The Little Thread Which Grew - the Apollo '73 to Everything But
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Hatshepsut
Crusader
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973
and it's Saturday night! C'mon.. you know you want to
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rEKFZhSrcKQ&feature=player_detailpage
and it's Saturday night! C'mon.. you know you want to
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rEKFZhSrcKQ&feature=player_detailpage
Last edited:
lkwdblds
Crusader
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973
I've read quite a bit further in the Janet Reitman bood, "Inside Scientology". I just completed her lengthy story about the Lisa Mc Pherson case. It is a very good summary of everthing that took place. The last chapter of that section of the book is titled, "for the greatest good".
THE GREATEST GOOD
That title really is the key to all that happened, before, during and after the Mc Pherson ordeal. If one believes wholeheartedly in KSW #1 then the Church behaved properly before, during and after the event. For those who don't subscribe 100% to KSW #1, the Church behaved dispicably The only things the C of S learned to improve in the future were to get more waivers signed from parishioners prior to beginning their programs and be more careful and restrictive on who they accept for auditing.
I lived through an actual instance of what they learned. In February of 1999 I had just been diagnosed with high blood pressure, and I chose to treat with standard medicine and that involved prescription drugs. The drugs were making me unstudentable and so I was hastily encouraged to go to Flag to get my predisposition for taking medical drugs handled. When I got to Flag, they treated me as if I had the plague or was a leper. I was run around on routing forms and then ultimately denied any service. That was part of "The Greatest Good", don't mess with certain pc's, just refuse to service them. Being denied service there turned out to have value for me as it kick started my decision to leave C of S.
It still took three more years and some experiences where my kids were mishandled but by early 2002, I made the decision to leave after 31 years!
After the Mc Pherson case is discussed, the book shifts into the area of celebrities. This, of course, is one of my hobby horses since I was CCLA public for one year, crew for two years and CCLA Program's Chief on Flag.
The information which Janet Reitman gets about CCLA is mainly from Chris Many for the early 70's and Nancy Many for the late 70's and early 80's. Their info is all quite sound and true.
Again, the importance of Yvonne Jentzsch in starting Celebrity Centre is briefly touched on. The "Get High on Yourself" campaign of the late 70's and early 80's put on by actress Cathy Lee Crosby and her manager, Kathy Wasserman brought a smile to my face. That was quite a campaign, I remember it well. I found it funny that Henry Winkler was promoting Scientology without even knowing it and later became upset that he was tricked into doing that.
INTEREST ON THIS THREAD Interest on this thread has ebbed lately. Even so, we are approaching 400,000 views. I don't care anymore. Maybe its time for the mighty Apollo '73 thread to finally die out. I can't think of much more to write about - I have exhausted my resources and the limits of my memory. Perhaps Sweetness and Light needs to come in and give me new encouragment as she did 2 years ago.
Lakey
I've read quite a bit further in the Janet Reitman bood, "Inside Scientology". I just completed her lengthy story about the Lisa Mc Pherson case. It is a very good summary of everthing that took place. The last chapter of that section of the book is titled, "for the greatest good".
THE GREATEST GOOD
That title really is the key to all that happened, before, during and after the Mc Pherson ordeal. If one believes wholeheartedly in KSW #1 then the Church behaved properly before, during and after the event. For those who don't subscribe 100% to KSW #1, the Church behaved dispicably The only things the C of S learned to improve in the future were to get more waivers signed from parishioners prior to beginning their programs and be more careful and restrictive on who they accept for auditing.
I lived through an actual instance of what they learned. In February of 1999 I had just been diagnosed with high blood pressure, and I chose to treat with standard medicine and that involved prescription drugs. The drugs were making me unstudentable and so I was hastily encouraged to go to Flag to get my predisposition for taking medical drugs handled. When I got to Flag, they treated me as if I had the plague or was a leper. I was run around on routing forms and then ultimately denied any service. That was part of "The Greatest Good", don't mess with certain pc's, just refuse to service them. Being denied service there turned out to have value for me as it kick started my decision to leave C of S.
It still took three more years and some experiences where my kids were mishandled but by early 2002, I made the decision to leave after 31 years!
After the Mc Pherson case is discussed, the book shifts into the area of celebrities. This, of course, is one of my hobby horses since I was CCLA public for one year, crew for two years and CCLA Program's Chief on Flag.
The information which Janet Reitman gets about CCLA is mainly from Chris Many for the early 70's and Nancy Many for the late 70's and early 80's. Their info is all quite sound and true.
Again, the importance of Yvonne Jentzsch in starting Celebrity Centre is briefly touched on. The "Get High on Yourself" campaign of the late 70's and early 80's put on by actress Cathy Lee Crosby and her manager, Kathy Wasserman brought a smile to my face. That was quite a campaign, I remember it well. I found it funny that Henry Winkler was promoting Scientology without even knowing it and later became upset that he was tricked into doing that.
INTEREST ON THIS THREAD Interest on this thread has ebbed lately. Even so, we are approaching 400,000 views. I don't care anymore. Maybe its time for the mighty Apollo '73 thread to finally die out. I can't think of much more to write about - I have exhausted my resources and the limits of my memory. Perhaps Sweetness and Light needs to come in and give me new encouragment as she did 2 years ago.
Lakey
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lkwdblds
Crusader
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973
Very interesting to know that. Can you tell us what year that was in and in particular was it pre Lisa McPherson or post Lisa. In 1999, with the Lisa Mc Pherson felony case reaching its climax, Flag was not about to take me off of my medications.
I was a "babe in the woods" and self medicated by stopping all my medications 5 days before leaving for Flag. I am an interned Dianetic auditor and knew full well that someone could not be audited if they had taken drugs within the past 5 days.
Compounding my error in judgement, I did not even bring my meds with me in my suitcase. The first thing my C/S told me was that I had to immediately resume my medications. To do this, I was sent to the "Walk In Clinic" near Flag to get new prescriptions for my 5 drugs and then go to the pharmacy and get the prescriptions filled. Before I got to the Walk in Clinic, I had to first go to the MAA, the Chaplain, and the Medical Officer. The whole cycle to see all these people and get my prescriptions filled took 3 days.
I then reported back to the D of P that I had my prescriptions and had taken one of each pill that morning. She turned the info in to the C/S and he wrote me a note called an R Factor (Reality Factor). The note said, "Since you are taking prescription drugs, you are not eligible to receive auditing." Can you believe that!
Before I ever agreed to go to Flag, I voiced the concern that I was not eligible for auditing but my local Flag Rep, Alex, told me that he sent of list of my drugs to a Flag C/S and that I had been okayed to receive auditing while on the prescription drugs because the purpose of my auditing to handle why I was predisposed to take the drugs and get me off of them. Of course, no C/S had actually seen my folder and Alex had just lied to me to get me to Flag. What else is new?
At least the Flag C/S did the right thing by ordering me back on to the drugs. That was the proper thing legally and medically for him to do at that time.
Lakey
Very interesting to know that. Can you tell us what year that was in and in particular was it pre Lisa McPherson or post Lisa. In 1999, with the Lisa Mc Pherson felony case reaching its climax, Flag was not about to take me off of my medications.
I was a "babe in the woods" and self medicated by stopping all my medications 5 days before leaving for Flag. I am an interned Dianetic auditor and knew full well that someone could not be audited if they had taken drugs within the past 5 days.
Compounding my error in judgement, I did not even bring my meds with me in my suitcase. The first thing my C/S told me was that I had to immediately resume my medications. To do this, I was sent to the "Walk In Clinic" near Flag to get new prescriptions for my 5 drugs and then go to the pharmacy and get the prescriptions filled. Before I got to the Walk in Clinic, I had to first go to the MAA, the Chaplain, and the Medical Officer. The whole cycle to see all these people and get my prescriptions filled took 3 days.
I then reported back to the D of P that I had my prescriptions and had taken one of each pill that morning. She turned the info in to the C/S and he wrote me a note called an R Factor (Reality Factor). The note said, "Since you are taking prescription drugs, you are not eligible to receive auditing." Can you believe that!
Before I ever agreed to go to Flag, I voiced the concern that I was not eligible for auditing but my local Flag Rep, Alex, told me that he sent of list of my drugs to a Flag C/S and that I had been okayed to receive auditing while on the prescription drugs because the purpose of my auditing to handle why I was predisposed to take the drugs and get me off of them. Of course, no C/S had actually seen my folder and Alex had just lied to me to get me to Flag. What else is new?
At least the Flag C/S did the right thing by ordering me back on to the drugs. That was the proper thing legally and medically for him to do at that time.
Lakey
purple haze
Patron with Honors
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973
Hi Gary,
quite the catch 22.
By the way, I still haven't found out why ALL the old Sea Org photos I had posted on my Facebook of the good old days aboard the Royal Scotman [aka the Apollo] had disappeared. All my newer photos were still there...
I never check my photos, so have no idea when it happened. It took ages, but I got most of them back up.
Wish I knew how to post pictures on ESMB here because I'd love to share them with all of you.
Lovely pictures of Mary Sue Hubbard, all the children, and amazing folks on the ship in the early days.
Guess you'll have to go to my Facebook to see them:
candyswanson.
Have an amazing summer everyone!
Aloha, purple haze
Hi Gary,
quite the catch 22.
By the way, I still haven't found out why ALL the old Sea Org photos I had posted on my Facebook of the good old days aboard the Royal Scotman [aka the Apollo] had disappeared. All my newer photos were still there...
I never check my photos, so have no idea when it happened. It took ages, but I got most of them back up.
Wish I knew how to post pictures on ESMB here because I'd love to share them with all of you.
Lovely pictures of Mary Sue Hubbard, all the children, and amazing folks on the ship in the early days. Guess you'll have to go to my Facebook to see them:
candyswanson.
Have an amazing summer everyone!
Aloha, purple haze
lkwdblds
Crusader
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973
Nice to see you posting here Purple! I have a write up on how to post pictures on ESMB. Carmelo helped me learn it but Hatsheput supplied a fine cook book description which I printed out and stored in my files. I should be able to help you get the pictures up on ESMB.
I completed Janet Reitman's book this morning. The last part of the book is very interesting with lots of good anecdotes. Life in the Sea Org at Int Base is examined quite thoroughly. There is a lot of coverage on the subject of sex and marriage in the Sea Org.
In my opinion, the book does not make a 100% negative attack on L Ron Hubbard, David Miscavige and Scientology. Some of the early chapters are neutral or even a bit complimentary about Hubbard and some of his works and achievements.
When it gets to the Lisa Mc Pherson case, the book tells it like it is and C of S comes out looking pretty bad.
THE BOOK'S PRESENTATION ON THE SUBJECT OF SEX AND MARRIAGE
On the sex and marriage anecdotes, C of S is a strange mixture between being prudish and Puritanical on the one hand and a swinger on the other. No physical contact of any kind is allowed between the sexes unless a couple is married. Masturbation is outlawed as is having children and a marriage is a relatively minor event. Honey moon? Hardly! If you're lucky you might get a full hour for lunch on your wedding day instead of 15 minutes or 30 minutes. Couples are often separated and seldom see each other. There seems to be a concerted effort to have them stationed at different locations.
The swinger part enters in with the short length of marriages and the multitude of partners. If management recommends that you get divorced, it is very difficult to resist management but then one partner is discarded and changed to another the way people change socks. The concept that a man and a woman love each other and want to be a family is pretty much considered out ethics.
Anyway, the book was a very good read, well written and fast paced. Of all the topics about C of S which could have been chosen, the author chose wisely some of the most interesting facets of C of S, DM and LRH.
Lakey
Hi Gary,
quite the catch 22.
By the way, I still haven't found out why ALL the old Sea Org photos I had posted on my Facebook of the good old days aboard the Royal Scotman [aka the Apollo] had disappeared. All my newer photos were still there...
I never check my photos, so have no idea when it happened. It took ages, but I got most of them back up.
Wish I knew how to post pictures on ESMB here because I'd love to share them with all of you.
Guess you'll have to go to my Facebook to see them:
candyswanson.
Have an amazing summer everyone!
Aloha, purple haze
Nice to see you posting here Purple! I have a write up on how to post pictures on ESMB. Carmelo helped me learn it but Hatsheput supplied a fine cook book description which I printed out and stored in my files. I should be able to help you get the pictures up on ESMB.
I completed Janet Reitman's book this morning. The last part of the book is very interesting with lots of good anecdotes. Life in the Sea Org at Int Base is examined quite thoroughly. There is a lot of coverage on the subject of sex and marriage in the Sea Org.
In my opinion, the book does not make a 100% negative attack on L Ron Hubbard, David Miscavige and Scientology. Some of the early chapters are neutral or even a bit complimentary about Hubbard and some of his works and achievements.
When it gets to the Lisa Mc Pherson case, the book tells it like it is and C of S comes out looking pretty bad.
THE BOOK'S PRESENTATION ON THE SUBJECT OF SEX AND MARRIAGE
On the sex and marriage anecdotes, C of S is a strange mixture between being prudish and Puritanical on the one hand and a swinger on the other. No physical contact of any kind is allowed between the sexes unless a couple is married. Masturbation is outlawed as is having children and a marriage is a relatively minor event. Honey moon? Hardly! If you're lucky you might get a full hour for lunch on your wedding day instead of 15 minutes or 30 minutes. Couples are often separated and seldom see each other. There seems to be a concerted effort to have them stationed at different locations.
The swinger part enters in with the short length of marriages and the multitude of partners. If management recommends that you get divorced, it is very difficult to resist management but then one partner is discarded and changed to another the way people change socks. The concept that a man and a woman love each other and want to be a family is pretty much considered out ethics.
Anyway, the book was a very good read, well written and fast paced. Of all the topics about C of S which could have been chosen, the author chose wisely some of the most interesting facets of C of S, DM and LRH.
Lakey
Ted
Gold Meritorious Patron
The old days - Adams Ave., San Diego and Tucson
Way back in the days of yore, I supervised courses and audited at the Adams Ave. Mission. That scene went from a small storefront called "The Book Nook" where there was no outward appearance of it being connected to Dianetics or Scientology to a booming Mission. The Book Nook having a few books on display and a couple of closet-sized auditing spaces and no course room moved a few blocks over to a larger storefront on--guess where--Adams Ave. That's where I began my courses and auditing.
In those days, a significant flow of people to auditor training and upper orgs was generated to the point where it all seemed quite normal. "Everybody goes Clear" was the ED's mantra. And, it was true for a great many who persisted. Not all cases were the same. Some went Clear in fewer hours, some in more hours. But the flow was present and "normal." The Adams Ave. Mission moved again to El Cajon Blvd. where a building was located large enough to accommodate all the students and pc's as well as a projected future flow. There was no thought of anything but expansion, and for a time that appeared to be true. I went to tucson as part of that expansion.
When I moved to Tucson, a much smaller Mission, the flow was stuck. It remained stuck as the inertia to maintain status quo was tremendous. Students perceived training as difficult, arduous. The idea of anyone going Clear was a distant hope for those on the path. I was left going "WTF?"
When the Dianetic Clear/Natural Clear/ Past Life Clear thing came about the flow temporarily unstuck. Peer pressure, like, "Hey if that bozo is Clear then I surely must be, too."
Here is a possible answer in an article from Natural News. It also answers for me why no one puts in a good word for someone else having a Comm Ev, and why those knowledge reports are a wild reflection of the truth or facts. This is also an answer as to why people giving success talks and stories tend to sound the same. Check this out:
Peer pressure causes people to literally alter their memories of recent events
Wednesday, July 20, 2011 by: Sally Oaken
(NaturalNews) Humans are highly social animals and for many years, psychologists have observed a variety of both positive and negative effects resulting from a human tendency called "memory conformity."
When groups of people are exposed to a similar experience, their recollections of the experience, as well as their feeling and values related to the event, tend to reshape over time in order to conform to those of their peers.
Empirical evidence of memory conformity and social compliance have been suggested by classic physiological studies conducted since the 1950s. Famous experiments and studies have been conducted in school, prison and workplace settings.
But earlier this week, the Journal of Science published a study providing the strongest neurological evidence yet in support of the existence of memory conformity.
In the study, Micah Edelson and colleagues showed a documentary to a group of volunteer test subjects. Later, the subjects were asked questions about the documentary while their brain activity was monitored by magnetic resonance imaging (MRI).
After recording their initial answers, researchers then shared incorrect answers with the test subjects, telling them that these answers had been provided by the other participants in the study. After being exposed to the incorrect answers presumably provided by their peers, a curious shift occurred in the memory centers of about 70 percent of the test subjects.
The amygdala and hippocampus areas of the subject's brains, areas linked to memory and recall, began to experience increased activity, and the test subjects began to defend the incorrect answers. Their persistent defense of the false answers convinced researchers that the subjects actually believed the false answers to be true.
Interestingly, the amygdala and hippocampus did not experience increased activity when the false answers were supplied by a computer. The effects of memory conformity only occurred in the presence of social pressure. In a related article in the same issue of Science, researchers report and clarify on the distinction between public and private memory conformity, and suggest that subjects often pretend to support group responses even when they privately disagree.
Nevertheless, this study lends strong support to the possibility that our memories can actually be rewritten by the overwhelming force of our innate desire for social acceptance and conformity. [Emphasis mine.]
The results of the study can be applied to cultural and political events as well, and can be used to explain why illogical or irrational assertions can sometimes attain stubborn popular support. The curious persistence of doubts about proven scientific and historical events can provide a wealth of examples of the surprising power of peer pressure when measured against the power of concrete evidence.
Learn more: peer_pressure_memories
Way back in the days of yore, I supervised courses and audited at the Adams Ave. Mission. That scene went from a small storefront called "The Book Nook" where there was no outward appearance of it being connected to Dianetics or Scientology to a booming Mission. The Book Nook having a few books on display and a couple of closet-sized auditing spaces and no course room moved a few blocks over to a larger storefront on--guess where--Adams Ave. That's where I began my courses and auditing.
In those days, a significant flow of people to auditor training and upper orgs was generated to the point where it all seemed quite normal. "Everybody goes Clear" was the ED's mantra. And, it was true for a great many who persisted. Not all cases were the same. Some went Clear in fewer hours, some in more hours. But the flow was present and "normal." The Adams Ave. Mission moved again to El Cajon Blvd. where a building was located large enough to accommodate all the students and pc's as well as a projected future flow. There was no thought of anything but expansion, and for a time that appeared to be true. I went to tucson as part of that expansion.
When I moved to Tucson, a much smaller Mission, the flow was stuck. It remained stuck as the inertia to maintain status quo was tremendous. Students perceived training as difficult, arduous. The idea of anyone going Clear was a distant hope for those on the path. I was left going "WTF?"
When the Dianetic Clear/Natural Clear/ Past Life Clear thing came about the flow temporarily unstuck. Peer pressure, like, "Hey if that bozo is Clear then I surely must be, too."
Here is a possible answer in an article from Natural News. It also answers for me why no one puts in a good word for someone else having a Comm Ev, and why those knowledge reports are a wild reflection of the truth or facts. This is also an answer as to why people giving success talks and stories tend to sound the same. Check this out:
Peer pressure causes people to literally alter their memories of recent events
Wednesday, July 20, 2011 by: Sally Oaken
(NaturalNews) Humans are highly social animals and for many years, psychologists have observed a variety of both positive and negative effects resulting from a human tendency called "memory conformity."
When groups of people are exposed to a similar experience, their recollections of the experience, as well as their feeling and values related to the event, tend to reshape over time in order to conform to those of their peers.
Empirical evidence of memory conformity and social compliance have been suggested by classic physiological studies conducted since the 1950s. Famous experiments and studies have been conducted in school, prison and workplace settings.
But earlier this week, the Journal of Science published a study providing the strongest neurological evidence yet in support of the existence of memory conformity.
In the study, Micah Edelson and colleagues showed a documentary to a group of volunteer test subjects. Later, the subjects were asked questions about the documentary while their brain activity was monitored by magnetic resonance imaging (MRI).
After recording their initial answers, researchers then shared incorrect answers with the test subjects, telling them that these answers had been provided by the other participants in the study. After being exposed to the incorrect answers presumably provided by their peers, a curious shift occurred in the memory centers of about 70 percent of the test subjects.
The amygdala and hippocampus areas of the subject's brains, areas linked to memory and recall, began to experience increased activity, and the test subjects began to defend the incorrect answers. Their persistent defense of the false answers convinced researchers that the subjects actually believed the false answers to be true.
Interestingly, the amygdala and hippocampus did not experience increased activity when the false answers were supplied by a computer. The effects of memory conformity only occurred in the presence of social pressure. In a related article in the same issue of Science, researchers report and clarify on the distinction between public and private memory conformity, and suggest that subjects often pretend to support group responses even when they privately disagree.
Nevertheless, this study lends strong support to the possibility that our memories can actually be rewritten by the overwhelming force of our innate desire for social acceptance and conformity. [Emphasis mine.]
The results of the study can be applied to cultural and political events as well, and can be used to explain why illogical or irrational assertions can sometimes attain stubborn popular support. The curious persistence of doubts about proven scientific and historical events can provide a wealth of examples of the surprising power of peer pressure when measured against the power of concrete evidence.
Learn more: peer_pressure_memories
RogerB
Crusader
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973
Valuable post, Ted.
This part particularly stands out for me:
One of the things that has to be eventually lifted off of the cases of most folks is the inclination to be "acceptance whores."
Alan didn't put it in those terms, though he did pointed out that many, many folks are so into needing, wanting to be "accepted" or "acceptable" that they in actuality betray and sabotage themselves on order to be accepted.
It takes integrity and often courage to call things as you actually see them (and hopefully as they actually are
).
Too many betray that to be accepted, and it occasions real case problems often to the extent of delusion.
While the study info above did not state the number or percent of folks who altered their recall, the 70% cited who showed change in brain action per MRI scans is on the order of magnitude of what I have observed as being in the category of compulsively being acceptable or otherwise reactively being in its dichotomy of disagreement. This versus the more balanced and rational action of observation and having the ability to actually analyze and objectively respond or deal with what is.
My observation is that, as folks go "up Tone" as a result of successful processing or training actions, they become more certain of themselves and their observations and and can more calmly stick with the truth of what they perceive.
Rog
Valuable post, Ted.
This part particularly stands out for me:
One of the things that has to be eventually lifted off of the cases of most folks is the inclination to be "acceptance whores."
Alan didn't put it in those terms, though he did pointed out that many, many folks are so into needing, wanting to be "accepted" or "acceptable" that they in actuality betray and sabotage themselves on order to be accepted.
It takes integrity and often courage to call things as you actually see them (and hopefully as they actually are
). Too many betray that to be accepted, and it occasions real case problems often to the extent of delusion.
While the study info above did not state the number or percent of folks who altered their recall, the 70% cited who showed change in brain action per MRI scans is on the order of magnitude of what I have observed as being in the category of compulsively being acceptable or otherwise reactively being in its dichotomy of disagreement. This versus the more balanced and rational action of observation and having the ability to actually analyze and objectively respond or deal with what is.
My observation is that, as folks go "up Tone" as a result of successful processing or training actions, they become more certain of themselves and their observations and and can more calmly stick with the truth of what they perceive.
Rog
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Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973
Yes. Very interesting. I remember that first rush of guys all wanting to be Clear bacause their mates all were. That was a total inval of the subject that LRH caused there. Shook a huge table datum for many people and turned many others into outright liars. Other examples come to mind too.
Thjanks Ted.
Yes. Very interesting. I remember that first rush of guys all wanting to be Clear bacause their mates all were. That was a total inval of the subject that LRH caused there. Shook a huge table datum for many people and turned many others into outright liars. Other examples come to mind too.
Thjanks Ted.
Mark A. Baker
Sponsor
Re: The old days - Adams Ave., San Diego and Tucson
Enjoyed reading your recollections. Your observation regarding 'group considerations' concerning the accessibility of auditing & training, and how they can differ even within the same group, are very much in order.
aka, Going Along to Get Along
Clearly demonstrates how 'getting along with others' is decidedly over-rated as a 'desirable' human quality.
Mark A. Baker
Enjoyed reading your recollections. Your observation regarding 'group considerations' concerning the accessibility of auditing & training, and how they can differ even within the same group, are very much in order.
aka, Going Along to Get Along
Clearly demonstrates how 'getting along with others' is decidedly over-rated as a 'desirable' human quality.
Mark A. Baker
lkwdblds
Crusader
Re: The old days - Adams Ave., San Diego and Tucson
Great initial post by Ted and fine inciteful comments by Roger, Leon and Mark. Sort of a return to how the thread was several months back. Just as a side note, the number of views is at 400,012. That calls for a toast between me and Carmelo - Cheers!
Enjoyed reading your recollections. Your observation regarding 'group considerations' concerning the accessibility of auditing & training, and how they can differ even within the same group, are very much in order.
aka, Going Along to Get Along
Clearly demonstrates how 'getting along with others' is decidedly over-rated as a 'desirable' human quality.
Mark A. Baker
Great initial post by Ted and fine inciteful comments by Roger, Leon and Mark. Sort of a return to how the thread was several months back. Just as a side note, the number of views is at 400,012. That calls for a toast between me and Carmelo - Cheers!
Terril park
Sponsor
Re: The old days - Adams Ave., San Diego and Tucson
No. How it could be in one example is overated.
" Getting along with others" is a far more complex set of
possibilities. Most are positive.
Clearly demonstrates how 'getting along with others' is decidedly over-rated as a 'desirable' human quality.
Mark A. Baker
No. How it could be in one example is overated.
" Getting along with others" is a far more complex set of
possibilities. Most are positive.
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973
It's actually the inversion of the ARC triangle and is interesting in itself. Where reality reduces mere "agreement" and departs from real observation, recognition and understanding of what truly is, then this low-toned "agreement" sets in and sends Communication and Affinity down the gurgler very rapidly. This message board is an example of this.
It's actually the inversion of the ARC triangle and is interesting in itself. Where reality reduces mere "agreement" and departs from real observation, recognition and understanding of what truly is, then this low-toned "agreement" sets in and sends Communication and Affinity down the gurgler very rapidly. This message board is an example of this.
I told you I was trouble
Suspended animation
KSW on ESMB.
Spoken as only a scientologist could.
Maybe it is your 'real observation, recognition and understanding of what truly is' that is amiss ...
Maybe it is you who is 'low toned' ...
Nah, it couldn't possibly be so ... you have the technology and know it is correct dontcha, it must be the rest of us that are out KSW and at fault?
Do carry on.
Spoken as only a scientologist could.
Maybe it is your 'real observation, recognition and understanding of what truly is' that is amiss ...
Maybe it is you who is 'low toned' ...
Nah, it couldn't possibly be so ... you have the technology and know it is correct dontcha, it must be the rest of us that are out KSW and at fault?
Do carry on.
I told you I was trouble
Suspended animation
RogerB
Crusader
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973
Correct.
The compulsion to be "accepted" or "acceptable" is indeed a departure from truth.
Of course, those who are into it, or its dichotomy of reactive disagreement, don't see that. Their "rationale" is that they are "being positive by agreeing and getting along with" or "objective on seeing something different."
R
Correct.
The compulsion to be "accepted" or "acceptable" is indeed a departure from truth.
Of course, those who are into it, or its dichotomy of reactive disagreement, don't see that. Their "rationale" is that they are "being positive by agreeing and getting along with" or "objective on seeing something different."
R
I told you I was trouble
Suspended animation
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973
Lol.
Incorrect Mr know-all.
Some are just totally 'over' the over-analysers of the world and the silliness that they whine on about.
Lol.
Incorrect Mr know-all.
Some are just totally 'over' the over-analysers of the world and the silliness that they whine on about.
FoTi
Crusader
Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973
And....you're the Ms. know-all?
Lol.
Incorrect Mr know-all.
Some are just totally 'over' the over-analysers of the world and the silliness that they whine on about.
And....you're the Ms. know-all?
- Status
