The Little Thread Which Grew - the Apollo '73 to Everything But

[afaceinthecrowd]

Hey TMT,

Just got through reading your last installment…good stuff!

I had me a few exocentric Profs…kinda made me wanna be one someday myself. Oh well.

Ah, the good old days…every day has the promise of someday being one of them.

Glad you hung in there and are hangin’ with Us.

Keep it comin’, Bro’.

Face

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Gimme some!

Thje symbols are critical; I've never questioned it but in hindsight I have always used then and I am very effective with Reiki.

The masters MUST use the symbols while "attuning" the student. I have had four attunements, one was re-done due to an error in the symbols. During the attunement, all the symbols including the DaiKyoMyo are "drawn" repeatedly around the student in specific quadrants. The results of the attunements are really remarkable. They take only a few minutes but I always notice extreme changes in my senses afterward. Usually there is some kind of nervous manifestation involved: a shock of sorts, tingling, waves of pins and needles. Mystical stuff to be sure!

I was really sold on Reiki the day a relative gave me a treatment and due to my natural abilities and energy fields I almost caused him to pass out. He told me after the session that as soon as he started my treatment the room started spinning on him, more and more wildly until he lost his balance and almost fell. Funny, while he was giving me the treatment I was wondering what all the friggen noise was about and why he was dancing a little. It was explained to me later by a master that even he must be certain he is properly "grounded" while giving me a healing due to the intensity of my natural energy fields. Lol, he always called me "The Energy Sponge".

Zorgie, I want a big fat hug from you!

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Beautiful Loving Spirit!

I checked this on Snopes. It is 100% true.

Her name is Katie Kirkpatrick, 21 yrs old. Next to her is her fiance, Nick, 23.

This picture was taken prior to their wedding January 11th, 2005.

Katie has terminal cancer and spends hours in chemotherapy. Here Nick awaits while she finishes one of the sessions...

Even in pain and dealing with her organs shutting down, with the help of morphine, Katie took care of every single part of the wedding planning.

Her dress had to be adjusted several times due to Katie 's constant weight loss.

An expected guest was her oxygen tank. Katie had to use it during the ceremony and reception.

The other couple in this picture is Nick's parents, very emotional with the wedding and to see their son marrying the girl he fell in love when he was an adolescent.

Katie, in a wheel chair listening to her husband and friends singing to her.

In the middle of the party, Katie had to rest for a bit and catch her breath.
The pain does not allow her to stand for long period of time.

Katie died 5 days after her wedding. To see a fragile woman dress as bride with a beautiful smile makes you think.... happiness is always there within reach, no matter how long it lasts...... let's enjoy life. Life is too short.

Work as if it was your first day.
Forgive as soon as possible.
Love without boundaries..
Laugh without control
and never stop smiling.


Robin, Mike, Likky, and Rose

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emv3r0NxgQg

Wasn't she a beautiful bride? What a love story.

Live till you die, folks, LIVE till you die! That's for all of us!

 

[Pepin]

You vote for Obama. I will will vote against him. That's the beauty of the system.

Yeah, sure it is. Your vote doesn't matter.

The electoral college chooses the president.

 

[The Great Zorg]

Yabut

Yeah, sure it is. Your vote doesn't matter.

The electoral college chooses the president.

Who elects the Electoral College? :confused2:

Your vote counts in Canada! In Canada, there are only two main political parties and they're both fucked up. So, each vote is used to continue the bullshit. It is only an illusion that we have a democracy.

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Thank you!

I think your viewpoints have a lot of validity and I often enjoy them.

Thank you for the recent validation of my desire to be a processor.

Thank you, dear Blue Spirit, for the friendly ack! I do want to encourage you to go forward with what excites you about helping people...don't let any externals stop or discourage you from being all that you want to be!

The world needs helpers!

I also think Lakey will make a fine teacher/tutor/mentor for older students, from high school age on up, and I want to encourage him to pursue this path. He is so very close to having his "certs" to do so! Teachers foster the future!

 

[thetanic]

I checked this on Snopes. It is 100% true.

Her name is Katie Kirkpatrick, 21 yrs old. Next to her is her fiance, Nick, 23.

This picture was taken prior to their wedding January 11th, 2005.

Katie has terminal cancer and spends hours in chemotherapy. Here Nick awaits while she finishes one of the sessions...

It's sad that she was married such a short time before her death, but it's obvious she was blissfully alive during that time.

 

[SweetnessandLight]

I believe we are all basically good, in our true spiritual nature!

FIRST A SALUTE TO OLSKA - Its always nice to have you posting here! Now onto my reply to Sweetness and Light:

Its funny what you say, "different strokes for different folks!" I lived a fairly full life to 30 years and 6 months without Scientology and did not meet any soul mates along the road of life. That road encompassed the regular schools, scouting, various odd jobs, community college, two Universities and 9 years with 4 companies in the corporate world in aerospace.

I also travelled to Mexico in 1966, Europe in 1967 for 2 months and to Japan for 3 weeks in 1969. I was different from everyone else I met and never found anyone who was similar to me. The only thing even close to a soul mate was this guy Doug Locke at work, the Baptist guy, who turned me on to the books of Edgar Cayce

I felt at home in Germany, I liked being there and related well to the language, the people and their morals. It turns out I have hundreds of years of track in that region. Japan was very spiritual and made me feel respect for people and their culture but I had nothing in common with them. The Mexicans were warm and natural and more in valence and hospitible. I toyed with living there permanently because of the cheap prices and unpretentious people.

Scientology was the first group where I found some people who were like me and had similar goals, interests and motivations. When the focus moved 100% towards money and stats, i was totally offended and left. Without the caring attitude of the early days, the Church of Scientology lost all of its interest for me although it took decades for me to figure this out in full.

Now ex Scientologists, that is really the best goup by far! Ex Scientologists who have actually been in and participated are the closest things to soul mates whom I have encountered on Earth. Probably over 40 potential soul mates right here on this thread and none, really, outside of ESMB in 70 years of this life.

A SECOND SOURCE OF SOUL MATES
Reconnecting with Edey Caldwell, the hypnotherapist, who was in Networking with me around April of last year, her calling me and bringing me to Kangen Water meetings has been a revelation. She and most of her friends are heavily into the occult and when I go to their occult centers, I am feeling very much at home. Everybody is friendly and repectful and has much in common with me. Most of the females are very attractive. Had I never got into Scientology, I might have found the occult and had I done so, I would have permanently been involved in that. To me, however, the group of ex Scientologists is my true group, the people in occult practices are a fairly distant second place.


SO TO SWEETNESS - After knowing you for well over a year, your quoted post revealed for the first time your true spiritual background. I had figured that you hung around the Riverside mission and started 2 D's with people there because you agreed with the teachings there and wanted a man with similar teachings to be your 2D. I figured that it was only money constraints which kept you from joining up. After all, you appear to be good friends with Bent. Why would that be if you did not hold Scientological beliefs. Well, anyway, you have debunked what I thought your background was. You are certainly eligible to be on ESMB but you are not, in the strict sense of the term, an Ex Scientologist and knowing that makes a difference in how I would evaluate and react to your posts.

To someone who does not believe than "man is basically good", everything is different vis a vis discussing what takes place in the between lives area. Much of the talk and arguments applied when talking with a full ex Scientologist can not be used with a person such as yourself because our core beliefs are greatly different. Well, this post is already very long and I am going to call it right here.
Lakey

I'm very glad about your wins in finding many soul mates here Lakey! That's great! I've found soul mates everywhere I have gone in life, I can't imagine going for so many years without experiencing the comfort and companionship of my fellow like-minded spiritual beings...so hurrah for you!

I'm a little confused about some of your comments about me above, Lakey...

I've always made it clear on this board that I am "Non", not an "Ex", and was never anything more than an occasional attender or hanger-outer at Bent's old Mission, in the early days when it was up and running. It was a pretty interesting place, because the people there were interesting.

I had several high school friends who got really into Scientology. I stayed in harmony with them. I never have had any desire to "join up" (in the tribal or herd sense) with COS. I've always been a free-thinking, no boundaries kind of spiritually seeking metaphysical Christian, and will die one. I would get along fine with all your new "occult" group friends.

Everything I know about Scientology is totally squirrel! I guess that's a bad thing to some folks' point of view, but I'm kinda proud of it! I've never paid a dime to the IAS and I never will!

I never had a 2D at Bent's Mission, (although there was a certain energetic vibe there!) I was too young at the time, and a good Christian girl! The closest possible thing to a 2D I ever had there there was petting Pinky the rat (a tame pet) while it was sitting on the night guard's shoulder! He posts here occasionally, (the guard, not "Pinky" ---Although I suppose Pinky could be a channeled as a being, but let's not go there! )

I did have a relatively recent close relationship with an "Ex", who, in hindsight, was just desperate for any and all help upon leaving the Sea Org and attempting to rejoin the real world and construct a life for himself. I did give him a lot of help, but it wasn't a mutually loving or respectful relationship, and didn't last. I've had Scientologists around me as friends and classmates, neighbors, etc. my whole life. More and more of them are becoming "Exes"!

I would not say that I am "good friends" with Bent. Bent is a man of the world with very broad viewpoints, and he extends kindness to all sorts of riff-raff like me! I admire and like him for what he creates in the world, for supporting the arts, for his abilities with people, for his havingness and for being an adept in the full sense of the word. He will understand what I mean by that. Mostly I admire his very great survival skills! The man has monumental courage! Holy mackerel, the COS tried to destroy him and take everything he had, and FAILED utterly!!!!

http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/50grand/media/time-1993-01-31-3.html

Plus he is a damn fine writer and researcher! His book helped many people find their way to a freer life than Corporate Scientology afforded them, and surely has kept many others from getting mired in that pit. I wish it would be re-published, with an update for the Anon era!!! For ANY of you who have not yet read his biography of Ron: "L. Ron Hubbard-Messiah or Madman?" by Bent Corydon please do yourself a favor and do so!

You seem to imply that I do not feel that we as spiritual beings are all basically good...what??? Of course I do! That really confuses me. Did you maybe misread something that I wrote here? :confused2:

In our first phone conversation so long ago you asked me where I was on the bridge, and I said..."nowhere! I'm just a lowly pre-clear!" At the time you said it was o.k., that we could still talk things over on a friendly basis, Scientology included... Has something changed?

If so, pm me and we'll talk about it!

 

[The Great Zorg]

YabutwhataboutGod?

<snip>A Lifeforce Presence is the infinity of Spirita.

God is never mentioned enough.

My 2¢: God is the singular remainder of Universal Life Force that was not used to create everything that was, is and will be. It has to exist. No action utilizes 100% of any of the ingredients. God remains forever. It has to be this way. :confused2:

 

[The Great Zorg]

One up

Zorgie, I want a big fat hug from you!

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Thank YOU, Zorgie!

I feel better all ready!

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

more cat

 

[lkwdblds]

I'm very glad about your wins in finding many soul mates here Lakey! That's great! I've found soul mates everywhere I have gone in life, I can't imagine going for so many years without experiencing the comfort and companionship of my fellow like-minded spiritual beings...so hurrah for you!

I'm a little confused about some of your comments about me above, Lakey...

I've always made it clear on this board that I am "Non", not an "Ex", and was never anything more than an occasional attender or hanger-outer at Bent's old Mission, in the early days when it was up and running. It was a pretty interesting place, because the people there were interesting.

I had several high school friends who got really into Scientology. I stayed in harmony with them. I never have had any desire to "join up" (in the tribal or herd sense) with COS. I've always been a free-thinking, no boundaries kind of spiritually seeking metaphysical Christian, and will die one. I would get along fine with all your new "occult" group friends.

Everything I know about Scientology is totally squirrel! I guess that's a bad thing to some folks' point of view, but I'm kinda proud of it! I've never paid a dime to the IAS and I never will!

I never had a 2D at Bent's Mission, (although there was a certain energetic vibe there!) I was too young at the time, and a good Christian girl! The closest possible thing to a 2D I ever had there there was petting Pinky the rat (a tame pet) while it was sitting on the night guard's shoulder! He posts here occasionally, (the guard, not "Pinky" ---Although I suppose Pinky could be a channeled as a being, but let's not go there! )

I did have a relatively recent close relationship with an "Ex", who, in hindsight, was just desperate for any and all help upon leaving the Sea Org and attempting to rejoin the real world and construct a life for himself. I did give him a lot of help, but it wasn't a mutually loving or respectful relationship, and didn't last. I've had Scientologists around me as friends and classmates, neighbors, etc. my whole life. More and more of them are becoming "Exes"!

I would not say that I am "good friends" with Bent. Bent is a man of the world with very broad viewpoints, and he extends kindness to all sorts of riff-raff like me! I admire and like him for what he creates in the world, for supporting the arts, for his abilities with people, for his havingness and for being an adept in the full sense of the word. He will understand what I mean by that. Mostly I admire his very great survival skills! The man has monumental courage! Holy mackerel, the COS tried to destroy him and take everything he had, and FAILED utterly!!!!

http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/50grand/media/time-1993-01-31-3.html

Plus he is a damn fine writer and researcher! His book helped many people find their way to a freer life than Corporate Scientology afforded them, and surely has kept many others from getting mired in that pit. I wish it would be re-published, with an update for the Anon era!!! For ANY of you who have not yet read his biography of Ron: "L. Ron Hubbard-Messiah or Madman?" by Bent Corydon please do yourself a favor and do so!

You seem to imply that I do not feel that we as spiritual beings are all basically good...what??? Of course I do! That really confuses me. Did you maybe misread something that I wrote here? :confused2:

In our first phone conversation so long ago you asked me where I was on the bridge, and I said..."nowhere! I'm just a lowly pre-clear!" At the time you said it was o.k., that we could still talk things over on a friendly basis, Scientology included... Has something changed?

If so, pm me and we'll talk about it!

Sweetness, a paragraph in your post #5181 caught my eye and I copied it below.

If, upon passing, most of us are shown a life review of all of our thoughts deeds, feelings, actions and intentions (or lack therein), as I believe we experience as we enter the bardos, I think this impinges on most of us to a very great degree. No "other" punishment may be needed for us to want to take responsibility to reform ourselves and regenerate, and to heal. Maybe no higher or outside authority has to punish us for our misdeeds. Maybe all that is necessary is for Life to hold up a mirror to us of our innermost selves and our actions, or the effects of our actions. I do feel that we are basically good. Maybe we want to reform, change, grow, do and be better, all on our own. Maybe that is in our basic nature as beings.

A key part of Hubbard's technology is that Mankind is basically good. The proof of this is that when he does things which harm others, he tends to reduce himself in size so as not to be able to do this harmful deed again. Another similar trait is returning to the scene of a crime and leaving some evidence behind, leading to his own capture. This also tends to make himself smaller.

Anyway, in your quoted passage from #5181 you ascribe an ability to mankind which is a complex technical point which my gut feeling tends to strongly object to. That point is, "Maybe all that is necessary is for Life to hold up a mirror to us of our innermost selves and our action, or the effects of our actions. You continue, I do feel that we are basically good. Maybe we want to reform, change grow, do and be better, all on our own. Maybe that is in our basic nature as beings."

This paragraph above just casually makes suggestions on a whim, which I feel are extremely unlikely. To me, proof of being basically good is more along Hubbard's model where a being withdraws from areas of life in which he has harmed others or takes steps to insure he gets caught after harming someone. I don't have any proof that Hubbard's theory is more correct than yours but only a gut feeling. In your way of looking at the possiblities, someone such as Hitler could have a change of heart by just showing him a mirror illustrating the course of his life. Believe me, he knew exactly what he was doing in his life and just showing him a movie rerun at life's end would not cause him to decide to live his next life as a "Little Goodie Twoshoes."

Anyway, in summary, all I was saying is that if you don't believe in Hubbard's theory of how beings reduce their power after harming someone as a proof of their basic goodness, then in discussing issues with you, one must be more careful about basic definitions, terms and agreements than they would be in discussing the same issues with someone who actually at one time believed that Hubbard's tech was correct. Without clearing terms with you, due to your never accepting Hubbard, there is more chance for a misunderstanding to occur. So you see, not much changes and it is really not a big deal, we just need to make sure we are both using the same basic terms.
Lakey

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

For Carmelo:

The Science of Surfboards

this was really cool.

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Cuddle Buddies!

More cat, plus rat!!! Did my mentioning Pinky pull this in???

 

[Veda]

-snip-

A key part of Hubbard's technology is that Mankind is basically good.

-snip-

It also says, "Think for yourself" on the big plastic sign outside the Org.

"Axiom 31. Goodness and badness, beautifulness and ugliness, are alike considerations and have no other basis than opinion."

From the December 1951 lecture, 'Cause on All Dynamics':

"What is conscience? It is simply a negating against your own, not somebody else's, causes. If there is such a thing as conscience, it would be that...

"Now, you want to know anytime in your life when you felt guilty... you go back and find the postulate that your are guilty of disobeying...." [and erase that postulate]

And from the PDC lectures of 1952: "Never be the effect of your own cause."

Per Scientology, humans are confined to the limitations imposed on them - by others and by themselves - that require them to "be good," and humans are subject to conscience, and humans are the effect of their own cause, but an "Operating Thetan" would be above these things. It might please him to do "good"; he might have that inclination, but there would no automatic consequence to him for doing "bad."

An "OT" would be above good and evil and other petty human things.

If Scientology is oriented toward anything, it is toward "Survival!" Survival (including pleasure and well being) is "good," and the survival of Scientology is regarded as essential to the survival of everything else; it is also regarded as the only way to become "OT," so an "OT" would be senior to (human) good and evil, but not senior to Scientology - per Scientology.

Of course, since most Scientologists don't quite know what (the secretive and manipulative subject of) Scientology is - except that it's very very important to their "Survival!" - and since Scientology (and its "Grade Chart") does not produce the state of "OT" (beyond self-tickling, feel-good, wishful thinking), "OT" is used mainly as a "dangling carrot." This, while Scientologists exchange their human sense of "good" for a Scientological sense of "good."

I might think that "Mankind is basically good," but I don't believe that Hubbard really thought that "Mankind is basically good." As with anything else in Scientology, if one peels off that layer, one will find something very different behind it.

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Are we self correcting, directive beings? Or are we merely reactive beings?

Thank you Veda, I do understand what you are saying. I agree with you.

To me, Mankind's inherent "goodness" is soul deep, (based on my acceptance of the doctrine of immanence, as I understand it) and not merely a social construct or a psychological imposition of the will of the group to control the individual via "guilt", etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immanence

You chose a very extreme example Lakey, in Hitler...I will allow that there are sociopaths and psychopaths, other really damaged individuals who might take a very long time in the bardos pondering and reviewing until they get a self-realizing freeing cognition for a transformation to take place. OR who may repeat their mistakes before they learn, evolve and ascend, so to speak.

But for most of us garden variety humans, we have caring, compassion and empathy hard wired into our minds as a survival mechanism. I think the capacity for these qualities only increases with age and experience, I don't think any of that learning, growth or refinement of soul is lost at our deaths, I think it goes with us (is a part of our essential spiritual selves). Hence the concept of "an old soul". You can ask your new friends what they think about that. Should make for an interesting discussion. What does anyone else think? Are all beings capable of repentance and reformation? (Granted, some of us may have more to work on than others!)

To my way of thinking, there is no "place" of heaven or hell in the afterlife, except for what we ourselves create in our own consciousness and with our awareness. (Same is true for this expression of Life right here...)

 

[Atalantan]

It also says, "Think for yourself" on the big plastic sign outside the Org.

"Axiom 31. Goodness and badness, beautifulness and ugliness, are alike considerations and have no other basis than opinion."

From the December 1951 lecture, 'Cause on All Dynamics':

"What is conscience? It is simply a negating against your own, not somebody else's, causes. If there is such a thing as conscience, it would be that...

"Now, you want to know anytime in your life when you felt guilty... you go back and find the postulate that your are guilty of disobeying...." [and erase that postulate]

And from the PDC lectures of 1952: "Never be the effect of your own cause."

Per Scientology, humans are confined to the limitations imposed on them - by others and by themselves - that require them to "be good," and humans are subject to conscience, and humans are the effect of their own cause, but an "Operating Thetan" would be above these things. It might please him to do "good"; he might have that inclination, but there would no automatic consequence to him for doing "bad."

An "OT" would be above good and evil and other petty human things.

If Scientology is oriented toward anything, it is toward "Survival!" Survival (including pleasure and well being) is "good," and the survival of Scientology is regarded as essential to the survival of everything else; it is also regarded as the only way to become "OT," so an "OT" would be senior to (human) good and evil, but not senior to Scientology - per Scientology.

Of course, since most Scientologists don't quite know what (the secretive and manipulative subject of) Scientology is - except that it's very very important to their "Survival!" - and since Scientology (and its "Grade Chart") does not produce the state of "OT" (beyond self-tickling, feel-good, wishful thinking), "OT" is used mainly as a "dangling carrot." This, while Scientologists exchange their human sense of "good" for a Scientological sense of "good."

I might think that "Mankind is basically good," but I don't believe that Hubbard really thought that "Mankind is basically good." As with anything else in Scientology, if one peels off that layer, one will find something very different behind it.

"Man" is basically good only in the context of the 8 Dynamics. Because Optimium Survival is survival along and as ALL 8 Dynamics as much as possible.

So a thetan playing the game of "Man surviving in the physical universe" would have to be "good" by definition, as for optimum survival he would have to operate towards the survival of all 8 dynamics. Being "basically good" ie promoting survival of all 8 dynamics is "built-in" to the game.

A thetan playing some other game or not playing the game of being the 8 dynamics would not necessarily be "basically good". Because then it becomes a matter of "consideration" or "opinion", just like "beauty" is.

Where members of the Church are really wrong is, if the Church is not promoting and enhancing survival of and along all 8 dynamics, it is just another self-interested group that does not deserve to survive any more than any other group.

In fact, the more it opposes itself to the survival of others, whether other groups, individuals, or it's own individual members, it becomes a contra-survival group that does not deserve to survive.

That's why in fact it is not surviving, it is in a downward spiral and is actually rapidly succumbing at this point.

Miscavige likes to talk about "straight up and vertical". The actual course of his "religion" and his "church" is plummeting "straight down and vertical" because it's behavior is not "basically good". It is basically "bad" and non-survival.

 

[Leon]

That number 6 was another superb one, TMT. Than you very much indeed.

Whenever I read one of your chronicles I come back to the same question that I am gettng a better view of the more I progress, and that is "what exactly is a thetan?"

Is he a unit being? Or does he exist across all of his dynamics simultaneously while viewing only the tiny tiny portion he calls "self"? The more I look at it the more I tend to the latter viewpoint.

In other words - is Betsy just yourself on a broader unviewed dynamic or is she indeed a fully separate being? I don't know the final answer yet, or even if there is one. When you are dealing with infinity as a single concept, then the concept of 'one' is meaningless.

The other idea I cogitate on and try to unravel is just what exactly is 'present time'. For a being who is in no-time and can be at any time point anywhere, just wat is meant by this thing called "present time'. It seems to me to be just "total focus on one tiny sliver of infinite time".

But again, I'm still learning.


Thanks again.

 

[Veda]

"Man" is basically good only in the context of the 8 Dynamics. Because Optimium Survival is survival along and as ALL 8 Dynamics as much as possible.

So a thetan playing the game of "Man surviving in the physical universe" would have to be "good" by definition, as for optimum survival he would have to operate towards the survival of all 8 dynamics. Being "basically good" ie promoting survival of all 8 dynamics is "built-in" to the game.

A thetan playing some other game or not playing the game of being the 8 dynamics would not necessarily be "basically good". Because then it becomes a matter of "consideration" or "opinion", just like "beauty" is.

Where members of the Church are really wrong is, if the Church is not promoting and enhancing survival of and along all 8 dynamics, it is just another self-interested group that does not deserve to survive any more than any other group.

In fact, the more it opposes itself to the survival of others, whether other groups, individuals, or it's own individual members, it becomes a contra-survival group that does not deserve to survive.

That's why in fact it is not surviving, it is in a downward spiral and is actually rapidly succumbing at this point.

Miscavige likes to talk about "straight up and vertical". The actual course of his "religion" and his "church" is plummeting "straight down and vertical" because it's behavior is not "basically good". It is basically "bad" and non-survival.

Thanks for the Scientology P.E. course talk, with an "Independent Scientology" caveat re. the "Church" tacked onto the end. And there's some truth in that P.E. course explanation, so I'm not knocking you, just suggesting that you peek behind the Scientological curtain a little.

Re. the Hubbardism "thetan" - Personally, I don't use it to describe myself or others' most intimate spiritual essence - except, on occasion, when discussing Scientology, at which time I always use quotation marks. IMO, those calling themselves "thetans" are still dwelling in the Hubbard reality-bubble, and seeing the rest of the world clearly through the viscous film of the bubble can be difficult.

Scientology was at its greatest expansion years ago when it was a devious and abusive totalist cult with a thick mental-healing wrapping (which has since become thinner). In that state it survived well enough to accumulate quite a bit of money, which it now has deposited in overseas bank accounts collecting interest, and in "Orgs" (monuments), and buried steel plates, each with Hubbard's name on it.

It's "surviving" after a fashion, and as envisioned by its founder in his mostly confidential dictates.

Now, I'll let you guys get back to singing Kumbaya.