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I have a new opinion about Freezoners

Terril park said:
Please post where I commented on someones life savings.
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posted 2 April, 2010, 10:24 AM Pacific Time
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=396941&postcount=851

text below (relevant lines highlighted):

TECH outside COS: Thanks to Ken Urquhart!



On the 19th of February, 2010 I attested to OTVII. When Pierre asked if I would like to attest, I felt the burden of millions of years of enslavement finally lift from my shoulders. I am very excited to be me and only me. More than any other, I feel this level was a huge accomplishment for me because I have had OT abilities turning on. I am fascinated by the possibilities. I also feel a great satisfaction in that the level provided me an opportunity to help so many others.



I first became aware of Scientology in 1964. When I first read the DMSMH, it was a wakeup call. There was a way out. I was in college at the time but after I saw John McMasters (the first Clear) in Washington, DC at a seminar, I knew that I had to get involved. I dropped out of college and went to DC for processing and training. A couple years later I was in LA and became Clear 2866. Then I took a long break and got on with my life.



I retired from my job in 2001 and I reevaluated my position in Scientology. I had about $150,000. in my savings. I could either leave that money for my kids to spend when I died or I could spend it on myself in Scientology. Even though I had made no attempt to get additional training or processing for 37 years, I chose the latter.



I went to Flag. The training and processing I received were great. But when I tried to get on the OT courses, I came up head to wall on my first block. Interestingly, it was not my case that was in question but that of my wife. She resented any changes the Church wanted her to make and I finally realized that I was not going to change her and concluded “why should I?” However, I was stuck. I sat in my hotel room for 3 weeks waiting for approval to continue but it became obvious I was not going to get it. That’s when I blew Flag.



I resolved to just purchase all the tapes and other materials I could get my hands on and spend the rest of my life studying Scientology. While purchasing books one of the sellers gave me a call, Tom Smith. In chatting with him I learned of the Freezone where processing and training could be had outside the Church.



I was able to get a rebate on my unused monies in the CofS and then Ken Urquhart took me to OTV. It seemed that my wife was not a factor after all. Later I received the L’s from Pierre and did the OTVI course and then Pierre C/S’ed me through OTVII. It is interesting to note that I was able to take that refund which I had saved only to reach OTIII in the CofS and use it to pay for OTII through OTVII with the L’s thrown in as well.



It is now my intention to go to OT XV with Pierre. I look forward to what I know will be an exciting and very rewarding journey. My thanks to Ken Urquhart, and a very special thanks to Pierre Ethier. It is dedicated people like these two that keep Scientology working and there for the rest of us. It is comforting to know that there are Scientologists who still practice Standard Tech.



Signed: John R. Beckner Date: 21 Feb 2010

Ken,

I would be honored for you to use my success story and I would be pleased if it helped you in any way. Please, also, feel free to use my name. I would like for others to know what I've been able to accomplish with your and Pierre's help.
John




For more information on services in the Freezone,
mail me, Terril Park, at basic2basic@ yahoo.com
 
Mockingbird6 said:
The one viewpoint that has never been allowed on this board is the one that says, "I no longer agree with Scientology being called a religion, but I actually had gains from Scientology." Expressing gains from Scientology here brings instant punishment, so I have avoided doing that.
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That particular paragraph is a complete load of gos se. When you read many of the personal stories you find that people have had gains and admit to them, but they have not had the supergains that were promised, and most of the real gains could have been gotten elsewhere if people were prepared to look.

I don't know why people are so up in arms over Emma's initial post. She opens saying that it's a rant and could piss some people, yet everyone responding to it seems to have missed the qualifier in her predominant statement:

if you still consider yourself a Scientologist THEN YOU ARE FUCKING STUPID!

By Scn's own definition, if you are not on lines, not paying into the CoS coffers, not applying standard (DM?) tech, then you are not a Scientologist any more.

I am not anti-freezone. People have a right to choose their own path but, if that path is other than Scn then, don't call it Scn. At best it is pseudo-Scientology.

I also note that while Terril seems to have become a major target here, he appears to have taken it all in good fun. I suggest that other people do so as well.

Many of the more stable personalities on this board have made "unstable" rant posts in the past, and that doesn't reflect on the overall 'personality' of ESMB--it's that particular person venting steam.
 
Actually, many old timers would not consider what is going on in the current co$ as Scientology....

too much has been changed and altered by the current regime.

The co$ has copyrights on their current altered version while most Freezoners practice original Scientology.

In fact, some of the original OT levels are not even offered in the church any longer.

Marina

Royal Prince Xenu said:
That particular paragraph is a complete load of gos se. When you read many of the personal stories you find that people have had gains and admit to them, but they have not had the supergains that were promised, and most of the real gains could have been gotten elsewhere if people were prepared to look.

I don't know why people are so up in arms over Emma's initial post. She opens saying that it's a rant and could piss some people, yet everyone responding to it seems to have missed the qualifier in her predominant statement:

if you still consider yourself a Scientologist THEN YOU ARE FUCKING STUPID!

By Scn's own definition, if you are not on lines, not paying into the CoS coffers, not applying standard (DM?) tech, then you are not a Scientologist any more.

I am not anti-freezone. People have a right to choose their own path but, if that path is other than Scn then, don't call it Scn. At best it is pseudo-Scientology.

I also note that while Terril seems to have become a major target here, he appears to have taken it all in good fun. I suggest that other people do so as well.

Many of the more stable personalities on this board have made "unstable" rant posts in the past, and that doesn't reflect on the overall 'personality' of ESMB--it's that particular person venting steam.
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Even in the coffin of its hopes

Witch-moon that turnest all the streams to blood,
I take this hazel rod, and stand, and swear
An Oath-beneath this blasted Oak and bare
That rears its agony above the flood
Whose swollen mask mutters an atheist's prayer.
What oath may stand the shock of this offence:
"There is no I, no joy, no permanence"?

Witch-moon of blood, eternal ebb and flow
Of baffled birth, in death still lurks a change;
And all the leopards in thy woods that range,
And all the vampires in their boughs that glow,
Brooding on blood-thirst-these are not so strange
And fierce as life's unfailing shower. These die,
Yet time rebears them through eternity.

Hear then the Oath, with-moon of blood, dread moon!
Let all thy stryges and thy ghouls attend!
He that endureth even to the end
Hath sworn that Love's own corpse shall lie at noon
, Even in the coffin of its hopes , and spend
All the force won by its old woe and stress
In now annihilating Nothingness.

From THE BOOK OF LIES.
 
Dear Emma,
Thanks for your insightful decision I am an Ex-Scio and never to be a Scio again, it took a leap on your part to do what you did and I applaud you for it, this is an ex board and in it's purest form it should be what you have decided it to be, this board is not a democracy and nor should it be. Others that think otherwise than what you have decided can go elsewhere or create their own board. You to a large extent carry the risk and the hits as they come since this is in your name, oh we may band together and help but in the end anyone of us could simple disappear. So get as pissed off as you like, not that you need or want anyone's permission to do so, this board is what it is and nothing more or less.

This is a place for me until it isn't.
James
 
Outethicsofficer said:
Dear Emma,
Thanks for your insightful decision I am an Ex-Scio and never to be a Scio again, it took a leap on your part to do what you did and I applaud you for it, this is an ex board and in it's purest form it should be what you have decided it to be, this board is not a democracy and nor should it be. Others that think otherwise than what you have decided can go elsewhere or create their own board. You to a large extent carry the risk and the hits as they come since this is in your name, oh we may band together and help but in the end anyone of us could simple disappear. So get as pissed off as you like, not that you need or want anyone's permission to do so, this board is what it is and nothing more or less.

This is a place for me until it isn't.
James
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I read the post just before this one. I was reading intensely, following the rhythm and connecting the poetic phrasing to get the deep meaning in the poem. Then I read your post James, and my brain was still moving in time with the rhythm of that Crowley poem. It added a very nice extra poetic quality to your post. Very nice.
 
Outethicsofficer said:
Dear Emma,
<snip>

This is a place for me until it isn't.
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I like this!

And, when it "isn't" that's OK too!..........Why hang around somewhere when it doesn't feel good or right to do so?

People can be quick to judge when they aren't in another's shoes. ESMB isn't the same for everybody, and the freedoms that individuals here have in regard to speaking their mind without repercussions, do differ.
 
freet43 said:
Actually, many old timers would not consider what is going on in the current co$ as Scientology....

too much has been changed and altered by the current regime.

The co$ has copyrights on their current altered version while most Freezoners practice original Scientology.

In fact, some of the original OT levels are not even offered in the church any longer.

Marina
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This is from two old posts. The first is mostly Hubbard quotes from "the good old days," which I've re-posted before, and the second is a follow up post on the fallacy of "Standard Tech," which was changing daily even as Hubbard was pounding his fist about it on the Class VIII Course.

Veda said:
From 'Keeping Scientology Working', 7 February, 1965:

"We're not playing some minor game in Scientology. It isn't something cute to do for lack of something better.

"The whole agonized future of this planet, every Man, Woman, and Child on it, and your own destiny for the next endless trillions of years depend on what you do here and now with and in Scientology :unsure::ohmy::yes:

"This is a deadly serious activity. And if we miss getting out of the trap now, we may never again have another chance :spacecraft:. [See 'Implantology'] Remember, this is our first chance in all the endless trillions of years of the past . Don't muff it now because it seems unpleasant or unsocial to do Seven [Hammering out of existence incorrect technology], Eight..."

Just prior to the appearance of 'KSW', was published the piece 'My Philosophy', in which L. Ron Hubbard told Scientologists:

"Blinded with injured optic nerves, and lame with physical injuries to the hip and back, at the end of World War II, I faced an almost nonexistent future. My service record stated: 'This officer has no neurotic or psychotic tendencies whatsoever', but also stated, 'permanently disabled physically'.

"And so there came a further blow. I was abandoned by family and friends :violin: as a supposedly hopeless cripple and probable burden on them for the rest of my days."

And, on 7 March 1965, exactly one month after the appearance of 'KSW' was published 'Suppressive Acts, Suppression of Scientology and Scientologists, the Fair Game Law':

"A Suppressive person or group becomes 'fair game'.

"By Fair Game is meant, without rights for self, possessions or position, and no Scientologist may be brought before a Committee of Evidence or punished for any action taken against a Suppressive Person or group...

"Suppressive acts are defined as actions or omissions undertaken to knowingly suppress, reduce, or impede Scientology or Scientologists.

"Such suppressive acts include public disavowal of Scientology... public statements against Scientology.

"[Suppressive acts also include] 1st degree murder, arson, disintegration of persons or belongings not [emphasis added] guilty of suppressive acts.

"[Suppressive Persons] place themselves beyond any consideration for their feelings :nazi:or well being...

"The homes, property, places, and abodes of persons who have been active in attempting to suppress Scientology... are all beyond any protection."

And thus began the (post 1965) era of "modern Scientology," in which L. Ron Hubbard began in earnest to apply the basics of this booklet http://warrior.xenu.ca/Brainwashing-front.jpg on his own followers.

Strangely enough, some people regard this period as "the good old days," when the 'Scientological Onion' http://exscn.net/content/view/178/105 was robust, and before the final monument building stage of Scientology commenced - per L. Ron Hubbard's confidential instructions - under its current leader David Miscavige. http://deadagenting.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/hubbard-and-miscavige-2.jpg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_w-YWwC1lI
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Veda said:
There never was a response to the above post so, if I may, here are a few questions, to be answered or ignored as you please.

Do you use any of the above LRH materials? For example, do you regard 'Keeping Scientology Working' of 1965 as part of the Standard Tech Academy curriculum?

I first walked into the New York Org in 1969, did the Communications course and H.Q.S course in 1970, and first audited - with an e-meter - on the Hubbard Standard Dianetics Course, in 1971. Looking back on it, Scientology was very much a totalist (totalitarian) cult by that time, with previously normal Org staff returning from a stay at the mysterious Flagship (where Ron was) with a proclivity for purple faced rages, and an emphasis on punitive "ethics," with the Academy starting its day with a shout, "What are we going to do today?" answered by "Produce!" and then followed by "Let's see those demo kits move!" - as a giant pie-faced gold-framed photo of Ron loomed overhead.

At the time, I accepted it all as a strange new experience, and focused my attention (kept my TRs in) on completing my courses, and on auditing.

A few years later, in the mid 1970s, I was back "on lines" again, and many things had changed. There was heavy emphasis on FNing everything and seeming never ending use of an annoyance called "Method 4 word clearing," where, every time I read a bulletin, my subconscious mind was to be consulted, while holding the cans, to see if there was anything I "didn't fully get," "disagreed with," etc.

The e-meter was king.

Before completing the actions I went there to do, the last new bulletin I read from Ron was his 'LSD, Years after they had come off of', which was soon to be followed by the "Sweat Program," where people were expected to wear rubber suits and run around and sweat out their "LSD crystals" so they wouldn't be "zombies, to a greater or lesser degree" anymore. Then the price increases began, and by 1978 more changes occurred: Ron had discovered "Dianetic Clear" was quite common indeed, and that "keyed out Clear was Clear," and that "Dianetic Clears" should skip Power, R6EW, and the Clearing Course, and go directly (once "up lines") to their OT levels. The old HSDC course had had many of its Bulletins changed to conform with the new "discoveries" (for example, "Somatic" had been deleted and replaced with "consideration"), and the Dianetics Course was renamed and featured long prepared assessment lists - even more emphasis on formality and the e-meter.

It seemed like almost everyone was now - suddenly - a "Dianetic Clear," and things were becoming a bit surreal. It was then that I first could no longer ignore the "hypnotic" effect that Ron had on most Scientologists. For years "yadda yadda was not xyz," and then Hubbard went, "yadda yadda is xyz" and Scientologists went, without missing a beat, "yadda yadda is xyz!"

Then came further changes to the Grade Chart, from Ron, changes made according to Ron's orders through Senior C/S International David Mayo. The OT levels had been changed after OT 3, replaced with something called NOTs - which promised to do what the Clearing Course had once promised to do, then OT 3 had promised to do: Remove the final barrier to full OT - and the Scientologists were eager to travel to Flag for their NOTs, which was hyped to the hilt.

And even though I was still a Scientologist, and still - occasionally - "on lines," I had begun to back away from Scientologists (who seemed hypnotically agreeable to "LRH tech," yet oddly, in some vague way, fearful of "LRH Tech.")

Finally, I received a phone call from AOLA, telling me that old OT8 (which it turns out never existed anyway) had been replaced, and was asked what I wanted to do with that money. So, I bought the PDC tapes, and sitting in an easy chair in my library - where I had a nearly complete collection of the works of Aleister Crowley, a new interest, but that's another story - listened to Ron say things that sounded like rephrasings of passages I had recently read in Crowley's writings.

Naively, I still thought I could continue with Scientology, but of course, it was becoming impossible. I was "graduating from Scientology" and didn't even know it.

And this was all before most had heard the name "David Miscavige."

And there's much more that could be said, but the point (or one of the points) is that there was never a time, during my involvement in Scientology, when "Standard Tech" remained the same for more than a few months.

So, in your opinion, Standard Tech Academy, what do you regard as Standard Tech? Does it include the LRH materials cited at the beginning of this post, and does it include the Class 8 course?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVqN4ivQ_TM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwDKg5K3in8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6P4YV6CfI0

If possible, any clarification would be appreciated.
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freet43 said:
Actually, many old timers would not consider what is going on in the current co$ as Scientology....

too much has been changed and altered by the current regime.

The co$ has copyrights on their current altered version while most Freezoners practice original Scientology.

In fact, some of the original OT levels are not even offered in the church any longer.

Marina
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There's no denying that things have been altered, and not just the occasional piece of punctuation. The point is that if a group ('squirrell' or of the opinion that the current church is "squirrell") is all tech and throw-away-the-admin then the members of that group are not truly "scientologists" any more.

I have seen conflicting versions of the lower OT levels (1 & 2). That still does not change that $cn defines itself as the "only", and therefore people identifying as Scientologists on the outside are, by definition, deluding themselves. To say, "I use bits of scientology as I see fit," does not a Scientologist make.

Carmel said:
I like this!

And, when it "isn't" that's OK too!..........Why hang around somewhere when it doesn't feel good or right to do so?

People can be quick to judge when they aren't in another's shoes. ESMB isn't the same for everybody, and the freedoms that individuals here have in regard to speaking their mind without repercussions, do differ.
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There is an advantage to "walking a mile in the other man's shoes". You end up a mile away from the nuisance person and you get a new pair of shoes.
 
RogerB said:
Hey, now there's a sane post! :yes:

I think I'll add you to my Xmas card list . . . it'll go some ways to make up for the idiots who drop you off theirs.:D

RogerB
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I find that Hubbard's fundamental errors as contained in Factors and Axioms are still carried over into Knowledgism.

.
 
^^^ Is that a new opinion about the Freezone or an attempted threadjack? ^^^
What does your random comment about Knowledgism have to do with the Post you quoted?
 
I agree with the insanity in FZ.

I briefly visited an FZ board a long time ago.

I was driven out from there pretty fast.

.
 
Panda Termint said:
^^^ Is that a new opinion about the Freezone or an attempted threadjack? ^^^
What does your random comment about Knowledgism have to do with the Post you quoted?
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I was thinking in terms of the virus of Scientology infecting FZ and then other places as well.

.
 
Vinaire said:
I find that Hubbard's fundamental errors as contained in Factors and Axioms are still carried over into Knowledgism.

.
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Just as a point of truth, and to put Vin's vicious little post in context, Alan W actually countered LRH's axioms as shown for example in my post here on ESMB of Alan's and my rewrite of "Axiom One."

But Vin ignores all this in his continued invective, this apart from not ever having done any courses in Kn while posing as an "authority" on such! :duh:

R
 
RogerB said:
Just as a point of truth, and to put Vin's vicious little post in context, Alan W actually countered LRH's axioms as shown for example in my post here on ESMB of Alan's and my rewrite of "Axiom One."

But Vin ignores all this in his continued invective, this apart from not ever having done any courses in Kn while posing as an "authority" on such! :duh:

R
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Could you please link it here. Thanks.

.
 
Yeah. Interesting topic but off topic here.



I'll tell 'ya whose fucking stupid -- Canadians



(There we go)
 
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