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The State of Clear

Terril park said:
Don't know what you were trying to prove. Tough area to do by forum.
Lost the thread there.




Its far more complex. OT was commented on from 1952 with PDC lectures for a start.

Is all this stuff useful?
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Not really. load of bolix as far as I am concerned...

oops, said bolix again.
 
My dog will not be joining us in Vegas as she doesn't like planes. Plus I don't want Terril getting his paws on her.

Which reminds me, Terril, you grabbed my ass!! You dirty old bugger!
 
DartSmohen said:
I have successfully rehabbed many people's state of clear where they were doing a wide range of activities; TM, yoga, presence drills, aikido. It does not matter a jot what the person is doing, it is the fact that they have achieved that realization.
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When I was "in" that was called "mixing practices" and would quickly become an ethics matter for anyone doing it.
The reason was that "other practices" would cause restim that would then have to be handled in session.
This was also referred to as "earlier practices" in HCO PLs.
We were supposed to stick to "Standard Technology" and not mix other practices with it.

An anecdotal story:
While I was doing HPCSC at ASHO, one of my room-mates at The Manor had practiced TM before becoming a Scientologist. After blowing HPCSC (under orders to do so from the Riverside Mission E.D.) I came back, some months later, to finish HPCSC internship. I asked around The Manor about my room-mate and was told that he had wound up in ethics for practicing TM while he was on-lines as a PC (I forget now which L.A. org he was on-lines... I think it was old Celebrity Center).

At that time I thought "Why would he do this?"
Now, I don't care at all that he did that.
 
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DartSmohen said:
This is a well commented on subject.

The tech dictionary (as I remember it) describes Clear as "Being at cause over mental matter, energy, space & time".

On looking up "at cause" it said ; Able to greate or uncreate.

The state of Clear occurs when the person realises that they ate mocking it all up.

There is NOTHING in Scn materials that stipulates this can only occur whilst engaged in Scn activities.

This leads, of course, to heresy of olympic proportions.

I have successfully rehabbed many people's state of clear where they were doing a wide range of activities; TM, yoga, presence drills, aikido. It does not matter a jot what the person is doing, it is the fact that they have achieved that realization.

Many cases got "parked" because they were denied the truth of this.

It is funny to watch cult fanatics try and grapple with this datum. they go quite demented in trying to enforce the Scn connection with the state.

I am sure many readers out there can connect with this. If you went clear doing something other than Scn, then acknowledge it.

Enjoy.
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I think there will be a big difference on whether a pc's cog is kind of a theoretical understanding that he mocks it up or whether the cog includes an awakened ability (including awareness) to actually mock up and unmock.

***
Regarding getting results from other practices or sources or methods or approaches:
I think that any truth that can be revealed through scientology processing can also be revealed by other means. The idea of auditing is to enable a person to find truth about himself and life, he is supposed to as-is, so it is granted that he is capable of as-is-ing, which means that it is granted that he already has that ability before he encounters Scientology. You are actually supposed to be dealing with something universal in this subject, and universal matters can not be owned by a single entity.

If someone blows an engram by looking at a bird than that is what happens. If someone makes a life changing cognition by looking at a piece of art then that is what happens. There is no way you can restrict the possible ways of getting gains in life when dealing with truths of life.

***
EDIT 1:

Addition: Ron did actually say somewhere that any processing that brings about tone arm action is valid processing.

EDIT 2:

"Tone arm action" is a term that indicates change. It is actually change on an e-meter; when a charged area is encountered and then released there will be a rising tone arm followed by a falling tone arm on the meter (increasing resistance followed by falling resistance when the charge blows). The term "tone arm action" can be applied metaphorically to express changes in life similar to those changes that can occur from processing (auditing).
 
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To any Clears out there who might appreciate this, Leonard Cohen:

"There is a crack in everything. That's how the light gets in."

I went Clear on tennis. Dig?
 
First the TRs and now the state of Clear....

It's nonsense to think one can go Clear from any activity in life.

People are obsessively mocking up bank, and the only way to get them over it is to get them to do it on a self-determined basis until they can take responsibility for their condition. It's all well and good to say to one self, "wow, I'm responsible for every difficulty I've ever had." One might feel warm and fuzzy for a bit, but pretty soon one is beset with the old problems again. That's because one didn't really confront and handle enough of the past.

The Dianetics procedure and Clearing Course allow one to take responsibility for one's own reactive mind. There are no shortcuts.
 
Martini said:
First the TRs and now the state of Clear....

It's nonsense to think one can go Clear from any activity in life.

People are obsessively mocking up bank, and the only way to get them over it is to get them to do it on a self-determined basis until they can take responsibility for their condition. It's all well and good to say to one self, "wow, I'm responsible for every difficulty I've ever had." One might feel warm and fuzzy for a bit, but pretty soon one is beset with the old problems again. That's because one didn't really confront and handle enough of the past.

The Dianetics procedure and Clearing Course allow one to take responsibility for one's own reactive mind. There are no shortcuts.
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What is the end result of doing what you suggest?
 
degraded being said:
And what benefit is there to being Clear. What can a person do that a non-Clear cannot do?
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Basically it's a negative gain, so it's kind of hard to describe.

Let's say someone starts yelling at you at an intersection. You're tired from work, and get "keyed in" by the verbal attack. Various things could happen here, depending on what part of your past got restimulated. Whatever it is, it will be to one degree or another irrational, as it won't be based on present time.

If one is Clear, one won't handle the situation irrationally, unless one starts dramatizing another reactive mind, but then we are getting into the upper level phenomena. Even then, one can easily spot it and knock off the dramatization, whereas someone not Clear is more like a puppet.
 
Martini said:
Basically it's a negative gain, so it's kind of hard to describe.

Let's say someone starts yelling at you at an intersection. You're tired from work, and get "keyed in" by the verbal attack. Various things could happen here, depending on what part of your past got restimulated. Whatever it is, it will be to one degree or another irrational, as it won't be based on present time.

If one is Clear, one won't handle the situation irrationally, unless one starts dramatizing another reactive mind, but then we are getting into the upper level phenomena. Even then, one can easily spot it and knock off the dramatization, whereas someone not Clear is more like a puppet.
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And can this be achieved through things other than Scientology Tech?

Neo
 
Neo said:
And can this be achieved through things other than Scientology Tech?

Neo
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One can be made more causative with other things than Scientology tech.

You can get released from your reactive mind with a joint, meditation, buddhist teachings, yoga, a good conversation, sex, a new car, winning at poker, etc. but you aren't Clear.
 
Martini said:
Basically it's a negative gain, so it's kind of hard to describe.

Let's say someone starts yelling at you at an intersection. You're tired from work, and get "keyed in" by the verbal attack. Various things could happen here, depending on what part of your past got restimulated. Whatever it is, it will be to one degree or another irrational, as it won't be based on present time.

If one is Clear, one won't handle the situation irrationally, unless one starts dramatizing another reactive mind, but then we are getting into the upper level phenomena. Even then, one can easily spot it and knock off the dramatization, whereas someone not Clear is more like a puppet.
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How do the Clear person's BTs affect this?
 
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