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The Little Thread Which Grew - the Apollo '73 to Everything But

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Enthetan

Master of Disaster
The point I am making is, why the hell should a critical issue like societal healthcare be allowed to be ripped off for profits by by a money making machine at the expense of bankrupting healthcare providers like hospitals.

I saw the article below, and thought back to our prior discussion:

Greek Health System Opts for Amputation as Money-Saver


This Saturday, one of Greece’s most respected newspapers, To Vima, reported that the nation’s largest government health insurance provider would no longer pay for special footwear for diabetes patients. Amputation is cheaper, says the Benefits Division of the state insurance provider.

The new policy was announced in a letter to the Pan-Hellenic Federation of People with Diabetes. The Federation disputes the science behind the decision of the Benefits Division. In a statement, the group argues that the decision is contrary to evidence as presented in the international scientific literature.

Greece’s National Healthcare System was created in the early 1980s, during the tenure of Prime Minister Andreas Papandreou. Papandreou, an academic, won election under the slogan, Αλλαγή, which is the Greek word for Change.

The Greek government is bankrupt, needs to save money somehow, and seems to choose screwing the ones least likely to take to the streets and riot.
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
I thought you were the programmer guy. Where did you pick up your vast expertise about the brain? I wish you would have been a programs chief in the Flag Bureaux as I was, doing "evals" and writing programs for the Orgs to get their stats up.

With your background in programming and you expertise in knowledge about the brain, you would have been a natural for that post.
Lakey

He would not have lasted. He's honest enough that he would eventually have done evals which pointed to the real Why being the stupidity of the seniors on the lines.
 
Welcome CW.:yes:

Reading this thread from the beginning is a daunting task…I know ‘cause I did about 6 months ago and it’s more than doubled in pages since then.:confused2:

This thread is sort of a collaborative community of crazy people, metaphysical mulletheads and older folks with too much time on their hands and no supervision, but like the old adage goes, we might be crazy but we’re not stupid.:coolwink:

The Sun never sets on the Apollo ’73 thread. There are folks here from all around the world and the whole gamut from never in Scn or briefly in, all the way to highly trained “Techies” or personally worked with El Ron El Rey Hisself. There is a veritable cornucopia of valuable, well written and interesting information—and irreverent silliness and fartin' around—in all these 700 plus pages...or 700 plus turd piles as some would label them.:clap:

I was one of the "Southern Land Develpment and Leasing Corporation" and “United Churches” front guys that snuck into your nice little corner of the world in the dead of night back in the ‘70’s. Sorry, Pal—“I was just following orders”. I’ve been out of Scn for over twenty years and have told some of the story on ESMB, mostly on this thread. :melodramatic:

There are lots of good folks here and your sure welcome to join our “Moveable Feast”.:happydance:

Best Wishes,

Face:)

PS: There's also some wonderful investment opportunities here, but you'll have to talk to Carmelo or Nozeno about those.:unsure:

I dont mind sharing my little corner of world. Im a night owl, I only sleep a few hours a day, so my last few days have been spent researching. Ive skimmed through some things I found on the internet, A real deal copy of the auditors handbook, that was pretty cool to see. I watched the interview LRH gave to the BBC all those years ago, hours upon hours spent reading through the stories on here. Quite amazing all of it. I did find some specifics on the stuff I was looking for. Like the pinch test while the guy was holding the e-meter, it dipped, then leveled out, then the auditor told him to think about that incident, and then it dipped again. That was kind of surprising for me to see. Not enough for me to have total faith in it, but it did work like they said it would, I would need to see it work a whole helluva lot to give it any validity in my mind. Its all very interesting.
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
My girl friend from junior high, who is still my friend, called last week end. Her daughter finished college at Santa Clara University last year. she had a double major in biology and french (I think). She spent last year working at some top cancer research place in Seattle. She discovered that she doesn't like research.

She's 21, has a college degree, is smart, needs to work for a living. She has some artistic talent.

Any suggestions for her in finding her direction in life, making a buck, etc?

Pharmaceutical sales, marketing?

Being a science reporter, science writer, editor at a textbook house?

Scientific translator (English-French) ?

Best would be to start from what she DOES like to do, and see what would align with what her skills and training are.
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
Turkish or Greek music brings out sensual and artistic dancing in people. Italian and French music promote love. What about Islam? They disallow music from what I have been told. Under a regime such as the Taliban, if you are caught listening to music, your music system is destroyed and you are subject to severe punishment. Go figure! Are they nuts or what?

Music in Islam gets complicated.

Turkey is a Muslim country, yet has fine music. Other Islamic people have musical traditions and like to sing and dance. Yet Mohammad disliked music and it is supposed to be forbidden in Islam (see also here). Yet such is the power of music that Muslims listen and play anyway.

My personal theory is that the Taliban and strict Islamists dislike music because it can have a calming and soothing effect, and distracts their followers from more useful activities (like Jihad).
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
http://www.mannythemovieguy.com/images/frank_langella_joins_wall_street_2.jpg

Wall Street is a film I've wanted to see too Carmelo.

Frank Langella was part of the cast as planned?




I'm finding that Windows 7 does not allow me to automatically paste into the picture insert icon. Or is it that Google Images has decided to respect proprietary rights more. Google images' I'm getting a little red x.
right click used to have an option "image info". Now its gone in Windows 7. I still have it in XP and can steal photos from google images in a snap.

Or just switch browsers from MS Internet Explorer to FireFox. Firefox still shows image info on Win 7 (IE just shows "Properties", which still allows you to see the image URL.
 

Hatshepsut

Crusader
Or just switch browsers from MS Internet Explorer to FireFox.:) Firefox still shows image info on Win 7 (IE just shows "Properties", which still allows you to see the image URL.

Aha!

THANKYOU. It's that I'm using FireFox on my laptop and not the desktop that makes the difference. Maybe I woulda figured it out eventually....maybe.
IE properties won't take me there.
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
This is a very interesting talk, amusing presentation, on British government. The takeaway for me is in the observation that centralized government does not work. This will hold true here in the States as well. It certainly holds true for the government of scientology.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHcfNy1_zqA&feature=related

I think he doesn't go far enough, and I'm in disagreement with many of his proposed solutions.

The thing about public funding of political parties and prohibition of private money in politics will mean that no new parties will arise (since only existing parties would be able to receive funding) and new ideas would have a hard time being heard if they did not have backing from a major party.

About inequality, socialism's whole purpose is to ensure inequality becomes cast in concrete, because it grants a preference to those who are already "connected" with the levers of power and are able to navigate around bureaucratic obstacles that would stop somebody with ideas and energy, but no familiarity with the power structure.

As far as child poverty remaining high, the solution is simple to state, but politically hard to implement: remove the welfare state infrastructure that makes it viable for an unmarried woman with no job skills to have children.
 

Hatshepsut

Crusader
Enthetan

As far as child poverty remaining high, the solution is simple to state, but politically hard to implement: remove the welfare state infrastructure that makes it viable for an unmarried woman with no job skills to have children.

Oh my GOD!!!!!!!
The emperor has no CLOTHES!!!

This has deliberately not been paid any attention until the wealth is equally distributed. Procreating under conditions of not even being able to take care of oneself has been 'The Ticket' to more benefits than a young man gets when finishing an enlistment term. Nothing can be taken away or deprived one as long as there are minor children involved. I would not really want an automatic safety net NOT to be there though.. Many people shouldn't have children. Babies need to be proteced from some of the major assholes who bring them into this world. The state has gone into apathy about the fact that we are held over a barrel.
In many instances offspring are shared to each aging family group has a minor to have in custody. Add to the fact that the minor has problems due to ADD or abuse in the womb, and a check is necessary for two or three times the usual amt. Since when do we pay family members to take care of their own on a scale as large as it has gotten. This pendulum is beginning to swing the other way. Abortions and non arbitrary methods of birth control are right around the corner with the Natl healthcare. We will all lose some rights so the system can stay afloat. But who made the problem so big that the solutions will be so dire.

Look at the female addicts who have their children taken away. They were already lost in a world where others were over them. Without kids nobody needs to care that they even have a roof over their head and food stamps. Being allowed to have children indescrimately knowing the tax payer will pay is only the beginning of the benefits available thereafter. But the human race is the most horny in youth before financial stability is achieved. Does anyone have a right to interfere?
*********
I was watching Cspan a lot last winter. Boy oh boy. The juicy stuff came on one Monday at at 3:45 am. And it was not repeated like all the other news. It went the way of the Superbowl Budweiser commercials.....see it once..... and never again if it was really good.
The judge participating in ordering the calling of the house bills was pissed ....really pissed.!!!! She could get no straight answers about how the checks and balances worked with the housing credit.!@#*# She said 8000 dollars of the tax payer's money a pop was needing to be accounted for when claims were put in.. The same buyers were scarfing up the benefits to buy entire blocks of houses and then resell them. Children as young as 6 were having homes put in their names for profit reasons. The fraud had gone into the billions.!! She asked 5 different congressman who was responsible for protecting the tax payers money on this. Everyone dodged ......as it seems this is a means by which our system resides to raise an entire class and wants no questions asked. Well it works and it doesn't. The judge called to fact that we have another program that gives back great amounts of money to under income households called the earned income tax credit. You can get 7500 back per yr even if you paid in 0. You just gotta say what kids are living in the household. She said who checks to see that the dependents are not being claimed by different people all at the same time. No one gave her a straight answer. Finally she asked a senator what the fraud rate was estimated to be at that time. He told her it was around 2 billion that yr. She was livid and called on an IRS representative. The rep would not give a straight answer as to what system the IRS used to check dependent claims. The judge was about to throw the book. Finally the rep said that the Federal gvt had not authorized them 'power of math' to challenge claims. The judge said since when doesn't the IRS have power of math with so many billions at stake? She said this court will make sure you DO have power of math to protect the tax payers money from now on.

So I ask you WHO had the intention to obviscate something this big for so long. Who did it benefit? I could not believe this segment of Cspan put on only once in the wee hrs of the morning.
 
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afaceinthecrowd

Gold Meritorious Patron
My girl friend from junior high, who is still my friend, called last week end. Her daughter finished college at Santa Clara University last year. she had a double major in biology and french (I think). She spent last year working at some top cancer research place in Seattle. She discovered that she doesn't like research.

She's 21, has a college degree, is smart, needs to work for a living. She has some artistic talent.

Any suggestions for her in finding her direction in life, making a buck, etc?

Having raised a few kids and paid for their college, here’s my 2 cents.

Sometimes a big panic sets in after graduation. Sometimes there is a sudden realization that what they Majored in actually is not what they really are interested in. Sometimes the Major (such as Biology) was done with a plan that they were going to be a teacher and now that the kid is older, they realize they actually don’t want to be a teacher. I’ve seen a lot of “growing up” happen in the last 18 months of college.

Skills and attribute assessment is very important. What do I actually know how to do? What do I like doing? What am I good at? What do others think I’m good at?

I’ve had one kid graduate and not be certain if they wanted to go for a Masters, which would be very important for future job prospects in subject they majored in. The “assessment” was to go to work for a few years to earn some dough at a food server job, which led to an office job, to live while they decided whether or not to go to grad school. This one had time (4 years) to "mature" artistically and refine their portfolio, then went back to school and got a Masters in their undergraduate Major (Fine Arts-Painting and Sculpture) at a top school and they’ve got a good career going because they not only have a Masters but they had the time to figure out what they really wanted and then sacrifice and go for it without second guessing themselves.

I’ve had another that wanted to be a teacher, graduate with a double Major in English and History and then decide they don’t want to teach and go into a real panic. They spoke French, liked to travel and liked being with people so the “assessment” was to get a job as a Flight Attendant and get some “Living as an Adult in the World” under their belt. They were on flights in and out of DC and NYC and got to be friends with a number of big time journalists. It took nearly 6 years for the “process” to come to fruition but this one is now in one of the top MA-Journalism Schools in the US and is really doing well and is thrilled with their life and has a job waiting upon Graduation.

Another one wanted to be a Theater Arts teacher up until their Senior year, then decided they didn’t want to teach and Graduated with a degree they didn’t know what to do with. The “assessment” was to use the communication skills from Theater Arts and get a job in merchandising. That led to several years of frustration, but experience that was ‘real World”. The company was sold, the job went away and a year of “Temp Agency” ensued. On day there was a temp assignment as a teacher’s aide at a school for the deaf and blind. 3 months later they were “hooked”, offered a permanent teachers aide position and was told that they were “a natural”. The education in Communications and Theater became a plus. 6 months later they were asked to apply for a Masters Certificate Fast Track program and were one of 2 selected out of 300 statewide applicants. Now, a few years later this one is now a Certified Specialist in Special Education for Deaf and Blind, teaches her students by signing into their hands, has been promoted to a Department Head and LOVES what they do.

Kid number 4 was a double Major, with one of them a foreign language and culture, thought they wanted to teach, didn’t like it, spent several years in the “assessment” process, and is now in Grad School towards the end result of getting in the Foreign Service.

My advice is:

Don’t Panic! Do an “assessment” and proceed. Do something…whether it’s temp work, food service, office clerical, substitute teaching, whatever. Get out there, be willing to work and take pride in what you do whatever it is. Most College Grads have a lot of education and very little “Real World” or “Living as an Adult” experience. Your time is not “wasted” be doing any job; your time is wasted by “waiting”. You’re too young to squander these wonderful years of youth by running around in a panic or immobilized by being “above” earning an honest wage for an honest days work.

The College Graduate has proven that they can work to learn and well know how to learn; the "Market Place" now wants to know if you know how to work and can learn to do the job well.

Hope this Helps.

Face
 
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Enthetan

Master of Disaster
So I ask you WHO had the intention to obviscate something this big for so long. Who did it benefit? I could not believe this segment of Cspan put on only once in the wee hrs of the morning.

There is a scale of theft going on that would have politicians swinging from lamp posts if the regular people ever found out the real answers. The more government spending happens, the easier it is to hide the portion which is pure theft.

And then we have the recipients, like this gem of a woman from UK -- 5 kids by 4 different men (2 kids are twins, otherwise it would have been 5 by 5), never worked a day in her life, scrimps to save money from her welfare benfits so she can get a £4,500 boob job.
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
My advice is:

Don’t Panic. Do an “assessment” and proceed. Do something…whether it’s temp work, food service, office clerical, substitute teaching, whatever. Get out there, be willing to work and take pride in what you do whatever it is Most College Grads have a lot of education and very little “real world” or “Living as an Adult” experience. Your time is not “wasted” be doing any job; your time is wasted by “waiting”. You’re too young to squander these wonderful years of youth by running around in a panic or immobilized by being “above” earning an honest wage for an honest days work.

The College Graduate has proven that they can work to learn and well know how to learn; the "Market Place" now wants to know if you know how to work and can learn to do the job well.

Hope this Helps.

Face

Excellent advice. Many people disparage "dead end jobs", but even McDonalds teaches some valuable lessons for the working world, things like:

-- Showing up for work is good.
-- Showing up sober and with enough sleep is better.
-- Telling the boss that he's an asshole may be emotionally satisfying, but a bad idea none the less.
-- You're being paid to work, not socialize.
-- etc, etc.
In a lot of careers, the stuff you learned in college is not that useful. You're going to get taught how things really work in The Company anyway. What's desired is an ability to learn quickly, work diligently, and be able to get along with the people on your team.
 
another small factoid about Hubbard plus a life in the SO story

a friend (I'm not mentioning names, but I called Face, and gave him the details of person, place, and time) of mine told me that LRH used to have a large stack of blank prescriptions, each signed by a Scientology MD. LRH would read up (no internet then) on drugs, write himself a prescription, and someone would go to a pharmacy and pick it up for him.

There was a married couple each separately wanting to leave the SO, but each afraid to tell the other, because of the consequences if the other didn't want to go too. they sat in bed for months. It got down to,

"Are you thinking what I'm thinking?"

"I don't know, what are you thinking?"

this went on for awhile until they spoke the words.
 

afaceinthecrowd

Gold Meritorious Patron
a friend (I'm not mentioning names, but I called Face, and gave him the details of person, place, and time) of mine told me that LRH used to have a large stack of blank prescriptions, each signed by a Scientology MD. LRH would read up (no internet then) on drugs, write himself a prescription, and someone would go to a pharmacy and pick it up for him.

There was a married couple each separately wanting to leave the SO, but each afraid to tell the other, because of the consequences if the other didn't want to go too. they sat in bed for months. It got down to,

"Are you thinking what I'm thinking?"

"I don't know, what are you thinking?"

this went on for awhile until they spoke the words.

I personally vouch as to the veracity of this post.:yes:

Although I did not have access to El Ron’s “stash” on the ship, I do know firsthand that Hisself had access to pretty much any script drugs Hisself wanted.:coolwink:

Face:)
 
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Ted

Gold Meritorious Patron
Having raised a few kids and paid for their college, here’s my 2 cents.

Sometimes a big panic sets in after graduation. Sometimes there is a sudden realization that what they Majored in actually is not what they really are interested in. Sometimes the Major (such as Biology) was done with a plan that they were going to be a teacher and now that the kid is older, they realize they actually don’t want to be a teacher. I’ve seen a lot of “growing up” happen in the last 18 months of college.

Skills and attribute assessment is very important. What do I actually know how to do? What do I like doing? What am I good at? What do others think I’m good at?

I’ve had one kid graduate and not be certain if they wanted to go for a Masters, which would be very important for future job prospects in subject they majored in. The “assessment” was to go to work for a few years to earn some dough at a food server job, which led to an office job, to live while they decided whether or not to go to grad school. This one had time (4 years) to "mature" artistically and refine their portfolio, then went back to school and got a Masters in their undergraduate Major (Fine Arts-Painting and Sculpture) at a top school and they’ve got a good career going because they not only have a Masters but they had the time to figure out what they really wanted and then sacrifice and go for it without second guessing themselves.

I’ve had another that wanted to be a teacher, graduate with a double Major in English and History and then decide they don’t want to teach and go into a real panic. They spoke French, liked to travel and liked being with people so the “assessment” was to get a job as a Flight Attendant and get some “Living as an Adult in the World” under their belt. They were on flights in and out of DC and NYC and got to be friends with a number of bif time journalists. It took nearly 6 years for the “process” to come to fruition but this one is now in one of the top MA-Journalism Schools in the US and is really doing well and is thrilled with their life and has a job waiting upon Graduation.

Another one wanted to be a Theater Arts teacher up until their Senior year, then decided they didn’t want to teach and Graduated with a degree they didn’t know what to do with. The “Assessment” was to use the communication skills from Theater Arts and get a job in merchandising. That led to several years of frustration, but experience that was ‘real World”. The company was sold, the job went away and a year of “Temp Agency” ensued. On day there was a temp assignment as a teacher’s aide at a school for the deaf and blind. 3 months later they were “hooked”, offered a permanent teachers aide position and was told that they were “a natural”. The education in Communications and Theater became a plus. 6 months later they were asked to apply for a Masters Certificate Fast Track program and were one of 2 selected out of 300 statewide applicants. Now, a few years later this one is now a Certified Specialist in Special Education for Deaf and Blind, teaches her students by signing into their hands, has been promoted a Department head and LOVES what they do.

Kid number 4 was a double Major, with one of them a foreign language and culture, thought they wanted to teach, didn’t like it, spent several years in the “assessment” process, and is now in Grad School towards the end result of getting in the Foreign Service.

My advice is:

Don’t Panic! Do an “assessment” and proceed. Do something…whether it’s temp work, food service, office clerical, substitute teaching, whatever. Get out there, be willing to work and take pride in what you do whatever it is Most College Grads have a lot of education and very little “real world” or “Living as an Adult” experience. Your time is not “wasted” be doing any job; your time is wasted by “waiting”. You’re too young to squander these wonderful years of youth by running around in a panic or immobilized by being “above” earning an honest wage for an honest days work.

The College Graduate has proven that they can work to learn and well know how to learn; the "Market Place" now wants to know if you know how to work and can learn to do the job well.

Hope this Helps.

Face


Having worked in the career search industry I do have some experience in this matter. What you write, Facey, is right on target. Right on. People need real-world experience. Without that there isn't much to bring to market, especially these days when "everyone" has a college degree.
 
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