The Little Thread Which Grew - the Apollo '73 to Everything But

[lkwdblds]

Wow, a whole new area of knowledge open to us!!!

Leon is on the ball with his post above.

There was a presentation made at the International Vegetarian Convention in 1965 (I was the Australasian delegate).

In essence, the research data presented showed that a group of tested food products grown in the conventional "factory farm" mono-agricultural methods had all the same cellular structure characteristics as human cancer cells.

Food products grown organically (without chemical fertilizers) had the same characteristics as healthy human cells.

I have posted in more detail on this else where.

Cigarettes, and flavored tobacco products are a real bitch. Brown and Williamson the major cigarette/tobacco company holds patents for the use of solvents used to carry/impart flavor into tobacco . . . . the solvent is toluene . . . a major nerve toxin and carcinogen. Of course this is "OK" and outside of the regulations, like cosmetics, at such products are not "consumed" (This point being why I mentioned the flavored cigar scenario of our friend Alan)

Rog

Thank you so much for this feedback Rog!! You and Leon have opened a window to a whole new way vested interests keep the public dumbed down and block critical information from getting into the public's hands, usually for the sole purpose of a big business group making large profits. "That old saying needs to be looked at, "He who pays the piper, calls the tune!"

This is probably one of the biggest legitimate knocks against a capitalistic system of government. Though I lean more to the right than the left in politics, this is one major area of government where I side with the left.

In our system of government, often the powers that be, such as the FDA (Food and Drug Authority) will sit idly by and allow companies to market carcinogenic products and then cater to the vested interests who are funding them, they go after something like the Health Food Industry just to make a show to the public that they are doing a job and are busy in working on our behalf. An amino acid such as L Tryptophan, formerly used as a safe sleeping aid, is then ordered off the market by the FDA and a whole group of drugs designed to aid sleep is soon brought to market by the major drug companies who to a large degree fund the FDA through grants and have their own representatives on the FDA's Board of Directors.

Just so as you know I have not swung over fully to the left, I will mention an area of equal wrongness which is being perpetrated by the left against society. I am talking here about the Boy Scouts. The Boy Scouts have been a fantastic force for good and sanity in building the character of young boys and helping them grow into men. I was in it as a youth and it really helped me. Of course LRH made it all the way to Eagle Scout. Well, there are two planks in the Boy Scout platform, which the far left, represented in court by the ACLU, American Civil Liberties Union, can not tolerate or allow to exist.

Those two planks are #1. A belief in God must be stated and #2 Gays can not serve as Scout Masters. Some clarification is needed, for #1, boys do not have to be of any religion but merely have to agree to a belief in a Diety. If they do not really have this belief, they can still get in if they lie and say they believe in God. No check is made to see if they are telling the truth. On point #2, the Scouts use a "don't ask, don't tell" system and any boy who is gay can be a member. Now, when you are talking about the leader who is the opinion leader for the boys and a model whom the boys emulate, then the Boy Scouts do not want an openly gay person who is promoting a gay agenda to serve as Scoutmaster. The two restrictions seem fine to me but the ACLU is working to destroy the Boy Scouts in courts and are diligently pursuing their agenda unrelentlingly.

Notice that the left based organizations never even think of starting their own groups. They could start a Godless version of the Boy Scouts on their own instead of using their money to tear down the existing Boy Scouts and they could also start a Gay version of Scouting. Those who prefer atheism and being gay as an equal alternate life style could form their own version of Scouting and demonstrate how successful their program is. Maybe people would leave standard Scouting for their version. This is the way it should be done but the left never builds anything, it only destroys resources or reallocates resources and incorporates them under a government bureaucracy.

Well, that is my take on this, has anyone got any comments.
Lakey

 

[Leon]

Can't imagine why they don't want gays in the Boy Scouts. Baden-Powell himself was fond of a boy or two.

Thanks for the good comments on my earlier post. But hey, I may be totslly wrong about the phosphorus.

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

Regarding Carmelo's recent post encouraging us to contact Geoff Levin, yes by all means, this is a good idea. Those of us who knew him, and compassionate people who did not but like to offer people support, i.e. people such as Sweetness and Light, should send their support to Geoff!

However, there is one small condition to observe. Please don't use Carmelo's real name, if you know it and say that you were sent by that name. Also do not even use the name Carmelo Orchard.

The best way to do it is to say that you heard about Geoff being ill through the grapevine or just say it came to your attention. If you are pressed for a specific name, use the name Pam Lancaster as the source of the information. Pam is still on staff at CCLA and has been there going on 40 years! This is a security measure which everyone would be extremely wise to use!
Lakey

I also have the rumor line about Geoff going strong within the walls of the Co$. Geoff has a lot of friends. With him being so withdrawn, it's hard to know what ails him specifically.

Steve Jobs (of Apple, Pixar, & Disney) recently lost a lot of weight, but recovered. If we can give Geoff reason to live by a large show of affection and love, he could *maybe* turn things around for himself.

An old friend of his is looking at alternative healing.

In the meantime send cards and letters, phone him, e mail him, and knock on his door. He's there. He doesn't seem to go out.

Many of us have watched as a friend faded away. Ken Ogger comes to mind for me. Nancy Many has her story in her book. None of us want our friends to fall off the cliff. If you have ever known Geoff, please contact him, and encourage him to fight what ails him. he's been my friend for five decades. he has never been a "bad" guy. He is a creative musician type, not a jerk. He needs help.

 

[lkwdblds]

Even if wrong about phosphorus it....

Can't imagine why they don't want gays in the Boy Scouts. Baden-Powell himself was fond of a boy or two.

Thanks for the good comments on my earlier post. But hey, I may be totslly wrong about the phosphorus.

I understand that but even if they are wrong about the phosphorus, the things I admired most about your post was that you did not automatically accept what is being fed to the population by world news media and advertisers. You looked deeper and proposed some other ways things could be. It was good "out of the box" thinking. I am trying to improve this in myslef as I was raised totally middle class American and just take so many things for granted they don't even show up at all on my mental radar screen.

Tobacco causing lung cancer was something I had accepted uncritically probably 40 years ago when we started calling cigarettes "cancer sticks" I never asked why it was that way chemically or who made the studies or how they were funded or any of that stuff and I am trying to wake up and not just accept everything. The average guy out in the public is less informed than me but then if I am so blind where does that leave him? Here in tobacco was a fairly large subject on which I had been blind all my life and your astute post woke me up on that topic plus led to a general wake up call on other such issues. The same thing with auditing causing OT's cancer. A lot of people dub in answers why this is so. Probably nearly all of them are wrong. Looking a little outside the box, it is easy to see that most parishioners on the upper levels in the Church are PTS - they are subjected to these 6 month security checks at $40,000 a pop and are hoping nothing will read because their funds are maxed out and if there are reads, they will have to spend more or they won't be able to continue on their auditing. To me, that is a PTS situation. Per everyone's tech, you won't make auditing gains if you are PTS yet something must happen in session or you will be cited as a no case gain PC and be ordered to purchase more rundowns to handle that! You are in a trap, a Catch 22!

Therefore, something has to occur on your case but it can't really be good because you are PTS, therefore, bad things must happen on your case. That's just a short theory I just made up but it seems plausible and ties in to a marked degree with your earlier post on the subject.

Those 6 month security check refreshers are off policy and there is a reason they are off policy and yet C of S officials put them there as a revenue source, possibly never suspecting that they may damage someone's case. They probably figure, well better safe than sorry, if nothing reads, no harm is done and we generated some income and the pc is clean to proceed. It is the no harm assumption which is being proven false. The pc is hoping against hope that nothing will read and mocking up that nothing will read to save additional charges, this is not the definition of auditng, "being interested in one's case and being willing to talk to the auditor" This is definitely not happening on these sec checks. Therefore standard auditing is not occuring and the results of what is occuring are in unchartered waters and from the events which routinely take place, it seems, empirically at least, that cancer can often result from performing extensive high level auditing on a pc who is not really "in session" as per the above definition!
Lakey

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Heh!

Good Gawd! - You're female aren't you? - Looking like me is surely a fate worse than death! - Oh the qruelty of the world!

Lol! Schwimmey is showing off his wonderfully wry Danish sense of humor! Hee, hee! He's actually a cuddley blond god!

No way, honey, I've seen your picture and you are an absolute cutie pie, as I am! Same big grin, too!

Welcome to the thread, we'll look forward to your postings!

 

[SweetnessandLight]

I saw a great documentary film on the way the American tobacco companies manipulate tobacco to make it more addictive, with hybridization to concentrate certain chemical elements in the leaves, to additives they "treat" it with, to the way cigarettes, cigarillos, etc. are designed with air holes, etc, so that you get a bigger hit of the chemicals, have to take a deeper drag on it to get smoke particles deeper into your lungs, etc.

Chewing tobacco is bad, too, also causes oral cancers...

So take a toxic product and make it more toxic in the pursuit of profit, and at the cost of much misery and people's lives...that's the situation.

The point about organic vs. chemically altered via fertilizers is also well taken.

If you smoke, move heaven and earth to cut down, and then quit.

If you don't smoke, don't start, ever, no matter what stressors you are coping with.

By the way, second hand smoke, (other people smoking nearby you) is also very damaging to health, especially for children and young people, and seniors or those with chronic health conditions.

So cut it out, folks!

The RAMPANT tobacco addiction amongst Sci executives, SO and staff is just another clear indicator of their collective insanity. Major fail on several dynamics!

 

[Blue Spirit]

Out Tech

........with auditing causing OT's cancer. A lot of people dub in answers why this is so. Probably nearly all of them are wrong. Looking a little outside the box, it is easy to see that most parishioners on the upper levels in the Church are PTS - they are subjected to these 6 month security checks at $20,000 a pop and are hoping nothing will read because their funds are maxed out and if there are reads, they will have to spend more or they won't be able to continue on their auditing. To me, that is a PTS situation. Per everyone's tech, you won't make auditing gains if you are PTS yet something must happen in session or you will be cited as a no case gain PC and be ordered to purchase more rundowns to handle that! You are in a trap, a Catch 22!

Therefore, something has to occur on your case but it can't really be good because you are PTS, therefore, bad things must happen on your case. That's just a short theory I just made up but it seems plausible and ties in to a marked degree with your earlier post on the subject.

Those 6 month security check refreshers are off policy and there is a reason they are off policy and yet C of S officials put them there as a revenue source, possibly never suspecting that they may damage someone's case. They probably figure, well better safe than sorry, if nothing reads, no harm is done and we generated some income and the pc is clean to proceed. It is the no harm assumption which is being proven false. The pc is hoping against hope that nothing will read and mocking up that nothing will read to save additional charges, this is not the definition of auditng, "being interested in one's case and being willing to talk to the auditor" This is definitely not happening on these sec checks. Therefore standard auditing is not occuring and the results of what is occuring are in unchartered waters and from the events which routinely take place, it seems, empirically at least, that cancer can often result from performing extensive high level auditing on a pc who is not really "in session" as per the above definition!
Lakey

You are seeing it rather straight, Lakey, I believe.

C/S Series 73 is a direct reference that contraindicates "six-month" checks.

I said that to a "Churchie" recently who I ran into and he scattered like a rabbit. Dangerous to look, and they fell for that "No-Look" trick LRH mentions.

Doing it outside would be A-to-B and save about $40K per year, which few can afford.

(I changed your $40K to $20K above as more accurate for one 6-month check)

 

[lkwdblds]

You are seeing it rather straight, Lakey, I believe.

C/S Series 73 is a direct reference that contraindicates "six-month" checks.

I said that to a "Churchie" recently who I ran into and he scattered like a rabbit. Dangerous to look, and they fell for that "No-Look" trick LRH mentions.

Doing it outside would be A-to-B and save about $40K per year, which few can afford.

(I changed your $40K to $20K above as more accurate for one 6-month check)

Thanks for changing that Blue! $20.000 per visit or $40k for the year just to do refreshers. Isn't that about the lower limit of what constitutes a middle class income in the United States? Yes, the Bridge is definitely targeted for the well to do financially and if one is not well to do, they help you incur debt so that you can live like you are and receive your next step on the Bridege

Unfortunately, the next step all too often is not the one which you needed to crack your case but it is the one after that. Now that you are so close, the last funds are dredged from dying old Uncle Hubert plus your local registrar making some phone calls to your credit card companies to extend your credit limits and somehow you go on to the next, next step. You do have some nice wins there but not the real big case cracker win. You don't know where to turn next. Suddenly, you receive a call from your local Org telling that they have located an Ideal Org building and they need you to mortgage your house so as to contribute to procuring the building. You say you are maxed out credit wise so you are invited to a free lecture on money to be given this Saturday at the Org. There is a secrete given out at that lecture by the OT 8 Ambassador who puts on the lecture, "If you are having trouble confronting something, confront and handle two of them." Shear genius! Your home is refinanced and you put a payment on your next step on the Bridge and also on the new Ideal Org and in the refi you paid off one of your credit cards. The world looks rosy again and you even have the cushion of a new $5,000 open credit card. When you get home, two IAS members are at your door waiting for you, how nice to see you and they are even offering to take you out for a free steak dinner. What could be better. Turns out the dinner was not exactly free, the $5,000 on the card was given to upgrade your IAS membership but you earned a lovely lapel pin to wear now and you sleep well knowing that the new fledgling Org in Turkestan will no be protected from the SP government and the psychs over there who are trying to bring it down. Another day, another few thousands dollars changing hands, out of your hands and into C of S hands.

6 MONTHS LATER - You innocently ask a Scientology friend if he knows a good bankruptcy attorney. (Unknown to you he KRs (Knowledge Reports) to the Org that you are contemplating bankrupticy. You receive an urgent call from the Org to come in immediately "for a briedfing". Upon arrival you are told that it is not okay for you to file bankruptcy. It is public record that you are a Scientologist and if you file, it creates terrible public relations for the Church, a real shore flap. Obviously, you are PTS for pulling in this out ethics situation. Bankruptcy is an instance of out exchange and we can not allow our parishioners to indulge in such an out ethics practice. You obviously have m/u's on finance and did not duplicate that money seminar which was given you free 7 months ago. You are ordered to find your m/u's and clear them and this time you are going to pay full price for that seminar. You stammer... but ..but I don't have any more money, I gave it all to you guys. They say, quit your nattering and justifications, we don't want to hear it. You either clean up your act or you will be declared and expelled. Go pay the reg for the Bankruptcy Salvation Course, then report to the Ethics Officer NOW!!

Lakey

 

[looker]

Loads of vitamines?

I was listening to Dr Dean Edell on talk radio a few Saturdays ago, and he said that the medical community had done studies on mega doses of vitamins, and found they may actually do some harm. The cells that are cancerous could actually be feeding on the mega doses of vitamins. He said the best source of vitamins and all the complex supporting structures that help the body assimilate natural vitamins is just really good food.

He went on to say most vitamins are synthetic or extracted then processed with cold and/or heat and by the time they get into your body less of the live nutrients are there. (FWIW: He used to be a vegetarian for several years)

He said Stress can cause the release of cortisol when the Fight or Flight response is suppressed, then other adrenals and endocrines flood the system if they are not burned off they can cause heart problems and perhaps cancer. Scientologist take a lot of cheap vitamins and have a lot of stress and little money for a good diet.

Makes sense they might have more illness. Also they don't get much sunshine which creates vitamin D.

 

[hbeer]

Thanks for changing that Blue! $20.000 per visit or $40k for the year just to do refreshers. Isn't that about the lower limit of what constitutes a middle class income in the United States? Yes, the Bridge is definitely targeted for the well to do financially and if one is not well to do, they help you incur debt so that you can live like you are and receive your next step on the Bridege

Unfortunately, the next step all too often is not the one which you needed to crack your case but it is the one after that. Now that you are so close, the last funds are dredged from dying old Uncle Hubert plus your local registrar making some phone calls to your credit card companies to extend your credit limits and somehow you go on to the next, next step. You do have some nice wins there but not the real big case cracker win. You don't know where to turn next. Suddenly, you receive a call from your local Org telling that they have located an Ideal Org building and they need you to mortgage your house so as to contribute to procuring the building. You say you are maxed out credit wise so you are invited to a free lecture on money to be given this Saturday at the Org. There is a secrete given out at that lecture by the OT 8 Ambassador who puts on the lecture, "If you are having trouble confronting something, confront and handle two of them." Shear genius! Your home is refinanced and you put a payment on your next step on the Bridge and also on the new Ideal Org and in the refi you paid off one of your credit cards. The world looks rosy again and you even have the cushion of a new $5,000 open credit card. When you get home, two IAS members are at your door waiting for you, how nice to see you and they are even offering to take you out for a free steak dinner. What could be better. Turns out the dinner was not exactly free, the $5,000 on the card was given to upgrade your IAS membership but you earned a lovely lapel pin to wear now and you sleep well knowing that the new fledgling Org in Turkestan will no be protected from the SP government and the psychs over there who are trying to bring it down. Another day, another few thousands dollars changing hands, out of your hands and into C of S hands.

6 MONTHS LATER - You innocently ask a Scientology friend if he knows a good bankruptcy attorney. (Unknown to you he KRs (Knowledge Reports) to the Org that you are contemplating bankrupticy. You receive an urgent call from the Org to come in immediately "for a briedfing". Upon arrival you are told that it is not okay for you to file bankruptcy. It is public record that you are a Scientologist and if you file, it creates terrible public relations for the Church, a real shore flap. Obviously, you are PTS for pulling in this out ethics situation. Bankruptcy is an instance of out exchange and we can not allow our parishioners to indulge in such an out ethics practice. You obviously have m/u's on finance and did not duplicate that money seminar which was given you free 7 months ago. You are ordered to find your m/u's and clear them and this time you are going to pay full price for that seminar. You stammer... but ..but I don't have any more money, I gave it all to you guys. They say, quit your nattering and justifications, we don't want to hear it. You either clean up your act or you will be declared and expelled. Go pay the reg for the Bankruptcy Salvation Course, then report to the Ethics Officer NOW!!

Lakey

Ouch, Lakey. Isn't it the truth. How insane it looks. How insane it is!!



.

 

[Blue Spirit]

Bad Experience

Ouch, Lakey. Isn't it the truth. How insane it looks. How insane it is!! .

Unfortunately Lakey speaks from experience having gone up against the biggest Service Facsimile Machine in the universe.

 

[lkwdblds]

Attending an event today with 3 other ESMB members

I drove with an ESMB friend to an event at the Steve Allen Theatre in Hollywood. At the event, we met two other ESMB members. THe event featured six speakers and was hosed by Mark Bunker of Xenu TV fame.

Three of the speakers were well known ex Scientologists, Nancy Many, Jeff Hawkins and Mark Headley. They spoke for about 10 minutes each. There were three other speakers who also spoke for 10 minutes, two women and and young man. This three were younger members and one of the girls was raised in the Church by members who were dedicated Scientologists. She joined the Sea Org at the age of ten.

The stories of the three younger speakers were equally as interesting as those of the better know exes. The younger ones focused on the promises which were made to get them to join, virtually none of which were fulfilled, and then the work abuses which were heaped upon them while working up to 20 hours a day, 7 days a week for as little as 30 cents an hour. The lack of schooling provided to the younger members was emphasized plus the virtual impossiblity of escaping from the compound, plus the forced abortions and the forced disconnections once they left.

One girl wanted out so bad she tried both routing out on a routing form and escape, both to no avail and then got the bright idea of taking a swig of some ammonia cleaning solvent which caused her to be considered suicidal and after commiting that deed she was swiftly offloaded with a huge freeloader bill. Her years of working 100 hour weeks for 40 cents an hour were not given any credit as far as lowering her freeloader bill. She actually paid $10,000 on her freeloader debt, sending payments from her new job before she wised up.

There were a tremendous number of new crews attending and recording the event both on audio and video. Three major networks were present including ABC.

We four ESMB member, joined by a former ESMB member who was kicked off the board had lunch together at the Figaro Restaurant on North Vermont, which I think is occupying the old Sarno's Italian restaurant building. I ate sensibly, having a vegetarian panini with a green salad with balsamic dressing on the side. I know Blue Spirit might criticize me for eating this but it was the healthiest meal on the menu. We four members will be having more luncheons or brunches including one next Saturday. Anyone who is interested in joining us, just PM either Sweetness and Light or me to get the time and place.

This luncheon with three other exes and an Anon was a lot different than the lunches I used to eat at Denny's and other restaurants when I was active public or was on staff. The conversation is quite different and there is little possibiolity of coffee shop auditing type discussions taking place. One of our foursome is a Class VIII auditor so we do offer technical expertise among us.
Lakey

 

[lkwdblds]

Is real friendship possible inside Scientology?

There was a thread started recently by "Paul the Spiritualist" in the general discussion portion of ESMB. This thread had to do with whether or not real friendship was possible amongst those inside the C of S. I reponded and posted on this thread and I thought my post was one of my better written stories and the topic is very pertinent so I deicded to re post it here. By the way, besides my longish post, Carmelo posted a short summary post there which I thought was excellent, short and to the point. Here is my Story on Is real friendship possible in C of S? - My FSM Harry - Typical Case in Point

My original FSM Harry is a typical case in point. He got my brother and me in the same day, got us to an an intro lecture at L.A. Org. We both signed up and he met us after the lecture and went for coffee. The next 2 weeks or so, he met with us every day and called every day to see how we were doing.

CASE #1 Harry drops my brother. My brother was suicidal and had some very big case issues. When he met Harry, his whole outlook improved and Harry provided purpose to his life. Suddenly, one day, Harry stopped calling him or returning his calls. My brother went into depression.

Harry was still friendly with me, more so than ever. I called him to discuss my brother. He said that he shared many facets of case with my brother and my brother was starting to key him in and make him non sessionable in his auditing so he had to "cut the comm line." I said, couldn't you have met with him and explained this to him, given him a chance to understand or perhaps give him a chance to improve. Harry said he should have done that but he had too heavy of a case to do it and could only confront curtting the comm line.

Harry and I continued our freindship and got closer and closer and were each others best friend for one year and then I joined the Sea Org. After that, of course my time was taken up but he would come by the Org perhaps two days a week and I would always see him on my "libs" day off. We had this relationship for two years and then I got promoted to the "Apollo" Harry took me out for an expensive dinner with wine and mixed drinks a day or two before I left for the Apollo. On the Apollo, I wrote to him regularly . I only lasted there 2 months and requested to leave and was off loaded. I returned to L.A. worked up the formulas to Non Existence and started making payments on my Freeloader debts and only then called Harry with enthusiasm and happiness about the prospects of reconnecting with my old best friend now that I was out of the S.O. but still very much a committed Scientologist.

Guess what happened. You got it.

CASE #2 - HARRY DUMPED ME. Just like with my brother, when I called Harry, he answered and was very nervous and edgy and refused my offer to get together and told me he could not talk right now and would have to hang up now because he was just leaving when I called. I told him I would like to meet for coffee and that I was in good standing again and wanted to explain to him what happened on the Apollo. He said that he was sure that I tried hard and meant well but he did not want to hear anything at all about it. He pleaded with me not to tell him any of the details. I realized that the same thing had happened to me as what happened to my brother 3 years earlier, Harry had dumped me. My best friend had dumped me! He did it because I was no longer safe for him and any contact with me would mess up his case and his progress up the bridge.

The CHURCH of Scientology. In this Church, your fellow congregation members do not tend you in times of travail and need and take care of you. Instead you become unsafe for them to communicate with. a three year stint as one's best friend can be ended in 5 minutes or less without even a letter or a phone call. One moment a person is your best friend and the next minute you are unsafe for him to be around and a pariah or social outcast.

TWO QUESTIONS WHICH ARISE:
#1. Do you really need friends such as Harry?
#2. Should your Church really be the C of S?

I was Harry's best friend. I would have done anything to help him, to be there for him to the end of our lives. When he was my best friend, he did not like me for who I am but only "me, the winning Scientologist, in a higher condition". Me the being he never knew and when he had the chance to know me, it wan't safe for him to do so. Probably within 5 seconds of the moment when he heard that I had left the Apollo, the friendship was over only I did not know it or suspect it. IS THIS ANY WAY TO RUN A NAVY? IS THIS ANY WAY TO RUN A CHURCH? US THIS ANY WAY TO BE A FRIEND?

I did see an image which reminded me a lot of Harry once while reading a National Geographic magazine, the picture showed an ostrich sticking its head into the sand to supposedly avoid facing trouble which was brewing above ground. Another time I was reading a Dictionary of American Slang and saw Harry's picture alongside the definition of the term, "Fair weather Friend". Another interesting point is that Harry is still in C of S, now completing his 41st year. For about 20 years I hoped for a phone call from him saying that he now made it up the bridge far enough to where he could actually confront life and some of its unpleasanties and did not have to run away and hide from his friends anymore if they encounter trouble. Sadly, such a call never came.
Lakey

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

Friends

I'm obviously boring.

I get a birthday card every year from a guy I went to kindergarten with. I have more than one friend still from kindergarten days.

My fist love from age 14 is still my friend. My pals from high school are still my pals.

The friends I made in my short stay in Scientology are still friends. My power auditor from 1969 is a friend. I was at his house two nights ago. He and his wife live three blocks from our youngest daughter.

We've been married for decades. The kids and grandkids come to our house for holidays.

My best friends from high school are still my friends. We talk several times a week.

I've been on the monorail at Disney World carrying on an hour long conversation with a friend on the left coast.

I had a PC back in the early 70s, who was 12 at the time. She is now our loan broker. Her oldest boy is in college.

Her father, who is god father to one of our boys, wrote a recommendation letter for our youngest daughter to the grad school she wanted (and got). It doesn't hurt to have a Heisman Trophy QB writing a recommendation letter to his old school.

And if all the aforementioned isn't enough, my horses come when I call and my dog loves me.

As Goldie Hawn said, in "Private Benjamin," "I joined a different army"

The Scientology I was a member of had real connections with real people. That was in the 60s and 70s. Those who remained, or joined later, were, perhaps, inducted into a different mind set.

Back then, we sold relatively honest products, and delivered on them. That started to end, at least for me, in 1976. That's when I checked out. It hadn't become the Psycho Hotel yet, but it had crossed the line from help to greed.

 

[Panda Termint]

Lakey, with "friends" like that, who needs enemies?

 

[lkwdblds]

If this is boring what does exciting look like?

I'm obviously boring.

I get a birthday card every year from a guy I went to kindergarten with. I have more than one friend still from kindergarten days.

Which one of you had more gold stars up on the blackboard. Did you usually play the horse or the driver when you two played horsie?

My fist love from age 14 is still my friend. My pals from high school are still my pals.

The friends I made in my short stay in Scientology are still friends. My power auditor from 1969 is a friend. I was at his house two nights ago. He and his wife live three blocks from our youngest daughter.

We've been married for decades. The kids and grandkids come to our house for holidays.

My best friends from high school are still my friends. We talk several times a week.

I've been on the monorail at Disney World carrying on an hour long conversation with a friend on the left coast.

I had a PC back in the early 70s, who was 12 at the time. She is now our loan broker. Her oldest boy is in college.

Her father, who is god father to one of our boys, wrote a recommendation letter for our youngest daughter to the grad school she wanted (and got). It doesn't hurt to have a Heisman Trophy QB writing a recommendation letter to his old school.

And if all the aforementioned isn't enough, my horses come when I call and my dog loves me.

As Goldie Hawn said, in "Private Benjamin," "I joined a different army"

Is this any way to run an Army? Yes, it sounds like it is!

The Scientology I was a member of had real connections with real people. That was in the 60s and 70s. Those who remained, or joined later, were, perhaps, inducted into a different mind set.

Back then, we sold relatively honest products, and delivered on them. That started to end, at least for me, in 1976. That's when I checked out. It hadn't become the Psycho Hotel yet, but it had crossed the line from help to greed.

Relatively nice products is a good description of them. Many of the products could be life changers for the better. I think the good products were mostly on the tech side of the bridge, red on white. I once believed in the green on white admin products having a lot of merit as well but a third of a century of working and experiencing the end game of those products has caused me to be thoruoughly disabused of that notion. The tech products can still work miracles if applied properly in today's world, I just had something applied recently by an expert practitioner which changed me from a quivering mass of jelly, unable to sleep back to my calm stable self. It took about 30 minutes. How recently you ask, I say, how about last night.

Carmelo, your feats regarding your above achievments are not boring to me. Then again, it isn't just chance that you have such high personal and friendship stats because as I well recall, you demark the boundaries of your personal sphere of influence and then you check out every person who comes to lives inside your sphere. You use your dogs, your cat and your horses as sentinnels, alerting you to unchecked out intruders settling down in the space. If the new intruders do not pass your litmus test, you or your dogs or even your cat will run them out of the space. Everyone should apply this system but most of us don't have the abilities required to mock up our spaces on your pattern. Maybe if we tried your system some of us might be able to pull it off. I just had an interloper enter my world and wreak havoc and commit crimes while in my sphere. Had I been using your system, he would have been spotted and moved out of the sphere, months ago without doing any damage. I am going to give your system a try. I own a cat, but no dog or horses. I will have to put my cat on full time alert. Seriously, I am going to demark my space from here on out and try and do things your way. My goal is to be "boring" in the manner in which you are!
Lakey

 

[lkwdblds]

True, but this person is far from the all bad.

Lakey, with "friends" like that, who needs enemies?

Thanks for the comment, reluctantly, I have to agree with you. This person is far from all bad, he has a lot of personel charisma and is a decent guy and then some! He has a lot of friends, most people know him from somewhere of another in Scientology.

I just do not respect him because of his unwillingness to be brave and face the portion of his case that he shrinks away from and deals with by doing the "avoid" option of the Black Panther mechanism. It no longer matters to me, I got over him long ago. He has had 41 years in Scn to attack his case and get the upper hand over it. All the way up to Jan 1, 1999, the last time I saw him, he never attempted to be causitive over the part of his case which he feared and refused to confront. Its hard to respect that in a friend.
Lakey

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Big ongoing lesson in life for me!

Relatively nice products is a good description of them. Many of the products could be life changers for the better. I think the good products were mostly on the tech side of the bridge, red on white. I once believed in the green on white admin products having a lot of merit as well but a third of a century of working and experiencing the end game of those products has caused me to be thoruoughly disabused of that notion. The tech products can still work miracles if applied properly in today's world, I just had something applied recently by an expert practitioner which changed me from a quivering mass of jelly, unable to sleep back to my calm stable self. It took about 30 minutes. How recently you ask, I say, how about last night.

Carmelo, your feats regarding your above achievments are not boring to me. Then again, it isn't just chance that you have such high personal and friendship stats because as I well recall, you demark the boundaries of your personal sphere of influence and then you check out every person who comes to lives inside your sphere. You use your dogs, your cat and your horses as sentinnels, alerting you to unchecked out intruders settling down in the space. If the new intruders do not pass your litmus test, you or your dogs or even your cat will run them out of the space. Everyone should apply this system but most of us don't have the abilities required to mock up our spaces on your pattern. Maybe if we tried your system some of us might be able to pull it off. I just had an interloper enter my world and wreak havoc and commit crimes while in my sphere. Had I been using your system, he would have been spotted and moved out of the sphere, months ago without doing any damage. I am going to give your system a try. I own a cat, but no dog or horses. I will have to put my cat on full time alert. Seriously, I am going to demark my space from here on out and try and do things your way. My goal is to be "boring" in the manner in which you are!
Lakey

Heh...picturing Carmelo's watch cat!!!

I love really good friendships, ones that function to enrich eveybody's life experiences and last through thick and thin. I have been blessed in this life to enjoy many such friendships of all types, and am always happy to be making new friends in present time, also!

From my old girl scout days:

"Make new friends, but keep the old,
One is silver and the other gold!"

Lakey, I just want to say this about the interloper...it's a virtue to be patient and trusting with others, and to encourage others to do and to be their best, which you are and do in abundance...you tend to err on the side of including new friends in your life's sphere, as I do, until they prove themselves untrustworthy or not worth the effort somehow, when that happens they either get ejected or self-eject...

That's all that happened here...I'm sure Carmelo and family has had thier share of these over a lifetime, too... we all do... I know that others are upset about this, but don't you let their upset become your upset...don't take ownership of their upsets. Glad that process you experienced has helped you to recover your stability...and that things are calmer and happier for you...big hug to you know who!

The point for me is to not trust too unwisely and to limit my losses to something easily sustainable. Here is one point of the "tech" or Scientology philosophy that I accept and use to the extent of my ability (being the low-cast, no status pre-clear that I am )... (paraphrasing) "to be able to easily experience anything, and to make it easy for others to experience anything..." to me, that's a useful goal to aim for, moment by moment in life. Lakey, you are very good at doing that, in my experience with you...I hope that I can become more like you in some ways...

One of the biggest ongoing lessons and ongoing goals of my life is to know how to be both wise as a serpent, and harmless as a dove...

Still learning this lesson, day by day! I grok it is a process of continual refinement of skills and apprehension or perception.

 

[lkwdblds]

You are very aptly name and we thank you but.....

Heh...picturing Carmelo's watch cat!!!

I love really good friendships, ones that function to enrich eveybody's life experiences and last through thick and thin. I have been blessed in this life to enjoy many such friendships of all types, and am always happy to be making new friends in present time, also!

From my old girl scout days:

"Make new friends, but keep the old,
One is silver and the other gold!"

Lakey, I just want to say this about the interloper...it's a virtue to be patient and trusting with others, and to encourage others to do and to be their best, which you are and do in abundance...you tend to err on the side of including new friends in your life's sphere, as I do, until they prove themselves untrustworthy or not worth the effort somehow, when that happens they either get ejected or self-eject...

That's all that happened here...I'm sure Carmelo and family has had thier share of these over a lifetime, too... we all do... I know that others are upset about this, but don't you let their upset become your upset...don't take ownership of their upsets. Glad that process you experienced has helped you to recover your stability...and that things are calmer and happier for you...big hug to you know who!

The point for me is to not trust too unwisely and to limit my losses to something easily sustainable. Here is one point of the "tech" or Scientology philosophy that I accept and use to the extent of my ability (being the low-cast, no status pre-clear that I am )... (paraphrasing) "to be able to easily experience anything, and to make it easy for others to experience anything..." to me, that's a useful goal to aim for, moment by moment in life. Lakey, you are very good at doing that, in my experience with you...I hope that I can become more like you in some ways...

One of the biggest ongoing lessons and ongoing goals of my life is to know how to be both wise as a serpent, and harmless as a dove...

Do you really have a goal to be as harmless as a dove? Think that one through and make sure you really wish to pursue that goal.

Still learning this lesson, day by day! I grok it is a process of continual refinement of skills and apprehension or perception.

You are very aptly named and give so much support to people who mean well but usually just meaning well is no where near good enough. The old saying, "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions" rings so true.

LOOKING DEEPER vs FIGURING HARDER
Only since coming to ESMB a year ago have I begun to look deeper. Prior, I used to mainly figure-figure. Believe me, looking deeper is light years more effective than doing figure -figure. There is a price to pay which is that you have to confront things which are hard to confront. Things which are buried deeper are harder to confront by nature, it is sort of why they are buried deeper by definition.

If you can confront something unpleasant, such as that you have really been stupid and put loved ones and your business in jeopardy by being that way, despite the best of intentions, you are going to emerge as a more effective person. The same mistakes won't keep happening to you. That is my take on it.
Lakey

 

[Panda Termint]

Thanks for the comment, reluctantly, I have to agree with you. This person is far from all bad, he has a lot of personel charisma and is a decent guy and then some! He has a lot of friends, most people know him from somewhere of another in Scientology.

I just do not respect him because of his unwillingness to be brave and face the portion of his case that he shrinks away from and deals with by doing the "avoid" option of the Black Panther mechanism. It no longer matters to me, I got over him long ago. He has had 41 years in Scn to attack his case and get the upper hand over it. All the way up to Jan 1, 1999, the last time I saw him, he never attempted to be causitive over the part of his case which he feared and refused to confront. Its hard to respect that in a friend.
Lakey

I must be just getting cynical in my old age, I didn't buy the "he restimulates my case" excuse at all. I was thinking that it was more a case of "there's no FSMC/exchange in this cycle".

In my experience, most FSMs will usually put up with just about anything from a Selectee if there's a cycle and FSMC there.

BTW, I understand completely what you're saying about the guy being basically good. Aren't we all?