The Little Thread Which Grew - the Apollo '73 to Everything But

[lkwdblds]

Copy of a post made on the Sharone/Candy thread...

I made these comments to Hats signature byline on the thread started by Sharone about Candy's videos. I realized the best place for these quotes is on this thread. The info here was posted back in Nov of 2009 but no harm in posting it again in present time so here goes:

A comment on Hats signature line which I paste/ copied below:

LRHs-Brainwashing manual 1955 "Hypnosis (BRAINWASHING) is induced by acute fear."They" discovered it could be also induced by shock of an emotional nature,and also by extreme privation,as well as by blows, "belief " is ..fear and terror from an authoritative level...followed by obedience!" RPF Tech

..all there is to know about Brainwashing is make somebody think he has to work hard and brace up in order to survive.-30 dec 1957-LRH
A DYING THETAN
Hats

Hats, you may remember that this standard S. O. technique was used on me on the day that I was routing out of the S.O. on the Apollo.

On my routing form, right at the very end, I was met by a 19 year old boy named Mike Mauer. His task before signing my routing form was to read me a quote from LRH.

I was a man who had just turned 34 years old only 3 days earlier on the ship and who had a University degree in Math and Physics and had worked successfully 9 years in the aerospace industry and two years at CCLA Treasury Division. Heber Jentzsch and Don Keeler, Class VIII Case Supervisor, both told me that I was the best treasury person that CCLA had ever had and also one of the best S.O. staff members which they ever had.

Mauer read the following quote, right directly from LRH and I quote, "Anyone who wants to leave the Sea Org after joining it is either Insane or Incompetent or both." I responded to Mauer that I was neither insane nor incompetent and the 19 year old kid, gulped, turned red and then said, "LRH says you are either insane or incompetent so it must be true." He then signed off on my routing form and I walked off the ship, my airplane ticket to L.A. in hand, and got into the HCO car which was to take me to the airport.

Talk about a mind fuck!! I was told in writing by the being I thought was the biggest and wisest being in the Universe that I was insane or incompetent or both. I was already all messed up on the ship by being posted on posts by LRH which I was not hatted to do and then being busted for non performance and being comm eved. The written epitaph by LRH, read by Mauer, was the "coup de gras."

LRH did his best to bring me down and believe me, I was rattled and shook up for months afterwards but I believed enough in my self and my sanity that I never did believe what LRH had said about me. For me, his insistance that I was insane and/or incompetent merely served to prove to me that LRH was not infallible and that he could make mistakes, very serious mistakes about people.

This whole incident was the second step in my process of leaving C of S. The first occurred a month earlier when I had been busted from my post and an LRH messenger came to my berthing and told me that the Commodore knew that I had embezzled funds from CCLA Treasury. I knew that I had never done that so I learned that LRH could be wrong and now I had a second instance where I knew him to be wrong.

Without these two incidents occuring in late 1973, I may have never been able to quit C of S. It took me years, even decades to extricate myself from C of S when I finally stopped taking services in 2001 but had these two incidents not happened on the Apollo in 1973, I would probably still be on lines at my local Org.

Lakey

 

[RogerB]

Hmm, Lakey,

Your post above citing these lines by Hats:

A comment on Hats signature line which I paste/ copied below:

LRHs-Brainwashing manual 1955 "Hypnosis (BRAINWASHING) is induced by acute fear."They" discovered it could be also induced by shock of an emotional nature,and also by extreme privation,as well as by blows, "belief " is ..fear and terror from an authoritative level...followed by obedience!" RPF Tech

..all there is to know about Brainwashing is make somebody think he has to work hard and brace up in order to survive.-30 dec 1957-LRH
A DYING THETAN
Hats

. . . has caused me to reflect on all of Hubbard's writing in an additional new light . . . . and I see more and more how he used what knowledge he had indeed to manipulate and deceitfully brainwash, control and subjugate his people.

That line in red above is one example of a principle he actually implemented! Big time! Jeezzuzz!

RogerB

 

[lkwdblds]

Wow! Hats byline produces some big reactions!

Hmm, Lakey,

Your post above citing these lines by Hats:



. . . has caused me to reflect on all of Hubbard's writing in an additional new light . . . . and I see more and more how he used what knowledge he had indeed to manipulate and deceitfully brainwash, control and subjugate his people.

That line in red above is one example of a principle he actually implemented! Big time! Jeezzuzz!

RogerB

Interesting Roger, Hats picks a quote that cracks an opening in a door to LRH's mind, I peek through the opening and now you look through and open the door ajar a bit and see something big. That is really amazing!

Just to balance things a bit, Candy is still in there pitching for LRH as a decent guy so I am getting two sides of the coin simultaneously.

In Candy's case, she ran a lot of missions for him in a stellar manner and was offered the executive post of CS 5 (Commodore's Staff for Division 5 - Qual). Candy politely turned down the offered promotion and notified LRH that she wanted to play a game where she was source and not him.

He wrote a Flag Order commending Candy and allowed her to route out in good standing to pursue her own career. She was not read the Flag Order telling her that she was insane or incompetent that I had read to me. She left the Apollo in early 1970 while I left in the last days of 1973 so maybe he hadn't written that Flag Order yet.

Candy's look at it is that LRH was inviting us all to be Source in their own Universe. If someone kowtowed and paid homage to him, that was not what he was looking for and he roughed them up and punished them. When someone showed competence and then wanted to go off and play their own game, if they had the balls to confront him head on and request to leave, she feels that he then respected this person and let them go with his blessings.

If this is true, then Candy is the only one whom I have heard of who was able to leave with his blessings.

I tried debating her and mentioned others who attempted to be on equal footing with LRH and do their own thing. The only ones in that category that I can dredge up are Jack Horner, John Mac Master, and Otto Roos. All three of those guys were crucified by LRH. She shot down Mac Master on the grounds that he was gay and LRH would not give a gay person a free pass. She shot down Roos on some other grounds. At the time, I could not think of Horner's name and so she could not respond about his leaving.

Anyway, this is a very interesting topic and her look at this topic is quite unique. I hope you, Candy or others have more to say on this topic.
Lakey

 

[afaceinthecrowd]

Interesting Roger, Hats picks a quote that cracks an opening in a door to LRH's mind, I peek through the opening and now you look through and open the door ajar a bit and see something big. That is really amazing!

Just to balance things a bit, Candy is still in there pitching for LRH as a decent guy so I am getting two sides of the coin simultaneously.

In Candy's case, she ran a lot of missions for him in a stellar manner and was offered the executive post of CS 5 (Commodore's Staff for Division 5 - Qual). Candy politely turned down the offered promotion and notified LRH that she wanted to play a game where she was source and not him.

He wrote a Flag Order commending Candy and allowed her to route out in good standing to pursue her own career. She was not read the Flag Order telling her that she was insane or incompetent that I had read to me. She left the Apollo in early 1970 while I left in the last days of 1973 so maybe he hadn't written that Flag Order yet.

Candy's look at it is that LRH was inviting us all to be Source in their own Universe. If someone kowtowed and paid homage to him, that was not what he was looking for and he roughed them up and punished them. When someone showed competence and then wanted to go off and play their own game, if they had the balls to confront him head on and request to leave, she feels that he then respected this person and let them go with his blessings.

If this is true, then Candy is the only one whom I have heard of who was able to leave with his blessings.

I tried debating her and mentioned others who attempted to be on equal footing with LRH and do their own thing. The only ones in that category that I can dredge up are Jack Horner, John Mac Master, and Otto Roos. All three of those guys were crucified by LRH. She shot down Mac Master on the grounds that he was gay and LRH would not give a gay person a free pass. She shot down Roos on some other grounds. At the time, I could not think of Horner's name and so she could not respond about his leaving.

Anyway, this is a very interesting topic and her look at this topic is quite unique. I hope you, Candy or others have more to say on this topic.
Lakey

I’ve been reading Sharone’s “Candy” thread. I really don’t want to get into the debate about it but I do have a few comments I feel compelled to make at this time for you, Lakey.

As I have said before on ESMB, El Ron always treated me, comparatively, real well. I did Special Missions for Hisself, too and I had a bunch of El Ron VWD’s and HC’s and “Issue” format VHC’s. As far as I’m concerned…BFD.

I saw Hisself go from pleasantly chatting or interacting with me to everything from “ripping some ones face off” to “slowly squeezing their balls” to wickedly invalidating them in a very sly ad hom way and then immediately back to pleantness with me. I didn’t see it as Hisself “using the correct tone or amount of force”. I saw it as cruel, unbefitting Hisself’s stature and position and it certainly wasn’t how I personally would have treated that particular person in that particular situation...not even close. These instances were real WTF’s for me and, over time, led me to question everything about Scn…while I was still in the SO and on duty.

The fact that you got vilified for leaving and Candy got a pat on the head shows just how tangential and non sequitur the man could be. The idea that El Ron wanted us all to be “source” and stand up to Hisself is distinctly NOT what I saw in the number of years I was on El Ron’s lines and face to Face with Hisself. Just take a look at what happened to Otto Roos…one of the biggest mistakes El Ron ever made.

Now I like Candy just fine…I pretty much like most folks just fine…and she is free to have whatever opinion she wants to have about El Ron. I happen to have another opinion and it’s also based on personal interaction with El Ron. And, I assure you, I aint no wussy.

Face

 

[Auditor's Toad]

I’ve been reading Sharone’s “Candy” thread. I really don’t want to get into the debate about it but I do have a few comments I feel compelled to make at this time for you, Lakey.

As I have said before on ESMB, El Ron always treated me, comparatively, real well. I did Special Missions for Hisself, too and I had a bunch of El Ron VWD’s and HC’s and “Issue” format VHC’s. As far as I’m concerned…BFD.

I saw Hisself go from pleasantly chatting with me to everything from “ripping some ones face off” to “slowly squeezing their balls” to wickedly invalidating them in a very sly ad hom way. I didn’t see it at Hisself “using the correct tone or amount of force”. I saw it as cruel, unbefitting Hisself’s stature and position and it certainly wasn’t how I personally would have treated that particular person in that particular situation...not even close. These instances were real WTF’s for me and, over time, led my to question everything about Scn…while I was still in the SO and on duty.

The fact that you got vilified for leaving and Candy got a pat on the head shows just haw tangential and non sequitur the man could be. The idea that El Ron wanted us all to be “source” and stand up to Hisself is distinctly NOT what I saw in the number of years I was on El Ron’s lines and face to Face with Hisself. Just take a look at what happened to Otto Roos…one of the biggest mistakes El Ron ever made.

Now I like Candy just fine…I pretty much like most folks just fine…and she is free to have whatever opinion she wants to have about El Ron. I happen to have another opinion and it’s also based on personal interaction with El Ron. And, I assure you, I aint no wussy.

Face

Extremely well said. Thank you.

 

[Mark A. Baker]

... Candy's look at it is that LRH was inviting us all to be Source in their own Universe. If someone kowtowed and paid homage to him, that was not what he was looking for and he roughed them up and punished them. When someone showed competence and then wanted to go off and play their own game, if they had the balls to confront him head on and request to leave, she feels that he then respected this person and let them go with his blessings. ....

Perhaps. Or perhaps a more likely explanation lies in the fact that Candy was a cute young blond whose attention was itself flattering to LRH.


Mark A. Baker

 

[afaceinthecrowd]

Perhaps. Or perhaps a more likely explanation lies in the fact that Candy was a cute young blond whose attention was itself flattering to LRH.


Mark A. Baker

Bingo!

I didn't go there in my post but, now that you brought it up, the fact of the matter is El Ron always "played footsie" with and "Prince Charming" for the sweet, young things. Sylvia (Calhoun) Gill was a Senior Flag Officer and one of Hisself's personal favorites (and mine too, for that matter) and was Hisself's Personal PRO and photographer. In the early '70's she (white) married a very intelligent, College educated, articulate, cultured and handsome newbie (black) and, within the blink of an eye, they were transferred to the PAC Estates Org.

Face

 

[Leon]

Yep. And let's be honest about it - ALL guys LOVE the attention of a really gorgeous young girl. And that includes me big time - I go all queasy and would gladly sign my eternity away for moreof that.

 

[afaceinthecrowd]

Yep. And let's be honest about it - ALL guys LOVE the attention of a really gorgeous young girl. And that includes me big time - I go all queasy and would gladly sign my eternity away for moreof that.

Gawd help me...me too, Leon. So far, I've been lucky enough to only lose 3/4's of my taw.

Face

 

[lkwdblds]

You make an excellent point

Perhaps. Or perhaps a more likely explanation lies in the fact that Candy was a cute young blond whose attention was itself flattering to LRH.


Mark A. Baker

You make an excellent point. Leon makes a comment a couple of posts down from here that most men are vulnerable to the charms of a cute young blond so why single out LRH?

I wanted to clear up a point which someone PMed me about and that had to do with gay people. Neither Candy nor I have any slightest negative reaction to gay people. Both her and I have close relatives who are gay and it matters zilch to us and we love these people dearly and support gay rights.

What I meant to express was that Candy felt LRH had a thing against gays and because of that he did not release Mac Master and give him a free pass to go out and play his own game, the way he did to Candy. Had Johnny Mac been straight, she thought that LRH might have allowed him to leave the way he did with her.

Face and MAB seem to be 100% correct on this one. LRH showed no other productive person any particular respect and did not let anyone go off and do their own thing except for Candy. Who knows for sure why he cut her so much slack? The pretty blond thing might be partially or fully behind his actions but we will never know for sure. She always wore a hibiscus flower on her ear and played up the Hawaiian thing and what man can resist that?

I was treated similar to how Face saw others being treated. To tell a person who quit a $90,000 a year job and came to work for him for $10 a week that he is insane and/or incompetent is definitely viscious, despicible and hitting below the belt. He might have a point there that I was insane for quitting my aerospace job but he was infering I was insane for quitting my job with him. He cared not if he ruined me personally and destroyed my sanity by having this vicious lie read to me. Why would a supposed great man and the guru for a new and fast growing religion ever do a thing such as that?

It was his case talking and he had a big one. Here again he does not follow his own policies, the policies I am refering to are #1, no case on post and #2 is expressed in one of his most moving essays, "What is Greatness?". He extolled not changing and going negative no matter how severe the circumstances were and yet as was all too typical of him, HE DID NOT FOLLOW HIS OWN POLICY in dealing with me and grant me beingness; instead he tried to destroy my beingness and in general he was teeming with case on post and not following that policy either.

Well, like Face, I calls 'em as I sees 'em and Hubbard just did not follow his own policies. Time and time again, this can be substantiated with facts.
Lakey

 

[cakemaker]

For the record:

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Where's my cake?

Thanks, Cakemaker! I think this is a very healthy discussion...good for you guys!

And it's party night! Everybody have fun at the pot luck!

 

[Timebreaker]

This sounds a tiny little bit like what I, personally, got out of PEAT.

You've got my attention. I'm off to read TROM.

How did that go for you?

 

[Leon]

Hatsy, a question here. Lakey quoted you with this: ..all there is to know about Brainwashing is make somebody think he has to work hard and brace up in order to survive.-30 dec 1957-LRH
A DYING THETAN
Hats

On my master tape list there is no such lecture. Could you check on the title for me?

On 30 Dec 57 LRH was giving the Ability Congress and the lectures of that day were:

57.12.30a AC-4 CAUSE AND EFFECT
57.12.30b AC-5 CREATING A THIRD DYNAMIC
57.12.30c AC-6 UPPER ROUTE TO OPERATING THETAN

Which one are you referring to? Or is this one the current CofS has gone and changed around/


Oh, and Lakey: Hi name was Mike Mauerer, with an extra 'er' on the end. He was a really cool guy in his better moments and a fine auditor too. His mother Phoebe was also around at that time. A pity you had a bad experience of him.

 

[Hatshepsut]

Hatsy, a question here. Lakey quoted you with this: ..all there is to know about Brainwashing is make somebody think he has to work hard and brace up in order to survive.-30 dec 1957-LRH
A DYING THETAN
Hats

On my master tape list there is no such lecture. Could you check on the title for me?

On 30 Dec 57 LRH was giving the Ability Congress and the lectures of that day were:

57.12.30a AC-4 CAUSE AND EFFECT
57.12.30b AC-5 CREATING A THIRD DYNAMIC
57.12.30c AC-6 UPPER ROUTE TO OPERATING THETAN

Which one are you referring to? Or is this one the current CofS has gone and changed around/


Oh, and Lakey: Hi name was Mike Mauerer, with an extra 'er' on the end. He was a really cool guy in his better moments and a fine auditor too. His mother Phoebe was also around at that time. A pity you had a bad experience of him.

Haha.

I think you are right Leon! This is really funny. I went to that post of Lakey's straight off when I logged in. I had had a wonderful cognition early today. His post resonated with me. I spotted shock after shock and how it made me maleable to someone else defining who I was. I'd seen it happen to a lot of others I had known... Constant battery where a person has no safe solution or support network any more to fall back on.
Someone who is afraid of your horsepower or afraid that their postulates won't hold water after their life is usurped by a bigger being just goes ballistic.

I'm thinking of all the pioneers who went out West from the eastern seabord. You can imagine they must've gone into some shock crossing the Rockies in the snow. Or being stuck in Nebraska with the constant wind howling and Indians everywhere and no place to hide your babies. Or the young bride taken far far away from her family only to find out she's married a sadistic brute. I think a sort of numbness and shock must set in where the person realizes they have grossly miscalculated things. They have no place to go to if they back out. There is no support network. Their judgement has failed them their stable data is wrong.

LAKEY dearest, sweet, complimenting, fellow poster...could you please do me the favor of digging up 'my' .... NEVER MIND, IN MY HEAD, I DID A RUN ON INTO THE BRAINWASHING MANUAL QUOTE. (I don't think I posted the DYING THETAN clip from Dec 30th 1957.) I might have been quoting somebody. Sounds like something Jachss may have posted back when. Yep, it was his adopted byline, I just checked.

YES, Leon, I will check my library of transcripts and the big library I know how to tap. Give me a sec..

 

[Hatshepsut]

In 1957 LRH was very busy.

I cannot go thru all of em. But you are right the only ones dated for Dec 30th are the 3 you listed. I am looking..


I'm back! I did not find anything there except 'shock' being taken up as electrical regarding the field of psychology. No word 'brainwasing' was found.

Looks like Jachss found it......because he is using it in his signature. Below

 

[Jachs]

Is this what your looking for Leon.
EXCERPTS Upper Route to Operating Thetan, Ability Congress, 30 December 1957:

Now, brainwashing becomes very easy to understand if you understand the principle of survival. And the way to get this thetan in trouble is to make him do, and think he has to make an effort to do the thing he is doing, and therefore he engages continously in an effort, but he can’t do anything else than what he is doing, but to tell him that he has to make an effort to do it is the biggest trick that can be played upon a living being. You got that? If you know that well, you really — you really got your wits wrapped around something…

You understand, all there is to know about brainwashing is all you have to do is make somebody think he has to work hard and brace up in order to survive. That’s the single-denominator trick that is used in all brainwashing and not even the Russki understands it. He works like mad to do all kinds of wild, weird things and hocus-pocus and soul-searchings in order to get somebody brainwashed, and then he fails.

 

[Hatshepsut]

Right you are Jachss. I used up a lot of time forgetting these are two separate excerpts. They are from different documents.

LRHs-Brainwashing manual 1955 "Hypnosis (BRAINWASHING) is induced by acute fear."They" discovered it could be also induced by shock of an emotional nature,and also by extreme privation,as well as by blows, "belief " is ..fear and terror from an authoritative level...followed by obedience!" RPF Tech

...........................................................................................

..all there is to know about Brainwashing is make somebody think he has to work hard and brace up in order to survive.-30 dec 1957-LRH
A DYING THETAN
Hats

 

[Hatshepsut]

Man O man. This manual I just took a peek at made the fuzzies stand up on my arms.

http://www.hiddenmysteries.org/themagazine/vol14/scientology/brain-wash-3.shtml

snippet from the brainwashing manual

The stimulus-responce mechanisms of the body are such that the pain and the command subdivide so as to counter each other. The mental image picture of the punishment will not become effective upon the individual unless the command content is disobeyed. It is pointed out in many early Russian writings that this is a survival mechanism. It has already been well and thoroughly used in the survival of Communism.

It is only necessary to deliver into the organism a sufficient stimulus to gain an adequate response.

So long as the organism obeys the stimulus whenever it is restimulated in the future, it does not suffer from the pain of the stimulus. But should it entirely disobey the command content of the stimulus, the stimulus reacts to punish the individual. Thus, we have an optimum circumstance, and one of the basic principles of Psychopolitics. A sufficiently installed stimulus will thereafter remain as a police mechanism within the individual to cause him to follow the commands and directions given to him. Should he fail to follow these commands and directions, the stimulus mechanism will go into action. As the commands are there with the moment of duress, the commands themselves need never be repeated, and if the individual were to depart thousands of miles away from the psychopolitical operative, he will still obey the psychopolitical operative, or, himself, become extremely ill and in agony. These principles, built from the earliest days of Pavlov, by constant and continuous Russian development, have, at last, become of enormous use to us in our conquest. For less modern and well-informed countries of Earth, lacking this mechanism, failing to understand it, and coaxed into somnolence by our own psychopolitical operatives, who discount and disclaim it, cannot avoid succumbing to it.

The body is less able to resist a stimulus if it has insufficient food and is weary. Therefore, it is necessary to administer all such stimuli to individuals when their ability to resist has been reduced by privation and exhaustion. Refusal to let them sleep over many day, denying them adequate food, then brings about an optimum state for the receipt of a stimulus. If the person is then given an electric shock, and is told while the shock is in action that he must obey and do certain things, he has no choice but to do them, or to re-experience, because of his mental image picture of it, the electric shock. This highly scientific and intensely workable mechanism cannot be over-estimated in the practice of psychopolitics.

Drugging the individual produces an artificial exhaustion, and if he is drugged, or shocked and beaten, and given a string of commands, his loyalties, themselves, can be definitely rearranged. This is P.D.H., or Pain-Drug Hypnosis.

The psychopolitical operative in training should be thoroughly studied in the subject of hypnotism and post-hypnotic suggestion. He should pay particular attention to the "forgetter mechanism" aspect of hypnotism, which is to say, implantation in the unconscious mind. He should note particularly that a person given a command in an hypnotic state, and then told when still in that condition to forget it, will execute it on a stimulus-responce signal in the environment after he has "awakened" from his hypnotic trance.

Having mastered these details fully, he should, by practicing upon criminals and prisoners or inmates available to him, produce the hypnotic trance by drugs, and drive home post-hypnotic suggestions by pain administered to the drugged person. He should then study the reactions of the person when "awakened", and should give him the stimulus-responce signal which would throw into action the commands given while in a drugged state of duress. By much practice he can then learn the threshold dosages of various drugs, and the amount of duress in terms of electric shock of additional drug shock necessary to produce the optimum obedience to the commands. He should also satisfy himself the there is no possible method known to Man -there must be no possible method known to Man -of bringing the patient into awareness of what has happened to him, keeping him in a state of obedience and response while ignorant of its cause.

Oy vey

 

[Jachs]

Most definitely Hats you nailed it! two different source documents.

Reading that brainwashing manual and LRHs authority level and now Miscaviges
you can just see the negative 'magik' power of OBEDIENCE that is held over the staff member and sea org member and why they OBEY commands intention !

Extreme Privation/isolation of origination of comm for fear of others reporting, physical duress, fear, terror, and an abundance of potential rules to break ,using SHOCK restimulative terms such as Crime, High crimes, comm eve, SP declare. When the fear or terror giver is inhumane the power over the recipient is multiplied many times. Its a war zone.

LRH was a monger and a saint all in one, using this black tech laced in his own policy, the suicides, deaths, in some fear still 20 years after leaving to break the obey command laid in deceptively and look at that which was forbidden..what a mind bender.

7keeping him in a state of obedience and response while ignorant of its cause.