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Bill Frank's story about brainwashing (thread merge)

That seems so obvious to me.

Most people blow (leave) a job because of an upset (ARC Break) with their supervisor.
People blow out of relationships because of upsets.
People give up on studying a subject out of upset/frustration.

It's a very basic observation. :duh:


Think/observe for yourself.
 
DM_Slappface said:
That seems so obvious to me.

Most people blow (leave) a job because of an upset (ARC Break) with their supervisor.
People blow out of relationships because of upsets.
People give up on studying a subject out of upset/frustration.

It's a very basic observation. :duh:


Think/observe for yourself.
Click to expand...

Tripe!

Most people leave a job because of so many different reasons - because they find a better one, because someone offers them more money, because they moved, because they get laid off because they find they don;t like doing that kind of work - it's not because of some bogus "arc break" - don't make me laugh. Yes people do quit jobs over an upset but it is way less than you think.

As for people giving up on study - once again the range is long and complex and i have no doubt that a small percentage give up out of frustration but many more 'give up" because there are many other factors - I quit college because I had to go to work to support my family after my father had a heart attack for example. Others because they get bored with what they thought was going to be interesting or rewarding and who found out it was anything but.

I notce you only have six posts on here - you might want to realize who you are addressing. Many people on here have been through the florid Hubbardian sweeping idiotic generalizations - you don't need to repeat them, we already laughed at them.
 
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DM_Slappface said:
That seems so obvious to me.

Most people blow (leave) a job because of an upset (ARC Break) with their supervisor.
People blow out of relationships because of upsets.
People give up on studying a subject out of upset/frustration.

It's a very basic observation. :duh:


Think/observe for yourself.
Click to expand...

What Mick said above is far more true than Hubbard's fit all solution. There are some cases where leaving because of an upset is true but there are many more reasons. Sorry but this can't be bottled and handed out. The reason Hubbard came up with the ARC-X aligns more with getting people to invert their attention to themselves rather than any outside influence. This is important to Hubbard's organization because if you wanted to leave staff or blow your course then it's never Scientology's fault but the staff or public. Interestingly enough he also ties in ARC-X to withholds to further invert your attention. This is insidious stuff when you look at it and is mind control. I would suggest that you take time out to read about Hubbard's true nature. There are plenty of posts here on this subject and you can google to your heart's content on Hubbard.
 
Mick Wenlock said:
Tripe!

Most people leave a job because of so many different reasons - because they find a better one, because someone offers them more money, because they moved, because they get laid off because they find they don;t like doing that kind of work - it's not because of some bogus "arc break" don't make me laugh. Yes people do quit jobs over an upset but it is way less than you think.

As for people giving up on study - once again the range is long and complex and i have no doubt that a small percentage give up out of frustration but any more 'give up" because there are many other factors - I quite college because I had to go to work to support my family after my father had a heart attack for example. Others because they get bored with what they thought was going to be interesting or rewarding and who found out it was anything but.

I notce you only have six posts on here - you might want to realize who you are addressing many people on here have been through the florid Hubbardian sweeping idiotic generalizations - you don't need to repeat them, we already laughed at them.
Click to expand...

I've had plenty of upsets with people at jobs, but I liked the job so stayed. When I found a better one I left, it nothing to do with Hubbard's pretended knowledge of the mind.
 
Out-Ethics said:
What Mick said above is far more true than Hubbard's fit all solution. There are some cases where leaving because of an upset is true but there are many more reasons. Sorry but this can't be bottled and handed out. The reason Hubbard came up with the ARC-X aligns more with getting people to invert their attention to themselves rather than any outside influence. This is important to Hubbard's organization because if you wanted to leave staff or blow your course then it's never Scientology's fault but the staff or public. Interestingly enough he also ties in ARC-X to withholds to further invert your attention. This is insidious stuff when you look at it and is mind control. I would suggest that you take time out to read about Hubbard's true nature. There are plenty of posts here on this subject and you can google to your heart's content on Hubbard.
Click to expand...

This sums it up for me plus what you wrote and Mick:

While it is MORE sane to say people blow from ARC-Xs than to say they blow because of O/W's......that is not really the total picture either.

NAZI ALERT!

What if someone escaped a concentration camp?

Was it because they were ARC-Xen?

I don't think so.

That is a very odd, culty way to look at things.

They escaped because they were being tortured, terrorized and killed.

What's wrong with English?

So why did Scientologists "blow"?

The first part of the answer is THEY DID NOT BLOW.

They escaped.

And they didn't escape because of their "case" (ArcX, O/W, etc...)

They escaped because they became smart enough or strong enough to escape.

Or thru sheer desperate self-preservation.

That ain't no ArcX.

That's sanity.
Click to expand...

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthre...(thread-merge)&p=542584&viewfull=1#post542584
 
Just bumping this thread for any lurkers wondering about Bill Franks and why do people really blow. It's fascinating.
 
Mick Wenlock said:
Tripe!

Most people leave a job because of so many different reasons - because they find a better one, because someone offers them more money, because they moved, because they get laid off because they find they don;t like doing that kind of work - it's not because of some bogus "arc break" - don't make me laugh. Yes people do quit jobs over an upset but it is way less than you think.

As for people giving up on study - once again the range is long and complex and i have no doubt that a small percentage give up out of frustration but many more 'give up" because there are many other factors - I quit college because I had to go to work to support my family after my father had a heart attack for example. Others because they get bored with what they thought was going to be interesting or rewarding and who found out it was anything but.

I notce you only have six posts on here - you might want to realize who you are addressing. Many people on here have been through the florid Hubbardian sweeping idiotic generalizations - you don't need to repeat them, we already laughed at them.
Click to expand...

I agree that people normally leave jobs because of all kinds of reasons as you said. But staff in Scientology are not working on a normal job. Staff members have devoted their life to a great cause which they honestly do believe is a very noble and right cause. When they get betrayed on that it is certainly very upsetting. If there are overts connected as we were taught, well then the big overts are not more or less silly overts done by the staff member, it is overts done to him/her like the betrayal I mentioned. It is certainly upsetting, so in that sense it makes sense that ARC breaks plays a big role.

Scientology is build on a matrix that includes that leaving the organization whether you are staff or not is considered bad, so also those who study in the organizations without being staff are expected to stay and do more courses or in some other way be "on lines". In society outside it is totally normal that you can study a course, then graduate and leave the place and get on with your life. That is usually what you are expected or supposed to do. Thus leaving is no deal at all. But in an organization where leaving is a big deal, well?

***
 
Soul of Ginnungagab said:
I agree that people normally leave jobs because of all kinds of reasons as you said. But staff in Scientology are not working on a normal job. Staff members have devoted their life to a great cause which they honestly do believe is a very noble and right cause. When they get betrayed on that it is certainly very upsetting. If there are overts connected as we were taught, well then the big overts are not more or less silly overts done by the staff member, it is overts done to him/her like the betrayal I mentioned. It is certainly upsetting, so in that sense it makes sense that ARC breaks plays a big role.

Scientology is build on a matrix that includes that leaving the organization whether you are staff or not is considered bad, so also those who study in the organizations without being staff are expected to stay and do more courses or in some other way be "on lines". In society outside it is totally normal that you can study a course, then graduate and leave the place and get on with your life. That is usually what you are expected or supposed to do. Thus leaving is no deal at all. But in an organization where leaving is a big deal, well?

***
Click to expand...

And that, as you state is Hubbard's brainwashing, or loyalty to scientology.
 
Before I got involved with Scientology it was considered pretty much common knowledge that people often leave, or at least begin to consider other options, when they are upset.
Or in other words ARC broken.
Might be a divorce where there is sufficient upset to where the partners are no longer desiring to share the same space.
Any number of upsets could get a person to at the very least begin looking for a change of space.
However, it just flabbergasts me that people can become so misled as to think that "hey, I want to find greener pastures, Oh boy, I must have committed some overts".
My god, what kind of deep hypnosis are people under that they no longer can grasp simple, basic truths that upsets often set the stage for desire of change.
I guess that rewording upset as ARC break removes it from one's common sense reservoir/repository and someone with a vested interest in keeping you trapped then goes so far as to make you think that the desire to be elsewhere always comes from having committed overts.
All the horseshit of Scientology is built upon this false platform and premise and that so many people still buy it even once they renounce Scientology is what I find so unbelievable.
I learned about ARC breaks from Scientology books before I got on lines and never did buy into the O/W crap as "always the case" for what Hubbard called "blows". Sure, it's at times the case but no assumptions should be made on that account.
Unless you wish to introvert someone into such a spin that they become cowed and thus incapable of a blow!
To me it was still about ARC breaks, upsets, when I didn't feel comfortable enough in a space that I at least began to look for alternatives because that's what words of wisdom I'd already gained from Scientology basic books.
And they couldn't change my mind about any of it in post "72 Scientology's "new tech".
Plus, if overts or withholds caused blows then senior management positions would have been vacant for years if not decades.
There are as many reasons for changing spaces as there are sets of circumstances and individuals in the differing sets of circumstances, no way of assuming it's for any one reason at all.
Doesn't have to be caused by an upset either, could actually be from rationally/sanely determined decisions including having the ability and right to change one's mind.
 
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Yeh, Dag . . . in the mid-1960's we had a designated auditor called the "ARCX Auditor" whose job it was to go into the field and handle the ARCX's of those who'd dropped "off lines" . . . at the time Hubbs had written that those in "the field" and not on lines were ARC Broken . . . so clean them up at no cost!

When the mantra became that they "blew because of overts" I dunno . . . but that was the moment Scientology turned from any semblance of help to destructive domination.

R
 
RogerB said:
Yeh, Dag . . . in the mid-1960's we had a designated auditor called the "ARCX Auditor" whose job it was to go into the field and handle the ARCX's of those who'd dropped "off lines" . . . at the time Hubbs had written that those in "the field" and not on lines were ARC Broken . . . so clean them up at no cost!

When the mantra became that they "blew because of overts" I dunno . . . but that was the moment Scientology turned from any semblance of help to destructive domination.

R
Click to expand...
We had that in the 70's too, Rog. I did some of it myself. I got a fair number of people in session, but I never succeeded in getting anyone to come back! I think that was because I didn't really believe they'd be better off if they did. (And the people I was "recovering" were slowly pulling me out ...)

After I got out myself -- not just off staff but completely away from scn -- the feeling of relief was so great that I couldn't see how anyone could choose scn over the thrill of just living like a normal person.
 
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RogerB said:
Scientology turned from any semblance of help to destructive domination.
Click to expand...
I think that if we view that EL Con was a confidence man as exposed in his 1930's letter to Polly, his Affirmations of 1946 or so, and someone who I can't remember at this moment but he said that the raconteur Hubbard was telling fabulous stories of his experiences which would have required 800 years of living yet hubbard was but in his 20's, then we can see that the semblance of help was but a tool in his bag of tricks to gain confidence and then eventually make slaves of all that he could and put himself 'ON TOP' as any narcissistic personality does by the use of how people are affected by various pieces of psychology. Malignant megalomania apply here.
Also SHUKex mentioned the amount of work hubbard put into scientology. I see that as evidence of hubbard mania. His manic compulsions of bullshitting and fantasy creations again to put hisself 'ON TOP'. His neurosis as well and his psychotic behaviour also fueled his paranoia.
Always Attack, Attack was most certainly not humanitarian.


But then again he was not a human from earth but rather an alien here, to harvest the elan vital of the human species, so his species could accomplish the most fundamental purpose in its life. SURVIVE!!! LOL
 
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