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Bill Frank's story about brainwashing (thread merge)

Amen John (BT's...), Emma and Synthia. It is incredible what happens in your psyche when one gets a whole picture. I mean I can deal with the shit that LRH did and spouted. DUH he was a man, a jerk and a good guy! But, you can't cover it up and whistle past the grave yard like nothing happened when so many people were and are hurt. And of course the piece de resistance is David Miscavage et al. embellishing the shit and torturing people! But can I tell you how I really feel. lol It's not a matter of me mocking it up or O/W's or Ser Facs ..... blah blah blah. It is what it is.http://www.forum.exscn.net/images/smilies/grouch.gif
 
TheSneakster said:
Content Not Available!

Apparently one has to be on the Friend's list of whomever's page to whom that link goes.

Whose page does that purport to be and what is their Facebook ID# (it's at the end of the URL in your address bar when you have browsed to their Facebook home page) ?
Click to expand...

OK, I had Robin Scott blocked on Facebook due to having to read his inflammatory content about some other friends of mine in my daily feed.

I have removed him from the block list and I can now read this thread.

I also see that the "Bill Franks" posting on that thread is the same one I have friended already.

Thanks for you patience.
 
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I for one have been thrilled to have Bill's post put up on the board.

Remember the tape "The Missed Missed Withold"? Hubbard explains that ALL ARCXs and ALL BPC stem from MWHs. At the time I bought it and it did seem to have some workability.

But if it was a universal truth then why did people still leave staff after all the sec checking on the leaving staff routing form? Why when they pulled MWHs to resolve one of the 15 manifestations of mwhs did the non optimum condition sometimes continue?

Best of all why did it sometimes resolve? Was it because all of the BPC had evaporated or was it because the "mark" now blamed themselves and vow to get their ethics in and make up for their shortcomings to the group?

When I was on the last couple of years of OTVII the MWH tech application was ramped up to pure abuse. I had several incidents that just defy logic.

One was an incident where an ARCX read in session and I simply spotted my "comm" was cut and that FNed. I was sent to find my MWH as I was "complaining", there was no complaint and certainly no bitterness to my observation. There also was no ref to back this, just a pig headed insistence. When I queried the C/S I was sent to correction at my own expense to discover that the mood was Flag wide and there was NO REFERENCE, other than all ARCXs stem from MWHs.

All of this opened the door to more sec checking nd more introversion, which is the goal of this operation as far as I can see.

When you think it's all your fault, like an abused wife you stick around trying to fix it.
 
Feral said:
I for one have been thrilled to have Bill's post put up on the board.

Remember the tape "The Missed Missed Withold"? Hubbard explains that ALL ARCXs and ALL BPC stem from MWHs. At the time I bought it and it did seem to have some workability.

But if it was a universal truth then why did people still leave staff after all the sec checking on the leaving staff routing form? Why when they pulled MWHs to resolve one of the 15 manifestations of mwhs did the non optimum condition sometimes continue?

Best of all why did it sometimes resolve? Was it because all of the BPC had evaporated or was it because the "mark" now blamed themselves and vow to get their ethics in and make up for their shortcomings to the group?

When I was on the last couple of years of OTVII the MWH tech application was ramped up to pure abuse. I had several incidents that just defy logic.

One was an incident where an ARCX read in session and I simply spotted my "comm" was cut and that FNed. I was sent to find my MWH as I was "complaining", there was no complaint and certainly no bitterness to my observation. There also was no ref to back this, just a pig headed insistence. When I queried the C/S I was sent to correction at my own expense to discover that the mood was Flag wide and there was NO REFERENCE, other than all ARCXs stem from MWHs.

All of this opened the door to more sec checking nd more introversion, which is the goal of this operation as far as I can see.

When you think it's all your fault, like an abused wife you stick around trying to fix it.
Click to expand...

Yup. As soon as I saw that simple little statement, the pieces fell into place for me. Everything I saw in that 30+ year stint within the mental walls made sense, for me and the things I saw others go through. It is diabolically awful actually, the harm caused to so many.

ps do you know the date of that tape? After 1974?
 
Free to shine said:
Yup. As soon as I saw that simple little statement, the pieces fell into place for me. Everything I saw in that 30+ year stint within the mental walls made sense, for me and the things I saw others go through. It is diabolically awful actually, the harm caused to so many.

ps do you know the date of that tape? After 1974?
Click to expand...

"The Missed Missed Withhold" was about a 45 minute rant. I think it was about 1966. It was at St. Hill to the briefing course. - just memory, I didn't look this up.
 
CarmeloOrchards said:
"The Missed Missed Withhold" was about a 45 minute rant. I think it was about 1966. It was at St. Hill to the briefing course. - just memory, I didn't look this up.
Click to expand...

That's interesting.
Presuming what Bill says is true, then Hubbard knew by 74 it wasn't right but kept on doing it anyway so scio wouldn't disappear. Perhaps a simple lie like that is the lynchpin of all the ethics crap and sec checking that created so much despair. :confused2:
 
Feral said:
I for one have been thrilled to have Bill's post put up on the board.

Remember the tape "The Missed Missed Withold"? Hubbard explains that ALL ARCXs and ALL BPC stem from MWHs. At the time I bought it and it did seem to have some workability.

But if it was a universal truth then why did people still leave staff after all the sec checking on the leaving staff routing form? Why when they pulled MWHs to resolve one of the 15 manifestations of mwhs did the non optimum condition sometimes continue?

Best of all why did it sometimes resolve? Was it because all of the BPC had evaporated or was it because the "mark" now blamed themselves and vow to get their ethics in and make up for their shortcomings to the group?

When I was on the last couple of years of OTVII the MWH tech application was ramped up to pure abuse. I had several incidents that just defy logic.

One was an incident where an ARCX read in session and I simply spotted my "comm" was cut and that FNed. I was sent to find my MWH as I was "complaining", there was no complaint and certainly no bitterness to my observation. There also was no ref to back this, just a pig headed insistence. When I queried the C/S I was sent to correction at my own expense to discover that the mood was Flag wide and there was NO REFERENCE, other than all ARCXs stem from MWHs.

All of this opened the door to more sec checking nd more introversion, which is the goal of this operation as far as I can see.

When you think it's all your fault, like an abused wife you stick around trying to fix it.
Click to expand...

Hubbard wrote and spoke a lot about Overts and Missed Withholds....too much, I think. About all you really need to know philosophically is in the "O\W - A Limited Theory" HCOB. If this story is true, then it is an admission that LRH was using "confessional tech" as a control mechanism, case gain being of secondary importance. And this IS the point of introversion that allows religions to "control"....ie: sin, redemption, original sin, etc. It's a nasty piece of business under any guise.

"The way to control people is to lie to them..."
 
Div6 said:
Hubbard wrote and spoke a lot about Overts and Missed Withholds....too much, I think. About all you really need to know philosophically is in the "O\W - A Limited Theory" HCOB. If this story is true, then it is an admission that LRH was using "confessional tech" as a control mechanism, case gain being of secondary importance. And this IS the point of introversion that allows religions to "control"....ie: sin, redemption, original sin, etc. It's a nasty piece of business under any guise.

"The way to control people is to lie to them..."
Click to expand...

Well said!
 
Posted it to various FZ forums. Then posted my opinion below.
bb


------------
I most definitely had the greatest good in mind by posting it.

First point, COS has gone way overboard making all wrong for their overts and never acknowledging their own. And much abusive sec checks, also using O/Ws from folder study to manipulate people into donating, and latterly more or less a Mafia type
effort of " an offer you can't refuse" to do the same and coerce people into whatever
Miscavidge wants.

This tech is mostly used as reverse tech.

On a tape, and havn't got a ref I'm afraid, maybe someone else has, LRH posited
a holocaust sit where he knew a way to escape and no one would follow him. He posited
that he would knock them out and drag them out of the compound. This type of action is writ on very much policy. Fair game and disconnection for obvious example and they have helped destroy the acceptance of tech everywhere.

LRH didn't always get things right. On his watch he usually corrected matters. Lets say often but not always.

The final arbiter is the tech itself. On the face of it leaving because of ARCX is a no brainer. Its part of the woof and warp of life.

Well I'm not much of a techie.

If one looks at the L1C, the correction lists for upsets, the first question is

" Has there been an error in listing"

The first of 39 questions. The C'S 53 starts with out int. These two areas are
considered the most powerful areas of charge and upset.

Note that list errors also include wrong indications. There is IMO no
organisation in the world that gives more wrong indications than COS. In the face of that its actually destructive NOT to leave.

Second L1C question,

" Has a Withold been missed."

I consider this a very valid question and the reason for some blows.



The tech says " All ARCX stem from missed witholds. "

This per the L1C seems false. Out lists and wrong indications are clearly far more abberative. And an obvious creator of ARCX. Having an ARCX it becomes very easy to
commit overts. And probably hard not to.

Note that LRH trusted this missive to two of his most trusted lieutenants and limited
severely its distribution. They were in a " Need to know" situation.

Its perhaps his greatest mistake to not fully describe this area of tech and give it a slant. He was looking to get greater expansion and control far more quickly than he achieved. And made other mistakes resulting in his going into hiding.

There is the comment of " Head on a pike" in ethics policies. Short term maybe workable, and correctable later. Was tried with amnesties.

A military type of organisation is it seems the wrong way to expound and expand a philosophy and a counseling technology.

bb
 
Update from Bill Franks

facebook

Bill sent you a message.

Bill FranksFebruary 26, 2011 at 7:02pm

Re: Telephone

I am the process of trying to register now and have been for 3 days. this is why I had asked my friend Greg Wells to do it for me. Thanks for your interest.Best, Bill
 
OK, I have just had an update from Bill Franks by Facebook PM confirming he did, in fact, ask Greg Wells to help him post the OP and that he stands by the story as true and factual.
 
Synthia said:
Infinite, my dear, on this one I would respectfully suggest that we graciously invite and then accept the man onto the board and hear everything he has to say. He has a wealth of knowledge and I, for one, want to hear every morsel of it and I also think it will do him a world of good to tell it.

You can then ask for as much documentation as the guy can possibly give, but, let's get him here and welcomed first before we DOX or STFU him away from even arriving. Would that be fair?:hug:
Click to expand...

I am happy to accept that from you, Synthia. Also, I've done a wee rummage and, yes, getting Frank here on ESMB would be fantastic. C'mon Frank, we need your experience and knowledge if we are ever to get to the bottom of this Scientology phenomena - WHO, WHAT, WHEN, WHERE and HOW - please.
 
Infinite said:
I am happy to accept that from you, Synthia. Also, I've done a wee rummage and, yes, getting Frank here on ESMB would be fantastic. C'mon Frank, we need your experience and knowledge if we are ever to get to the bottom of this Scientology phenomena - WHO, WHAT, WHEN, WHERE and HOW - please.
Click to expand...

:begging: :drama:
 
:)

Infinite said:
I am happy to accept that from you, Synthia. Also, I've done a wee rummage and, yes, getting Frank here on ESMB would be fantastic. C'mon Frank, we need your experience and knowledge if we are ever to get to the bottom of this Scientology phenomena - WHO, WHAT, WHEN, WHERE and HOW - please.
Click to expand...

I nominate Synthia for SP Ambassador! :thumbsup:

Meanwhile, waiting for :drama:
 
Infinite said:
I am happy to accept that from you, Synthia. Also, I've done a wee rummage and, yes, getting Frank here on ESMB would be fantastic. C'mon Frank, we need your experience and knowledge if we are ever to get to the bottom of this Scientology phenomena - WHO, WHAT, WHEN, WHERE and HOW - please.
Click to expand...

:thumbsup: Definitely....you rummager you :coolwink:
 
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