The Little Thread Which Grew - the Apollo '73 to Everything But
- Thread starter lkwdblds
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CarmeloOrchards
Crusader
Robert Townsend, the author of "Up the Organization" (the memoirs of his days running Avis Rent a Car), branded his company with this slogan:
"We Try Harder"
The Magic Thetan
Patron with Honors
It may some kind of cosmic joke, but it is very real to me. Love john
Dulloldfart
Squirrel Extraordinaire
John, another suggestion. You say you don't have time to answer questions and that you are spending too much time here. I believe you, by the way.
Then you write pretty posts with carefully chosen fonts and designs and smilies, that adds much time to the process of just typing words.
*And* you casually toss in little snippets of new information that are likely to prompt further questions. There are two items in just a couple of hours that I would normally jump on and query.
I agree with you. Go take a break for a week or something, get enough sleep, get your work caught up. You have shown that you aren't scared of us. Good for you.
Paul
Then you write pretty posts with carefully chosen fonts and designs and smilies, that adds much time to the process of just typing words.
*And* you casually toss in little snippets of new information that are likely to prompt further questions. There are two items in just a couple of hours that I would normally jump on and query.
I agree with you. Go take a break for a week or something, get enough sleep, get your work caught up. You have shown that you aren't scared of us. Good for you.
Paul
Dulloldfart
Squirrel Extraordinaire
Yeah. It was a famous positioning ploy cashing in on "support for the underdog."
But the Apollo thread is the only thread being bandied about as the greatest thing on ESMB, so I would think you already own the #1 spot.
Paul
CarmeloOrchards
Crusader
lkwdblds
Crusader
That was just my opinion, I would not act on that.....
That quote about giving the impressions that the antagonistic people won (in blue above) was just my opinion. Two people have pm'ed me and had opposing opinions. I've changed my mind and don't believe my initial opinion was correct. In any case, it was only an opinion or snap judgement and was never a strong recommendation.
Double post? All I know is to state in the first sentence that you are posting it on two threads. Maybe Paul or someone more tech savy knows a better way to do it.
Lakey
I was advised to double post from the beginning. Now I am told that if i only post on Apollo site, it will give the impression that the antagonistic people won.
I just want to please everyone. Got any idea how I pull that off.
Tell me how to indicate if it's a double post. Do I just say at the beginning of the post that it is a double post?
Thanks for wanting to assist. I am just getting some who want me to do it one way, and other who want me to do just the opposite.
That quote about giving the impressions that the antagonistic people won (in blue above) was just my opinion. Two people have pm'ed me and had opposing opinions. I've changed my mind and don't believe my initial opinion was correct. In any case, it was only an opinion or snap judgement and was never a strong recommendation.
Double post? All I know is to state in the first sentence that you are posting it on two threads. Maybe Paul or someone more tech savy knows a better way to do it.
Lakey
Quote from the book Mindrace which is exerpted in the above link:
We think that giving away your mind is too high a price to pay for psychic development.
LOL. I don't think I'll be the only one to see the supreme iroony in that statement!
Ted
Gold Meritorious Patron
Remind You of Anyone?
From the article, "Spiritless Humans."
"Their behavior tends toward being glib, shallow, egotistical, narcissistic, mundane, predatory, and materialistic. Sometimes these traits are camouflaged by a polished social exterior, but anyone with a discerning eye can see through the disguise. They lack individuality, independent thinking, and are strongly biased toward holding a herd mentality. They lack comprehension of anything beyond the material sphere of the five senses, and have no interest in such metaphysical matters except as flashy accessories to boost their social image. They also appear entirely incapable of empathy, soul-searching, and willful self-sacrifice. Nevertheless, in the presence of others they can put on a flashy show of concern, distress, or altruism for purposes of social manipulation; for example, crocodile tears to elicit sympathy, or doing something nice for another solely to guilt trip them later and extort a favor.
"Psychically scanning their consciousness reveals something interesting. There is a certain simplicity, flatness, and inertness to their essence, even if their intellects are highly developed. Unlike other people, their conscious energy is more diffuse, dull, impermanent, and amorphous rather than solid, sparkling, crystallized, and concentrated. Put another way, their minds are like sand castles instead of real castles. There is something animalistic and rudimentary piloting their bodies. It seems they have conscious awareness just as plants and animals do, but not conscious self-awareness as humans are supposed to have. There is an important difference between awareness and self-awareness."
Interesting article, long and interesting.
Spiritless Humans
From the article, "Spiritless Humans."
"Their behavior tends toward being glib, shallow, egotistical, narcissistic, mundane, predatory, and materialistic. Sometimes these traits are camouflaged by a polished social exterior, but anyone with a discerning eye can see through the disguise. They lack individuality, independent thinking, and are strongly biased toward holding a herd mentality. They lack comprehension of anything beyond the material sphere of the five senses, and have no interest in such metaphysical matters except as flashy accessories to boost their social image. They also appear entirely incapable of empathy, soul-searching, and willful self-sacrifice. Nevertheless, in the presence of others they can put on a flashy show of concern, distress, or altruism for purposes of social manipulation; for example, crocodile tears to elicit sympathy, or doing something nice for another solely to guilt trip them later and extort a favor.
"Psychically scanning their consciousness reveals something interesting. There is a certain simplicity, flatness, and inertness to their essence, even if their intellects are highly developed. Unlike other people, their conscious energy is more diffuse, dull, impermanent, and amorphous rather than solid, sparkling, crystallized, and concentrated. Put another way, their minds are like sand castles instead of real castles. There is something animalistic and rudimentary piloting their bodies. It seems they have conscious awareness just as plants and animals do, but not conscious self-awareness as humans are supposed to have. There is an important difference between awareness and self-awareness."
Interesting article, long and interesting.
Spiritless Humans
lkwdblds
Crusader
what's your honest opinion Paul?
Paul, now what is your honest opinion? Is their any other thread equal to us or better than us or do you believe a thread should just take up one set topic, discuss it thoroughly until it dies out and then the thread comes to an end.
When I say equal or better to us, I am talking about variety of topics discussed, depth of a topic once under discussion, the professionalism of the posts, the aesthetics of the discussions including beautiful usage of language, photos, videos and music, also the entertainment value and humor, and finally, AND THIS IS THE BIG ONE, did anyone change their opinion and/or learn anything? Did someone have an epiphany or blow any trapped charge or confusion from their mind?
Carmelo pointed out to me by phone just yesterday that we are always here for people every day, right at or near the top of the lists. Let's say a thread discussed a specific topic, say similarities and differences between Buddhism and Scientology. A reader remembers having read that thread and to him it seems like 5 to 6 months ago. The person just read some new information that really applied to this topic and wants to go back and post. First of all, he can't find the friggin thread. He thinks it was written by Carmel. He goes to her CP, hits a review of all her posts, goes back 6 months and starts coming forward, he can't find the Buddhism post. Maybe he finds it, maybe he doesn't. Even if he finds it and leaves a new reply, no one is reading the thread anymore, everyone has moved on.
With us, we are always here, the same group of poster is still around, except in growing numbers. There are advantages to having a big continuing thread!
The only one that is like us in the area of being a continuing thread is the FCDC thread. The Idenics thread, Bea Kiddos thread and perhaps the two word thread are also coninuing. Of those, only Idenics and Bea Kiddos are of high quality. The 2 word thread is very limited in what it can do and FCDC has mainly a lot of short one liner joking type of posts. It seems to be a lot of fun for the guys who were around FCDC in the early 1970's but not too much more than that. Idenics and Bea's thread are quality threads, they stick pretty much on topic and still get a few hits every day. The "I am a Scientologist" thread seemed to generate an extreme amount of interest for quite a few months and has some quality posts on it. I don't know, with only two or three possible exceptions, we have no serious competitors that I know of. If you can think on some, please point them out to me.
Lakey
Paul, now what is your honest opinion? Is their any other thread equal to us or better than us or do you believe a thread should just take up one set topic, discuss it thoroughly until it dies out and then the thread comes to an end.
When I say equal or better to us, I am talking about variety of topics discussed, depth of a topic once under discussion, the professionalism of the posts, the aesthetics of the discussions including beautiful usage of language, photos, videos and music, also the entertainment value and humor, and finally, AND THIS IS THE BIG ONE, did anyone change their opinion and/or learn anything? Did someone have an epiphany or blow any trapped charge or confusion from their mind?
Carmelo pointed out to me by phone just yesterday that we are always here for people every day, right at or near the top of the lists. Let's say a thread discussed a specific topic, say similarities and differences between Buddhism and Scientology. A reader remembers having read that thread and to him it seems like 5 to 6 months ago. The person just read some new information that really applied to this topic and wants to go back and post. First of all, he can't find the friggin thread. He thinks it was written by Carmel. He goes to her CP, hits a review of all her posts, goes back 6 months and starts coming forward, he can't find the Buddhism post. Maybe he finds it, maybe he doesn't. Even if he finds it and leaves a new reply, no one is reading the thread anymore, everyone has moved on.
With us, we are always here, the same group of poster is still around, except in growing numbers. There are advantages to having a big continuing thread!
The only one that is like us in the area of being a continuing thread is the FCDC thread. The Idenics thread, Bea Kiddos thread and perhaps the two word thread are also coninuing. Of those, only Idenics and Bea Kiddos are of high quality. The 2 word thread is very limited in what it can do and FCDC has mainly a lot of short one liner joking type of posts. It seems to be a lot of fun for the guys who were around FCDC in the early 1970's but not too much more than that. Idenics and Bea's thread are quality threads, they stick pretty much on topic and still get a few hits every day. The "I am a Scientologist" thread seemed to generate an extreme amount of interest for quite a few months and has some quality posts on it. I don't know, with only two or three possible exceptions, we have no serious competitors that I know of. If you can think on some, please point them out to me.
Lakey
lkwdblds
Crusader
How dare the author write about ESMB regulars and not give credit to them!
How dare the author of this piece write about a large block of ESMB posters and not reveal his sources or give credit to those who he is refering to! Well, to be accurate, this type of person is found all over the Internet and beyond, in the Colleges, Universities, Political News Forums such as those on CNN, Fox, ABC, CBS and NBC, etc.
I'm am wondering if the correct adjective for them is "spiritless", or if it should be "negative spirit". It seems there is some sort of spirit there but a spirit dwelling on negative energies who is anxious to make all others kindred spirits to himself or herself.
Lakey
How dare the author of this piece write about a large block of ESMB posters and not reveal his sources or give credit to those who he is refering to! Well, to be accurate, this type of person is found all over the Internet and beyond, in the Colleges, Universities, Political News Forums such as those on CNN, Fox, ABC, CBS and NBC, etc.
I'm am wondering if the correct adjective for them is "spiritless", or if it should be "negative spirit". It seems there is some sort of spirit there but a spirit dwelling on negative energies who is anxious to make all others kindred spirits to himself or herself.
Lakey
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The Magic Thetan
Patron with Honors
The Magic Thetan's Birthday Post
Tomorrow the 4th of August 2010 will be my birthday. I am not sure if it was a good idea to come to this planet and reality, but I did, so I am working to make the best of it.
In celebration, I would like to submit my Johnny Raff Chronicle Number - 2, and since it is my birthday, I would like it if those of you who choose to be “less than kind” with my first submission, would give me a break, and not the kind of break that breaks something dear to me.
Ron once said that as auditors we should neither believe or disbelieve what the preclear says. We should simply accept, duplicate, understand and acknowledge in a way that demonstrates sincere respect of the person and for everything they have to say. I fully subscribe to the idea that one should be allowed to do whatever they damn well please. Well as I have discovered, many ESMB members subscribe fully to that idea also. So you will of course respond however you respond, and I promise to respect that. However, if you wish to give me a break this time, I will most sincerely appreciate it.
I plan to submit all 18 pages of Chronicle Number two, but I will break it into parts with red titles so you can digest it in pieces if you prefer to do it that way..
I plan to post it sometime in the wee hours of the morning when most people sleep. That way I can duck out before any shit hits the fan.
As always, I wish you all you wish for yourself.
Love,
The Magic Thetan
Tomorrow the 4th of August 2010 will be my birthday. I am not sure if it was a good idea to come to this planet and reality, but I did, so I am working to make the best of it.In celebration, I would like to submit my Johnny Raff Chronicle Number - 2, and since it is my birthday, I would like it if those of you who choose to be “less than kind” with my first submission, would give me a break, and not the kind of break that breaks something dear to me.
Ron once said that as auditors we should neither believe or disbelieve what the preclear says. We should simply accept, duplicate, understand and acknowledge in a way that demonstrates sincere respect of the person and for everything they have to say. I fully subscribe to the idea that one should be allowed to do whatever they damn well please. Well as I have discovered, many ESMB members subscribe fully to that idea also. So you will of course respond however you respond, and I promise to respect that. However, if you wish to give me a break this time, I will most sincerely appreciate it.
I plan to submit all 18 pages of Chronicle Number two, but I will break it into parts with red titles so you can digest it in pieces if you prefer to do it that way..
I plan to post it sometime in the wee hours of the morning when most people sleep. That way I can duck out before any shit hits the fan.
As always, I wish you all you wish for yourself.
Love,The Magic Thetan
Panda Termint
Cabal Of One
You're treading shaky ground there, Lakey.
I'll be back to check out the damage later.
Ted
Gold Meritorious Patron
"Very interesting" - Arte Johnson
The perspective that the author writes from gives reason to ponder the possibilities should his perspective be anywhere near correct. I posted it because it looks correct enough to me. I have often remarked that not everyone that walks upright on two legs is a human being.
What happens when you process the client in front of you on his/her own, right items? Compare that to processing the client on someone else's item, dishing out false time tracks to everyone.
Has the church turned into a spiritless ego mill poised to die off one person at a time, each ego smugly satisfied with its auditing-polished narcissism and false time track?
I will let this cook on the mind's back burner for a while -- something enlightening to be served up later.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IHAZeqwQvA
The perspective that the author writes from gives reason to ponder the possibilities should his perspective be anywhere near correct. I posted it because it looks correct enough to me. I have often remarked that not everyone that walks upright on two legs is a human being.
What happens when you process the client in front of you on his/her own, right items? Compare that to processing the client on someone else's item, dishing out false time tracks to everyone.
Has the church turned into a spiritless ego mill poised to die off one person at a time, each ego smugly satisfied with its auditing-polished narcissism and false time track?
I will let this cook on the mind's back burner for a while -- something enlightening to be served up later.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IHAZeqwQvA
Ted
Gold Meritorious Patron
Happy Birthday, Johnny!
Hey, Johnny!
In red above, that's a helluva setup you are fishing for.
The ability to predict is a good thing. But why bother with baiting the shit slingers? This in a sense is what Hubbard called, "forwarding the enemy line."
The shit might hit the fan by reason of your posting, it might not. Your statement in red makes it look like you could be putting it out there for people to respond in that manner.
In celebration, I would like to submit my Johnny Raff Chronicle Number - 2, and since it is my birthday, I would like it if those of you who choose to be “less than kind” with my first submission, would give me a break, and not the kind of break that breaks something dear to me.
Ron once said that as auditors we should neither believe or disbelieve what the preclear says. We should simply accept, duplicate, understand and acknowledge in a way that demonstrates sincere respect of the person and for everything they have to say. I fully subscribe to the idea that one should be allowed to do whatever they damn well please. Well as I have discovered, many ESMB members subscribe fully to that idea also. So you will of course respond however you respond, and I promise to respect that. However, if you wish to give me a break this time, I will most sincerely appreciate it.
I plan to submit all 18 pages of Chronicle Number two, but I will break it into parts with red titles so you can digest it in pieces if you prefer to do it that way..
I plan to post it sometime in the wee hours of the morning when most people sleep. That way I can duck out before any shit hits the fan.
As always, I wish you all you wish for yourself.
The Magic Thetan
Hey, Johnny!
In red above, that's a helluva setup you are fishing for.
The ability to predict is a good thing. But why bother with baiting the shit slingers? This in a sense is what Hubbard called, "forwarding the enemy line."
The shit might hit the fan by reason of your posting, it might not. Your statement in red makes it look like you could be putting it out there for people to respond in that manner.
afaceinthecrowd
Gold Meritorious Patron
Your right...and EP's right, too.
Her name is in my folders somewhere, where ever they are.
She is gone on but she knew how a felt about her. When I was in 8th grade I was the regional speech and debate champion...she drove hundreds of miles to attend the tournament...it meant the world to me for her to be there.
A few years ago I sent a long letter about her to the current pricipal of my little school...it's still there and small. He reads the letter at a faculty meeting at the beginning of each school year.
IMO, the most effective way to improve primary and secondary education is to decentralize, localize, downsize and "neighborhood" the system and use the funds to create low student/teacher ratios, provide tutoring where needed and seek out, hire and retain the Ms. Angels. The System, as it stands, is a classic self-serving Monolithic Command and Control Organization.
Face
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afaceinthecrowd
Gold Meritorious Patron
lkwdblds
Crusader
Very Interesting....
Artie Johnson sure got a lot of mileage out of those two words. Just two words and wearing a German Wehrmacht uniform and he was an instant star. The other German was knew to me, I never saw him before.
Lily Tomlin also got great mileage out of her key line. Dressed as a 1940's telephone operator with the dress and hairdo to match, she uttered, "Is this the party to whom I am speaking?" and another star was born on laugh in.
How would you feel applying for a job at "Laugh In" in the 1960's. Laugh In runs the following ad in Variety Magazine.
LEARN A LINE AND BECOME A STAR Great opportunity in new up and coming TV show. Just learn one line and wear an appropriate costume, if we pick you the salary is $300,000 a year to start and your name will become a household word, nationwide. Excellent chance that you will win TV and Movie parts and earn a 7 figure income within the first year!
The concept that the article applies to people receiving auditing at C of S is an eye opener. The fact that everyone was given the same time track to run and was told what incidents were on it just totally escaped me when I was active in C of S. I never questioned that concept, not even one iota. For more perceptive guys such as Roger and probably yourself, Ted, it was a huge enormous outpoint and led to exiting the Church.
I look at myself in the mid 70's and my critical thinking skills were pitifull. I did not try and think outside the box. My think, and undoubtedly that of most of the rank and file was that Ron was a special being sent to Earth to carry out a mission and that he, at risk to his mind and body, walked the time track for us, blazing the trail to total Freedom for all people. Challenging Ron in those days was impossible to confront. You would be immediately labeled a supprisive and shipped out.
I first learned about critical thinking skills, helping my wonderful ex-wifey out while she was doing her homework for law school. She bounced ideas off of me and I would help her at first with her writing assignments. Even though she was not good at math as I was, some of her critical thinking skills were astounding to me. She wrote papers for Law Review with some incredible incites. That is when I saw the parallels to Inspector Columbo's and Perry Mason's brilliant deductions as well as Sherlock Holmes's incredible feats. Dr. Watson appeared very intelligent, just as intelligent as Sherlock Holmes but Holmes had some almost intangible brilliance that enabled him to think outside the box. It was similar to seeing a good magic trick. No one could imagine how it could be done but once it was explained to you, it was logical and simple.
It took someone with good critical thinking skills and the consideration that he/she was the master of their own destiny to spot that something was out in that Ron was telling us that we all shared the same incidents on virtually the same time track.
All earlier treatises and theories of auditing stressed not evaluating for a preclear, the preclear could only as-is if he himself discovered things on his own. Like a bolt out of the blue, astute people were shocked at what it was that Ron announced. He was quite literall doing a huge evaluation for all preclears telling them what incdents their time track consisted of and demanding of them that they run out what he told them to run.
When LRH made the decision to take this step, it would be "very interesting" to see what was on his mind and how much thought he put into this momentous decision. Does anybody have any thoughts on that?
A KEY POINT IN HUBBARD'S AND SCIENTOLOGY'S HISTORY When Ron took the bold step and told everyone what was on their time tract, i.e. evaluated for everyone en masse and then ordered them to run out what he told them to run out, any legitimate claims Hubbard might have made that Scientology was a valid science were jettisoned out the window. It was now moving more towards being a mind control operation. The key thing is that Hubbard knew that most people would not notice or figure this out. The few who did, ended up leaving, some starting their own groups.
Your post, Ted, sure opens up a door to a lot of speculation and discussion. As others tell me from time to time, I am saying to you, this topic would be great if it were posted as a thread of its own.
Lakey
Artie Johnson sure got a lot of mileage out of those two words. Just two words and wearing a German Wehrmacht uniform and he was an instant star. The other German was knew to me, I never saw him before.
Lily Tomlin also got great mileage out of her key line. Dressed as a 1940's telephone operator with the dress and hairdo to match, she uttered, "Is this the party to whom I am speaking?" and another star was born on laugh in.
How would you feel applying for a job at "Laugh In" in the 1960's. Laugh In runs the following ad in Variety Magazine.
LEARN A LINE AND BECOME A STAR Great opportunity in new up and coming TV show. Just learn one line and wear an appropriate costume, if we pick you the salary is $300,000 a year to start and your name will become a household word, nationwide. Excellent chance that you will win TV and Movie parts and earn a 7 figure income within the first year!
The concept that the article applies to people receiving auditing at C of S is an eye opener. The fact that everyone was given the same time track to run and was told what incidents were on it just totally escaped me when I was active in C of S. I never questioned that concept, not even one iota. For more perceptive guys such as Roger and probably yourself, Ted, it was a huge enormous outpoint and led to exiting the Church.
I look at myself in the mid 70's and my critical thinking skills were pitifull. I did not try and think outside the box. My think, and undoubtedly that of most of the rank and file was that Ron was a special being sent to Earth to carry out a mission and that he, at risk to his mind and body, walked the time track for us, blazing the trail to total Freedom for all people. Challenging Ron in those days was impossible to confront. You would be immediately labeled a supprisive and shipped out.
I first learned about critical thinking skills, helping my wonderful ex-wifey out while she was doing her homework for law school. She bounced ideas off of me and I would help her at first with her writing assignments. Even though she was not good at math as I was, some of her critical thinking skills were astounding to me. She wrote papers for Law Review with some incredible incites. That is when I saw the parallels to Inspector Columbo's and Perry Mason's brilliant deductions as well as Sherlock Holmes's incredible feats. Dr. Watson appeared very intelligent, just as intelligent as Sherlock Holmes but Holmes had some almost intangible brilliance that enabled him to think outside the box. It was similar to seeing a good magic trick. No one could imagine how it could be done but once it was explained to you, it was logical and simple.
It took someone with good critical thinking skills and the consideration that he/she was the master of their own destiny to spot that something was out in that Ron was telling us that we all shared the same incidents on virtually the same time track.
All earlier treatises and theories of auditing stressed not evaluating for a preclear, the preclear could only as-is if he himself discovered things on his own. Like a bolt out of the blue, astute people were shocked at what it was that Ron announced. He was quite literall doing a huge evaluation for all preclears telling them what incdents their time track consisted of and demanding of them that they run out what he told them to run.
When LRH made the decision to take this step, it would be "very interesting" to see what was on his mind and how much thought he put into this momentous decision. Does anybody have any thoughts on that?
A KEY POINT IN HUBBARD'S AND SCIENTOLOGY'S HISTORY When Ron took the bold step and told everyone what was on their time tract, i.e. evaluated for everyone en masse and then ordered them to run out what he told them to run out, any legitimate claims Hubbard might have made that Scientology was a valid science were jettisoned out the window. It was now moving more towards being a mind control operation. The key thing is that Hubbard knew that most people would not notice or figure this out. The few who did, ended up leaving, some starting their own groups.
Your post, Ted, sure opens up a door to a lot of speculation and discussion. As others tell me from time to time, I am saying to you, this topic would be great if it were posted as a thread of its own.
Lakey
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Ted
Gold Meritorious Patron
One simple answer: He said that scientology was all about you. Really, it was all about Him.
As for a separate thread, perhaps I will move on that some time in the future. Right now there isn't enough of me available to carry the load. I am here at this time as a diversion that I don't have to give much thought.
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