF directly from EPF. My friend told her friend that she had sex with a fellow EPF member, he wrote a KR on her (I told her that she should have shared her secret with me; everyone knew that I was not writing KRs because I thought it would be childish of me to rat somebody out). Anyway, she was sent to DPF (I still do not what that program does), and her punishment was to clean dumpsters for 2 weeks; after that she returned to EPF. Sea Org was a revolving door -- roughly 80% of EPF folk stayed for no more than 5 months in Sea Org. People were leaving at night, no one made attempt to stop them. In the end vast majority of the people who stayed in SO were second-generation Scientologists -- they simply had no place to go.
     
  15. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    It is good for people to see how things are so unpredictable and there is no real standard for conduct or standard policy in the SO. It is a psychotic bubble world where the only thing that is really predictable is that it will continue to be psychotic.

    The period I’m describing was the 1976-77 Wayne Marple Rockslam RPF period at Big Blue during the first renovations. Leading up to this they needed a whole lot of people for every kind of work. They were virtually recruiting people right off of Hollywood Blvd. People who had little understanding of Scientology and were probably more interested in food and housing. Many were very problematic and were eagerly routed out from the EPF. However, surprisingly LRH was at La Quinta during this time and they were recruiting people from the EPF directly to go work with LRH. This seems so counter intuitive. Here you have this guy who is in hiding, completely paranoid, you’d expect only the most dedicated, fully immersed Scientologists who were heavily vetted and had their loyalty tested by the RPF or many lower conditions assignments and arbitrary abuse who would be permitted to get near him. But something must have happened because suddenly all these strict recruitment qualification standards were adopted, lots of people were routed out, recruiters were being punished. There was an obvious conflict between the need for lots of slave bodies and the need for people who could work near LRH who could be effective and trustworthy. This was always their problem - retaining people who were reliable and sane yet tolerated and helped perpetuate the insanity. It is the collection of a lot of these kinds of people in one place that makes Scientology so fascinating. How is that even possible?

    I don’t think I ever saw a bonafide DPF (Deck Project Force). I always interpreted it as some kind of holdover expression from the ships. There was only the EPF (Estate Project Force) or the RPF (Rehabilitation Project Force). The EPF was for new recruits who work doing their intro staff courses prior to posting in their respective orgs that recruited them while doing labor during the day. The DPF theoretically was a program where staff who had already completed the EPF and who had been posted could be sent to sort of retread their basic work discipline that they should have learned on the EPF if they screwed up after being posted. There were all-hands and various projects that used staff but those were supervised by Estates or a special project and those people would go back to post or whatever. They even used public volunteers but it wasn’t like there was a formal established DPF with it’s own Bosun and MAA and separate quarters like the EPF and RPF.

    EPF are not supposed to be posted either but I have seen EPFers essentially hold the same post for over a year and they may be transferred from the original recruiting org to another org as a coin before they are even off the EPF. So much for all those promises of becoming a world class auditor - now you will be a folder admin or work in the laundry for 20 years.

    After LRH died all the criteria would change. DM didn’t need to hide. He wouldn’t be interested in avoiding staff placements around him who would rat out his location so much as he would want people who didn’t threaten his assumption of power. If you no longer want effective, powerful, innovative sane people around you then the whole organization could be composed of lower level minions who could assign lowers to each other and change the bedding. Where LRH wanted competent staff, DM may just want dumbed down staff.

    Basically, once you route on they can and will do whatever they want with you. Forget all the rules and written policy and recruiter promises.
     
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  16. clamicide

    clamicide Gold Meritorious Patron

    MId 80s I was aware of DPF while on Athena lines at PAC for something or other and there was a group of them. At one point I wound up speaking to one woman who appeared to be very early 20s and she was away from the group because she had to go back and remop mess hall or whatever they called the area and she was stressed and sort of moving the mop and telling me how she had to run everywhere and that she had already done the EPF and I was lost because I didn't know they had that and got out the good old MMTD (ew... Modern Management Tech Dic? can't believe how easily I spit that one out. As an aside, I was out having lunch by myself a few months ago when a group walked in carrying one and they sat down and had the most delusional conversation that I once considered normal and I just thanked the entire universe that I was out).

    It might have even been being piloted to be brought back at the time, and that vaguely fits recollection. There were a lot of pilots and marketing tests going on. I saw a mock up for possible logos and choices of name for a "Quantum" meter back at ASHO in 1986 or something.

    Also, Class V Orgs also got in on this game, but I saw it at a later point than the 80s. Orgs were going outside the country and bringing folks in with religious worker VISAs. For some folks, it was a perfect situation for trafficking. It was similar to illegal immigrants in some of the situations. There were folks were coming in driven by poverty or wanting to do religious work, so they expected terrible conditions in exchange for chance for better life. I did met a couple folks who were brought in by the same people, so not sure if this was widespread, but they knew they were coming in on those VISAs with a wink and a nudge-- but it was the greatest good and were hell-bent on saving the planet. Another guy I met basically was drinking himself to death and thought that he'd finally be able to support his family when his org went Saint Hill size. This is just what I knew of personally, and through first-hand accounts of some people who were involved with some of this so it might not reflect what was happening all over.
     
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  17. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    After a while you begin to understand that the Sea Org is a cyclic culture. It is constantly "rediscovering" some successful action that had fallen out and needs to be reinstated post haste. Of course, it fell out of use because it really wasn't very successful and was probably abusive and created a PR flap with the public or internally with staff and was abolished after some evaluation finally discovered the problem and the guilty parties were comm-eved and declared, etc. After things cool off it's brought back with some kind of variation on the theme. The pattern becomes routine. The stuff from the ships carries a kind of nostalgia and mystique within the SO. These were the glory days when everything was standard under LRH's direct supervision. I've heard they even tried "overboarding" people by throwing them into the flooded bottom of an elevator shaft in Big Blue but they apparently didn't think through that there were those big gnarly emergency springs down there and someone got injured on them. Don't know if that story is true but I can believe it.

    The DPF is just a euphemism for MEST work, grunt labor and it theoretically can double as a kinder more gentler RPF in some cases where the crew member hasn't done something so bad as to deserve the RPF and they don't need to retread the EPF courses. They can also be assigned back to post on a whim instead of having to complete the more extensive programs. But like I said, I've never seen it implemented as a stable program. It is redundant to the EPF and RPF and in my tenure didn't seem to rate the resources necessary to maintain it as an institution. The Church also appears to be outsourcing most of it's heavy construction instead of attempting it in-house. The reasons for this could be many and rather obvious. Lack of trade skill, higher liability and risk of serious injury, bad PR and the project load is just too high for a non-professional work force. Also, the big RPF buildup in the late 70s created specialized units who were highly skilled at what they did and earned a lot of respect. I don't think the RPF is intended to do that. I would expect that it would be more mission consistent to have them reduced to cleaning toilets and dumpsters with toothbrushes.

    I seem to recall that around 1980-81 they started bringing in a lot of people out of country, especially, South America, to take training at the NWC (New World Corp) and that these were non-SO staff who were also being put up in SO berthing. Of course these sponsoring orgs are another tier in the revenue stream. Public give money to the orgs - money goes to the parent Church. Orgs give money to SO training units - money goes to the parent Church. As public money dries up I'd expect the sponsored staff training revenue model to be more heavily exploited.

    They were playing fast and loose with visas in the 70s with staff from other countries being sent to Saint Hill in violation of the British Scientology ban. All very old hat. Between this and the foreign Outer Org Trainee gig it would only be natural that the emphasis upon foreign recruitment would be increased as the better informed US population stayed away.

    Whenever someone joins the SO they are interviewed on the e-meter to find out if they are joining for an ulterior motive. Typically, they want to know if they are reporters, government infiltrators, trying to learn the trade secrets so they can start their own squirrel group, etc. Wanting to go up the Bridge cheaply by having training and auditing provided as a staff member is acceptable. Wanting to handle your own case is cool. Wanting to control and abuse people - that's a bit more nuanced. Apparently using the Church to get a green card is also OK. As long as your ulterior motives align with the Church's ulterior motives then it can be made to work.
     
  18. Demented Hubbatd

    Demented Hubbatd Patron with Honors

    As you said, they were recruiting people right off of Hollywood BLVD -- the same recruiting picture was present during my stay in Sea Org. No wonder why the SO attrition rate was about 80%

    I met two foreigners in RPF. One of them, Edmund, became my friend. He was in the US on tourist visa. After his visa expired, Edmund joined SO. He finished the EPF program in 2 months, after that joined SO where he stayed for 3 months, then blew. He went to Frisco and joined a Catholic charity, They obtained a religious visa for him/ Then there was a guy from Hong Kong whose tourist visa expired shortly after he finished EPF. He returned to Hong Kong, then went back to the US as a tourist again. Here he joined a small Protestant church. I met him week before I left SO. We talked for a while before his "religious body" saw us. The Chinese guy became nervous and said he had to return back to his new church.

    There were other foreigners in SO. The ones that I knew had tourist visas. I'm sure the other foreigners had religious visas, but they must have been of a higher rank. At that time Scientology was not recognized as a religion by the US government, so it would be difficult for CoS to obtain religious visas for SO members.
     
  19. Maria

    Maria Patron

    All foreigners were under religious visa, about half or little more of all EPF'rs. Some Hispanics, most from Easter Europe and Russia. This is late 1990's, early 2000's, much later than when you guys went. Some people with tourist visas were helped to get religious visas before being allowed into the SO or Class V orgs.
     
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  20. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    That sounds like a very high percentage and I'm guessing it was an increasing trend. There would be a demand for these visas from people in those countries wanting to go the US and probably hoping to somehow get a permanent legal residency. This has probably become something of a market amongst all churches seeking less demanding employees and to backfill dropping staff recruitment for US citizens.

    But the SO is a lifetime commitment so either these people will need to get a permanent residency or eventually they will have to return to work in an SO unit in their home country. Or, they are routed out of the Sea Org at some point and used as a trading coin for a more highly qualified staff in a non-SO org.

    In either case, I perceive the increased reliance upon R1 visas in the SO as an indicator of increased instability and decline. They have always been reluctant to invest training and auditing in staff until they have been tested and proven reliable. They don't like to see highly trained course supervisors, auditors and case supervisors leave after so much resources have been invested in them. If they don't train and audit staff then they don't create a business model based on delivery of Scientology services. To that extent they would need to shift the revenue model over to things like IAS donations, freeloader debts, hotel services, real estate asset accumulation, etc. and this is where a more untrained transient workforce like R1 visas could be best utilized.

    I think current management has a fundamental lack of faith in the tech. That was LRH's baby. But they do understand and appreciate real estate more. Note that I didn't say they understand real estate well. I think many of the acquisitions and the amount of money and resources invested in them are very flawed strategies and give very little consideration to who would pay top dollar for them on resale. Still, a relatively unskilled workforce makes sense of you need a lot of people watching over and maintaining this real estate. In the end, it is wog investments and people doing good old fashioned wog work who can provide a real world valuable final product not dependent on woo.
     
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