The highest OT level

[Ulduz]

Thanks for detailing how you are getting the results you are claiming.

Have you ever heard of "False Memory Syndrome"?

If so, what are your thoughts regarding it? How would you guard against it in your practice?

I'd be interested in case studies where this was used, and people recalled events that could be objectively confirmed, or where their language use was objectively verified.

In all my years (20) of delivering sessions, I have never once had someone recall something from a past life that was objectively verifiable, or had them speaking in languages other than the ones they spoke prior to start of session. I have had some great results where the client departed feeling that their condition was improved, and confirmation from them, later, to the effect that they still thought so, but I've never had the sort of results you are describing. If what you are describing is valid, it would forever change modern science and people's understanding of the universe. In order to find out how the universe began, all we'd have to do is say "go back to a period 14.8 billion years ago and describe what you see and feel". I find this to be an extraordinary claim. I would also find it extremely unlikely that you could have anyone tell you exactly what they were doing or thinking at any arbitrarily chosen time, particularly as that time got further and further away from the present moment.

For instance, I invite all readers to try a simple exercise:

"recall exactly what you were doing six years, seven months, three weeks, four days, eleven hours, 48 minutes and fifteen seconds ago".

If you CAN do that, I would posit that is extraordinary, and you are likely a very high functioning autistic person with unique recollective abilities. If, like me, you'd have to do a lot of calculating, shifting an sorting memories around, comparing them to your resume or calendar, and still don't recall the exact activity, but know kind of where you were within a few miles, and what your job was, etc., that might help pin it down, but would you be SURE? And if you could actually go back to that moment, physically, do you think what you recalled would be identical to the situation you found? Would you bet your life on it? Would you base your beliefs and present goals on the accuracy of that memory?

I sure wouldn't.

BTW, I did this exercise, and I did come up with sensory impressions and a narrative for them. They might even be correct. However, I wouldn't pretend it was a certainty.

Yes, I heard about the False Memory Syndrome. I believe it does not include the ability to speak foreign languages unknown to the Subject in this life -- this is your guard from the syndrome.
As I said before, Scientology auditing is a distorted Buddhist past life recall procedure, so it does not surprise me that your pc auditing did not produce valid results. All it can produce is a “sperm dream” in Hubbard’s terminology, if you know what I mean (I was a Dianetics auditor, too, and my auditing was just as lousy as yours.)
You cannot send your Subject, or pc, back to the moment when the Universe came to be for obvious reason -- he did not exist at that time. If he claims that he sees the creation of universe, then he is hallucinating, and you, as an auditor, caused his temporarily insanity.
This is what Buddha said to one of his disciples who could not recall his past life no matter how hard he tried, “Some people have past lives, some do not. This is your first appearance to the world, do not expect any past life recall”
We, the Westerners, live in Christian countries; the public is being taught by the priests that past lives do not exist, so do not expect fundamental changes in our societies.
“recall exactly what you were doing six years, seven months, three weeks, four days, eleven hours, 48 minutes and fifteen seconds ago".
If you follow the procedure I described, sooner or later you will be able to do exactly just that, I guarantee it. That won’t make you autistic, just a person with a perfect memory. By the way, nothing is forgotten by a person, he just does not know his true abilities. But that is a different topic.

 

[Voltaire's Child]

But of course Hubbard was not one of these people who happened to be overwhelmed by the famous historical figures by claimed to be in a past life, he really was those famous historical figures in his past lives.

Which ones did he claim to be? I can think of one, anyway-- Buddha.

 

[uniquemand]

Yes, I heard about the False Memory Syndrome. I believe it does not include the ability to speak foreign languages unknown to the Subject in this life -- this is your guard from the syndrome.
As I said before, Scientology auditing is a distorted Buddhist past life recall procedure, so it does not surprise me that your pc auditing did not produce valid results. All it can produce is a “sperm dream” in Hubbard’s terminology, if you know what I mean (I was a Dianetics auditor, too, and my auditing was just as lousy as yours.)
You cannot send your Subject, or pc, back to the moment when the Universe came to be for obvious reason -- he did not exist at that time. If he claims that he sees the creation of universe, then he is hallucinating, and you, as an auditor, caused his temporarily insanity.
This is what Buddha said to one of his disciples who could not recall his past life no matter how hard he tried, “Some people have past lives, some do not. This is your first appearance to the world, do not expect any past life recall”
We, the Westerners, live in Christian countries; the public is being taught by the priests that past lives do not exist, so do not expect fundamental changes in our societies.
“recall exactly what you were doing six years, seven months, three weeks, four days, eleven hours, 48 minutes and fifteen seconds ago".
If you follow the procedure I described, sooner or later you will be able to do exactly just that, I guarantee it. That won’t make you autistic, just a person with a perfect memory. By the way, nothing is forgotten by a person, he just does not know his true abilities. But that is a different topic.

I didn't say that my auditing (when I did it) didn't produce valid results. It just didn't push people back to past lives, and they didn't demonstrate the abilities you have claimed for your clients.

The technique you described specifically asks a person to go to 2 hours before their last death (at one point). If the Buddha said some people do not have past lives (and I don't know much about what Buddha did or didn't say), then why would you give someone such an instruction, knowing, as you say, that this would cause them to hallucinate?

My point, with regard to past lives, is that pushing them into them, at all, is both unnecessary and counter-productive. I just follow where my client's attention goes, and help them unstick it from there, help them focus on what they want to focus on. I think the focus on past lives is a distraction based on a belief system that people have them and resolving them is necessary for present peace and understanding. If a person "goes into a past life" on their own, well, I certainly wouldn't stop them. I would just have them look, report, and discharge whatever was compulsive, until they were showing signs of being back here, now, with some sort of cognitive shift and affect improvement.

 

[Voltaire's Child]

You'll be happy to know, I'm sure, that Hubbard was one of the very first people to ever attempt to address the false memory syndrome...

Just sayin'.

 

[uniquemand]

You'll be happy to know, I'm sure, that Hubbard was one of the very first people to ever attempt to address the false memory syndrome...

Just sayin'.

Yep, you're just sayin', because it ain't true. He was at least sixty years after Freud doing the same, or other "alienists". Hubbard was also responsible for GENERATING lots of false memory syndrome, including his own, IMO.

 

[Ulduz]

I didn't say that my auditing (when I did it) didn't produce valid results. It just didn't push people back to past lives, and they didn't demonstrate the abilities you have claimed for your clients.

The technique you described specifically asks a person to go to 2 hours before their last death (at one point). If the Buddha said some people do not have past lives (and I don't know much about what Buddha did or didn't say), then why would you give someone such an instruction, knowing, as you say, that this would cause them to hallucinate?

My point, with regard to past lives, is that pushing them into them, at all, is both unnecessary and counter-productive. I just follow where my client's attention goes, and help them unstick it from there, help them focus on what they want to focus on. I think the focus on past lives is a distraction based on a belief system that people have them and resolving them is necessary for present peace and understanding. If a person "goes into a past life" on their own, well, I certainly wouldn't stop them. I would just have them look, report, and discharge whatever was compulsive, until they were showing signs of being back here, now, with some sort of cognitive shift and affect improvement.

If a person does not have a past live, he is seeing a blinding white light when he is asked to go into a past live, no harm is done, this is time to stop. At least this is how this situation is described in the Buddhist texts. All my clients had past lives, which does not surprise me -- people who do not have past lives usually are not interested in this topic and not looking forward to regression sessions.
An individual wants to learn more about himself, this is natural curiosity, which brings him to the regression sessions. I do not think that anything is wrong with it as far as correct past lives recall procedures are used. I know that there is plenty of abuse in this field, and the ones who abuse their patients are the ones who bilk them. I could give plenty of examples of such abuse, including the so-called “future lives planning and recall”. But it is unfair to accuse everyone in the field of causing harm because of a handful of charlatans.

 

[Voltaire's Child]

Yep, you're just sayin', because it ain't true. He was at least sixty years after Freud doing the same, or other "alienists". Hubbard was also responsible for GENERATING lots of false memory syndrome, including his own, IMO.

I said one of the first people. Not the first person.

 

[lkwdblds]

Which ones did he claim to be? I can think of one, anyway-- Buddha.

The only one I know for sure, other than Buddha, is Cecil B. Rhodes for whom the country Rhodesia was named (now Zimbawe) and also the person who set up the Rhode's Scholarship. He made his fortune in diamond mines.

What do you think? Do you see a resemblance?

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q...1C2E1D90885B6C8EC62DE2FF1&first=0&FORM=IDFRIR

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q...9B7A419038DEEB3C2477F2484032DC8BBF708&first=0

I can't get the pictures to stay up but only show the links to them. Check it out and you see quite a resemblance, or at least I do.

He also claims in a taped lecture that he was a Hessian soldier, an officer, working with the British Army in the U.S Revolutionary War. He mentioned that at the Battle of Breed's Hill around 1775, he killed one of the top U.S. Generals, a General Prescott. It turns out that General Prescott was only wounded at Breed's Hill and recovered and went on to become a U.S. congressman, while living all the way up to 1795.

This faux pas of LRH's was reported to C of S management and they altered the passage where LRH got his history wrong and simply edited it out of the lecture on their most recent release of their new CD's.
Lakey

 

[Mark A. Baker]

The only one I know for sure, other than Buddha, ...

I am unaware of any claim by Hubbard to have been the Buddha, i.e. Gautama Siddhartha. His poem 'Hymn of Asia" advanced his claim to be the legendary Maitreya, a mythic student of Siddhartha who has tradtionally been prophesied as returning some 2000 years after Siddhartha as a future Buddha.


Mark A. Baker

 

[GoNuclear]

You'll be happy to know, I'm sure, that Hubbard was one of the very first people to ever attempt to address the false memory syndrome...

Just sayin'.

Exactly. He exploited it. People remembered what he told them to remember, in auditing. I know I did. I'm sure most of the folks on here had the same experience. I'll have to promote the technique as part of my "Make Money In Cults" TV offer success kit.

Pete

 

[Veda]

According to Annie Broeker, as announced by her at an event around 1987, Hubbard was also Arp Cola, the inventor of music at the beginning - or just before the beginning - of time. There was some kind of a tie in with the 'Road to Freedom' music album, since Hubbard, as the inventor of music, had included some of his original Arp Cola melodies.

 

[LongTimeGone]

I think you mean Cecil John Rhodes. Cecil B. was the movie director and the father of Richard DeMille who, supposedly, while a Dianetics enthusiast, wrote 'How to Live though an Executive', 'Essay on Management', and 'Essay on Authoritarianism', with Hubbard adding some finishing touches.

According to Annie Broeker, as announced by her at an event around 1987, Hubbard was also Arp Cola, the inventor of music at the beginning - or just before the beginning - of time. There was some kind of a tie in with the 'Road to Freedom' music album, since Hubbard, as the inventor of music, had included some of his original Arp Cola melodies.

If that's the case it's a wonder music ever caught on.

LTG

 

[Veda]

If that's the case it's a wonder music ever caught on.

LTG

By the way, I deleted the reference to Richard DeMille and his writings, since I only have the word of an old timer (long passed) on this, but it would be interesting if anyone had any info on DeMille's ghost writing for Hubbard.

 

[LongTimeGone]

By the way, I deleted the reference to Richard DeMille and his writings, since I only have the word of an old timer (long passed) on this, but it would be interesting if anyone had any info on DeMille's ghost writing for Hubbard.

No mention of being a ghost writer but this is interesting.

The first sentence on tape 1 indicated to me.

"I read the article [on Dianetics] in Astounding SF and made the mistake of believing it had been written by an honest person."

http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Library/Shelf/miller/interviews/demille.htm

LTG

 

[Ulduz]

I am unaware of any claim by Hubbard to have been the Buddha, i.e. Gautama Siddhartha. His poem 'Hymn of Asia" advanced his claim to be the legendary Maitreya, a mythic student of Siddhartha who has tradtionally been prophesied as returning some 2000 years after Siddhartha as a future Buddha.


Mark A. Baker

Some believe that Maitreya is Jesus Christ, which would make Hubbard our Lord and Savior.

 

[lkwdblds]

I heard this also.

According to Annie Broeker, as announced by her at an event around 1987, Hubbard was also Arp Cola, the inventor of music at the beginning - or just before the beginning - of time. There was some kind of a tie in with the 'Road to Freedom' music album, since Hubbard, as the inventor of music, had included some of his original Arp Cola melodies.

Interesting tidbit. I heard this information also, in voice and not in print but I don't remember where, only that it had something to do with "Road to Freedom" music album release. I thought the name was "Polo", similar to Marco Polo of history.

I remember it being said that Cola reasoned that as long as beings were going to be living in a time stream, their time in this Universe should be made as pleasant as possible and so he composed the first tune, thus starting music. I believe that one of the LRH songs in the album was claimed to be the tune created by Cola near the beginning of the time track.
Lakey

 

[Voltaire's Child]

Exactly. He exploited it. People remembered what he told them to remember, in auditing. I know I did. I'm sure most of the folks on here had the same experience. I'll have to promote the technique as part of my "Make Money In Cults" TV offer success kit.

Pete

I was referring to the bulletins regarding "dub in".

 

[lkwdblds]

Thanks for pointing this out!l

I am unaware of any claim by Hubbard to have been the Buddha, i.e. Gautama Siddhartha. His poem 'Hymn of Asia" advanced his claim to be the legendary Maitreya, a mythic student of Siddhartha who has tradtionally been prophesied as returning some 2000 years after Siddhartha as a future Buddha.


Mark A. Baker

You know, you are right! I never looked up Maitreya, and just assumed that it meant the returned version of Buddha. It is good to get this cleared up, Thanks.

Still, I do recall anecdotes from at list one story, where the writer claimed that LRH had told them that he was Buddha. I believe it is the Kima Douglas story where this was mentioned. In Kima's story, Hubbard definitely told her that he was Cecil Rhodes. He purchased a hat reminiscent of hats which Rhodes wore and liked to wear it from time to time. The thing is that if he told people that he was Buddha and also claimed in "The Hymn of Asia" that he was Maitreya, that would be a contradiction.
Lakey

 

[Ulduz]

According to Annie Broeker, as announced by her at an event around 1987, Hubbard was also Arp Cola, the inventor of music at the beginning - or just before the beginning - of time. There was some kind of a tie in with the 'Road to Freedom' music album, since Hubbard, as the inventor of music, had included some of his original Arp Cola melodies.

Right after that announcement Annie and her husband, Pat Broeker, went to the most hideous RPF -- the one located in desert. Apparently, they messed up words in Hubbard’s song.

 

[Veda]

I am unaware of any claim by Hubbard to have been the Buddha, i.e. Gautama Siddhartha. His poem 'Hymn of Asia" advanced his claim to be the legendary Maitreya, a mythic student of Siddhartha who has tradtionally been prophesied as returning some 2000 years after Siddhartha as a future Buddha.


Mark A. Baker

I can be addressed
But in our temples best
Address me and you address
Lord Buddha.
Address Lord Buddha
And you then address
Metteyya.

L. Ron Hubbard, from 'Hymn of Asia'