OSA Defector Comes Out of Hiding

Dukat

Patron with Honors
Re: Costa Rica

Back in Jan 2012, when I got that Debbie Cook email, and started to for the first time researching on the internet about scientology, and landed on Marty's place, and Jeff Hawkins blog, and others,

why I was shak'in like a leaf in the wind, but at the same time giddy with excitement on reading about other ex members.

So much, I held my hand still with the other hand while clicking the computer mouse button. LOL now as I look back.

Good point. A lot of exes tell about trouble sleeping. That's when you know your brain is busy working on something. I'm pretty sure there are threads here that will help with that kind of thing too.

Welcome to The Board. A great spot on the internets.:yes:
 

For those that don't know...I am in What Is Scientology and C of $
made sure it was sent to EVERY Senator/congressman/Gov/Library/
opinion Leader, etc. etc.
So it's a m a z i n g to hear they actually asked you to tear my page
out? Did they *really* send a replacement page?

Okay - more details coming back to me.

In hardback book-binding, there are always sections of folded sheets. As I recall, it was a relatively easy job to pull the page (at or near the front of these page sections), and just as they did for new tech vol issues, they sent a replacement page with peel-n-paste sticky lines, and we just stuck them in. In my Org, it was just a few books.

I did not alter my personal copy (though recently I tore out the timeline and other key pages, and trashed the rest). Erasing people from history never sat well with me!

:yes:
 

Mike Laws

Patron Meritorious
Mike - I did not know you went through all of that and thanks for sharing it...you are so right...we all go through tremendous pain being a "Scientologist" and getting out..it was the most incredibly painful experiences I have ever had in my life...just unreal!!

Your story is more proof that being connected to such an evil group does wreak havoc on one's life...the Scientologist's I know that are still active are experiencing DEATH, Cancer, Bankruptcy, Foreclosures, failed marriages (6 divorces in the tiny Morgue I went to - OSA - don't try to figure which one I went to..they are all tiny :coolwink:), shattered families, shattered dreams because

Scientology's real goal is to get people into total confusion and then fleece them and make them slaves!!

IMHO, many people that were born in, long term staff or SO, even public ... we were super accomplished liars, lies allowed us to manage the cognitive dissonance. I know people who were loosing their home, their cars, their families, etc. that said they were doing great!!!!! Impossible, but when in, I could come up with stories for myself and others that made everything OK! If we said how we were really doing, then our efforts, and perhaps the tech would be a failure.
 

Mike Laws

Patron Meritorious
Thanks, Mike

You may have to drop another hint about "the book" - I'm a little slow sometimes, and I'm straining to remember what you might be referring to.

I do have a story comes to mind where you helped me in the middle of a disaster. You probably don't realize how much it helped, because I berated you for it a little, at the time.

:eyeroll:

Let's see, where do I begin?...

LOL, you gotta laugh about the shit so that you don't cry.

The book of pictures of SPs and squirrels and trouble sources that is in every org. You berated me for going with friends to a Robins seminar, saying that Tony Robbins was a squirrel. I asked why, you said it was in your book. I asked why he was a squirrel in your book, what had he done, and you couldn't answer me, later I think you actually apologized for coming down on me.

I forgot all about that other cycle, those were my stupid and ignorant days where I thought I could help negotiate peace. He is doing good by the way, the kids are going through related challenges, and his ex has gone through hell still in, and recently has become involved with a Force. From memory, she asked me to help him not get declared for their family sake. I do remember you working hard for him not to get declared, I thought you always had a human side, though they did their damnedest to program it out of you.
 
LOL, you gotta laugh about the shit so that you don't cry.

I do a lot of both! :bigcry::roflmao:

The book of pictures of SPs and squirrels and trouble sources that is in every org. You berated me for going with friends to a Robins seminar, saying that Tony Robbins was a squirrel. I asked why, you said it was in your book. I asked why he was a squirrel in your book, what had he done, and you couldn't answer me, later I think you actually apologized for coming down on me.

Yes - I remember that, and I hope you're right about me apologizing already. Remember that every competitor is a "squirrel". :unsure: Mike, you were so "off-purpose" doing that! :roflmao:

I forgot all about that other cycle, those were my stupid and ignorant days where I thought I could help negotiate peace. He is doing good by the way, the kids are going through related challenges, and his ex has gone through hell still in, and recently has become involved with a Force. From memory, she asked me to help him not get declared for their family sake. I do remember you working hard for him not to get declared, I thought you always had a human side, though they did their damnedest to program it out of you.

Negotiating peace is a good thing, and I was glad you were there to do it.

Thanks!

Epilogue:

I did see the wife of the couple, at the New Years bring-in-2012 event in Dallas. She was still having trouble getting any services anywhere. Even though she divorced the guy, now they were telling her she was "still connected" by him being a father having access to the kids! It's terrible. You just can't win there. :no:

The husband. I have been in comm with him, actually. We have met and relived all this, and it was all good. He put me in touch with a couple of those declared SPs of that era, and that gives me another interesting story...
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
Re: Crisis of Conscience

The same young, pretty auditor from OSA Int (Tara?) that had put me through 2-3 intensives of one listing question only "Who told you it was not okay to apply the PTS/SP tech?" (which left me a raving fanatic, on a tear to find SPs - only saving grace being that in my basic goodness I became very careful about finding the "real" SP, for reasons I am about to disclose). This same girl, on "mission" again with a different I/C this time, came into my office late at night (I was staying after 'post' as usual, trying to 'catch up' on my backlog of administration for the Fuhrer) and closed the door, sat down in my chair with me - yes, in my chair.

As I fought to catch my breath, she demonstrated that my Win 98 on my little, old, used laptop, was "out-security" because she could bypass my password (a fact I was not previously aware of) and I was now also in a somewhat compromising position of being "out-security" (a crime of magnitude in the OSA network, especially).

She also revealed that the FBO knew how to bypass my office lock, and that they had done so while I was away!

("Spying on the spies" - reminds me of our government!)

To make a long story short here (since the point to all this is the decision I had to eventually make)...

No, we did not go "out-2D" (LOL!)

But the whole idea was to get me to type up an SP declare, which I did (and probably never would have without this interesting ploy - whether spontaneous or planned, I may never know).

It's interesting that Tara come down, apparently primarily for this cycle, since she went immediately back after getting that paperwork from you.

I suspect that if you had been resistant, she would have "compromised" you, providing an excuse to remove you from post, and install somebody more "compliant". I wonder what was so important about that cycle?
 

Mike Laws

Patron Meritorious
Epilogue:

I did see the wife of the couple, at the New Years bring-in-2012 event in Dallas. She was still having trouble getting any services anywhere. Even though she divorced the guy, now they were telling her she was "still connected" by him being a father having access to the kids! It's terrible. You just can't win there. :no:

The husband. I have been in comm with him, actually. We have met and relived all this, and it was all good. He put me in touch with a couple of those declared SPs of that era, and that gives me another interesting story...

I am glad you are in touch with everyone!!!

I was serious in noticing a human side to you. Several times you came at me all a guns a blazing, I asked why ... and more often than not it would stop you in your tracks, you would say "oops, sorry".

I believe I have been somewhat blessed in my journey out, in some of the experiences I had. These relate to being able to approach and clean things up as much as possible with a number of people that I wronged, and others who wronged me. Marty made you look like Tinkerbell in hand lings of me, but it was great for both of us to be able to sit down and talk it through and find peace. I won't tell you how many tears I shed trying to talk to or make things right with people I wronged. These, in the end, were probably the most important and valuable in my decompression.

I wish you wonderful things in your journey.
 

Panda Termint

Cabal Of One
Re: Crisis of Conscience

It's interesting that Tara come down, apparently primarily for this cycle, since she went immediately back after getting that paperwork from you.

I suspect that if you had been resistant, she would have "compromised" you, providing an excuse to remove you from post, and install somebody more "compliant". I wonder what was so important about that cycle?
One thing I got from this is that they obviously knew of Scott's weak spot! LOL
 

Idle Morgue

Gold Meritorious Patron
I will say, thankfully I had tons of peeps who helped me,
once I finally did WAKE up and escaped out. The 2nd day out...someone told me s/t that helped
my ride "out" a lot.

It was Stacy's cleaning lady, believe it or not. She asked me:
"Would you like some advice?"

Having just lost *everything* ---including beliefs, all my 30 year 'friends, and a husband of 27 years (who yes,
remained "in", remarried)...I said, "yes, please".

First she said: "You have to allow yourself to just BE".
Not sure why, but for me that was a HUGE help right there and I sighed. :surprise1: :drama: <<< be willing to experience
the adventure was my interpretation.

2) Keep in mind, due to my having Epilepsy, even with medication controlling all of it,
I had to fight "PTS" for 30 years. (one of the symptoms of "PTS" is one going up and down, "rollercoastering")
Ok, so she said to me:

"You have to know you ARE going to go UP and DOWN
UP and DOWN....sometimes every week, sometimes every day....
With what you're going through, I wouldn't be surprised if it was EVERY HOUR. :goodorbad:

BUT>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Keep in mind, as you're going up and down (which for those who do not know, that's considered
"Roller coastering "in" $cientology and a sign of very bad things).......
Realize you're doing so CIRCULARLY. And she used her hand to show a circle spiraling UP and UP and UP.
(So within the circle going UP, one most probably would be going up and down, up and down. However the over
all Circle was going UP). :thumbsup::hysterical::hifive::grouphug: :bravo:

This helped me *greatly* as I went through many, many emotions, cried for 2 years ...etc. :confused2: :bigcry::happydance::omg:

It's an adventure----I hope yours is 1/2 as great as mine has been.ALL of the peeps on the Net have helped
me more than I'll ever be able to put into words.I know I said it before....but again... :thankyou: to ALL here
and to Watchful Navigator:

:welcome: :arose::heartflower:

Good post Magoo!!:thankyou: I was not in Scientology most of my life (thank you GOD!) and I can tell you that "rollercoastering" is part of life...and $cientology capitalizes on it...I thought if I did $ciendollartry...the rollercoastering would stop...but it IS part of life because we don't sit still in a World where nothing happens...

The "getting out of the cult think" rollercoastering was an entirely different type of emotion. For me, I could not read anything, I was in total confusion and paralyzed at times...it was horrendously painful from my normal way of being! The betrayal of the CULT cut deep...it was extremely painful to face the truth that I had been completely and utterly duped! I wasted years of my life not to mention $$$,$$$ for the scam! Donations to the IAS and buildings...CCHR, WTHC...all a complete scam. My ego took a beating like no other incident in my life!!

You said it perfectly when you gave the example of spiraling UP with this rollercoaster...and it gets better and better each and every day.

Funny thing is - the mind does heal like a wound. I am feeling SO MUCH better after 2 years of healing...what helped the most for me was LOOKING - and figuring out how Hubbard and Scientology got me sucked into their trap.

I totally understand now how the mind works...thanks to my horrible experience in Scientology...and I hope to use my wisdom and knowledge to help others.

CULTS are real and you don't have to be stupid or a hot mess...you just have to BE trusting...want to help others and want the world to be a better place...the rest of it is no different than setting out cheese for a mouse or meat for a bear!

Scientology captializes on all things humans and turns humans into robots if they don't eventually look for themselves.


 

Idle Morgue

Gold Meritorious Patron
IMHO, many people that were born in, long term staff or SO, even public ... we were super accomplished liars, lies allowed us to manage the cognitive dissonance. I know people who were loosing their home, their cars, their families, etc. that said they were doing great!!!!! Impossible, but when in, I could come up with stories for myself and others that made everything OK! If we said how we were really doing, then our efforts, and perhaps the tech would be a failure.

Mike - I was in recently and I did the same thing!! When I saw the illnesses, deaths, divorces, failed businesses, bankruptcies, shattered families..I used the JUSTIFICATION that was fed to me by an OT VIII -

We are fixing the World with BROKEN PIECES..and I thought these people must have done something at some point on their "tracks" :duh:

although...now when someone tries to recover me...I ask the formidable question..
At what point does Scientology work? Then they ask me...Did you have any "wins" in Scientology..and my response - yes, but herion addicts and meth heads have wins too...but it does not mean it is good for them! That shuts them up!!:wink2:

Oh..the cringes never stop now that I am out! The people that are suffereing are suffering because they ARE IN SCIENTOLOGY - and Scientology specializes in destroying lives...not improving them. The improvements are fleeting and only there to BAIT people to get in deeper...

We are human and we trusted...God help those still in to get out! I postulate that the Church of Scientology goes down and stops existing completley.

I believe my wish is coming true. Good job SP's!! You all made it possible and helped take down the cult!!:happydance:
 

Idle Morgue

Gold Meritorious Patron
I am glad you are in touch with everyone!!!

I was serious in noticing a human side to you. Several times you came at me all a guns a blazing, I asked why ... and more often than not it would stop you in your tracks, you would say "oops, sorry".

I believe I have been somewhat blessed in my journey out, in some of the experiences I had. These relate to being able to approach and clean things up as much as possible with a number of people that I wronged, and others who wronged me. Marty made you look like Tinkerbell in hand lings of me, but it was great for both of us to be able to sit down and talk it through and find peace. I won't tell you how many tears I shed trying to talk to or make things right with people I wronged. These, in the end, were probably the most important and valuable in my decompression.

I wish you wonderful things in your journey.

It is so healing to make up the damage to those people I harmed ... I got them ALL OUT!! :happydance::happydance::happydance:

All of them...and then some!:wink2: I ain't done either...I will get more out! IT IS JUST THE RIGHT THING TO DO!!!:yes:

I am one mother f%$king pissed off SP and when I get mad...I get even!:biggrin:
 

Arthur Dent

Silver Meritorious Patron
A/OSA NW ESTAB AIDE OSAWUS 12 April 2003
CO OSAWUS
Info: ESTAB AIDE OSA INT
------------------
DSA CCDAL

Re: DSA Security Clearance and 2D report

Dear Sir:

I am writing to inform you of my current scene in regards to a 2D.

Since early March 2003 a more or less serious relationship is ongoing between a woman from Costa Rica, Tatiana xxxxxx xxxxxx, and myself.

This consists of writing back and forth – e-mails, letters, chat sessions, pictures. We have not met in the physical universe. We met when she e-mailed me out of interest in my thetasingles.com website posting.

She is a Scientologist (age 35) and a mother of two sons, age 10 and 7. She has served on staff at the mission of San Jose as Treasury Secretary, for a 2 ½ year contract period. She has stated that she routed off mission staff standardly and remained in good standing. She is at the same case level (ARC SW) and at almost the same training level. She volunteers time at the mission and teaches mathematics at the University.

I cannot know this for sure, but I am of the impression that she fits the description of “Scientologist that makes good case gain” as called for in the DSA issue on Security Clearances.

She is coming to visit at the end of April 2003 and will stay from 25 Apr through 07 May at my parent’s house. I am planning on adjusting my post schedule and teaching schedule to some degree but only taking a limited amount of time off, and that mainly from teaching a day or two.

Later on in the summer, if all goes well on this line, I have plans to CSW for a couple weeks down in Costa Rica over the last part of July 2003.

This report is to provide data on this lifestyle change so that the current scene is known.

Tatiana understands that I do not talk about the details of my work on the DSA post and does not have a problem with it.

I am sure that more data is available if needed, from the mission of Costa Rica.

This Is Okay,

Scott Gordon
DSA CCDAL

Eww, cringe! Welcome Scott! And thanks for the reminder that scn controls your entire personal life when you're in, and not just if you're osa, dsa, sea org,staff, just anyone.
They have their greedy-self-serving-fingers in anyone's life and any aspect of it. There know no boundaries.
I'm sorry about your being disconnected from. I hope your kids come back to you. It's unbelievable what this does. I went through years of hell and thankful to be out with
my family in tact. In that, I"m lucky in the end. So many were not and it is a heartbreak. Thanks so much for speaking out!
 

clamicide

Gold Meritorious Patron
There were good Three Stooges movies?

oy, I thought it was always a male/female thing until I met quite manly men who also didn't really like the stooges (or else, like other males, they lied about it to make me happy:wink2:)
 

clamicide

Gold Meritorious Patron
Okay - more details coming back to me.

In hardback book-binding, there are always sections of folded sheets. As I recall, it was a relatively easy job to pull the page (at or near the front of these page sections), and just as they did for new tech vol issues, they sent a replacement page with peel-n-paste sticky lines, and we just stuck them in. In my Org, it was just a few books.

I did not alter my personal copy (though recently I tore out the timeline and other key pages, and trashed the rest). Erasing people from history never sat well with me!

:yes:


oooh..... I am remembering stickers put into vols to make them 'on-source'. I totally forgot about that. Guess it was before they 'cogged' they could get more $ by reissuing every time. I remember working to lift them up to see what was up with that... of course, I was also the kid who knew how to lift the tape off or wrapping paper to see what was under the Christmas tree before I opened-- probably one of my first 'gigs' honing my acting skills was acting surprised by presents I'd already looked at weeks before.
 

Gib

Crusader
Eww, cringe! Welcome Scott! And thanks for the reminder that scn controls your entire personal life when you're in, and not just if you're osa, dsa, sea org,staff, just anyone.
They have their greedy-self-serving-fingers in anyone's life and any aspect of it. There know no boundaries.

I'm sorry about your being disconnected from. I hope your kids come back to you. It's unbelievable what this does. I went through years of hell and thankful to be out with
my family in tact. In that, I"m lucky in the end. So many were not and it is a heartbreak. Thanks so much for speaking out!

You got that right.

I realized one day not to long ago,

whether one is on staff

or public

one is working for the COS.
 

Udarnik

Gold Meritorious Patron
oy, I thought it was always a male/female thing until I met quite manly men who also didn't really like the stooges (or else, like other males, they lied about it to make me happy:wink2:)

Were those manly men in kilts? :melodramatic:

And are you saying I am or am not one? :p

Humor was different back then. But I love W.C. Fields and the Marx Brothers.

The Stooges are just fucking stupid.
 

Magoo

Gold Meritorious Patron
Okay - more details coming back to me.

In hardback book-binding, there are always sections of folded sheets. As I recall, it was a relatively easy job to pull the page (at or near the front of these page sections), and just as they did for new tech vol issues, they sent a replacement page with peel-n-paste sticky lines, and we just stuck them in. In my Org, it was just a few books.

I did not alter my personal copy (though recently I tore out the timeline and other key pages, and trashed the rest). Erasing people from history never sat well with me! :clap:

:yes:

Again, thanks, WN.......:wow: I have never heard ANY of this of tearing out
pages, of WIS or now new tech vol issues. REALLY? This is a m a z i n g to me.
So rather than re-publish them (and have to try to re-sell them)...they literally send you replacement
pages with peel-n-past sticky lines? :hysterical::buzzin::roflmao:
:goodluck: "Dave"

Too too funny!

Thanks So much :)

:bow: <<< take one, you deserve it! :)
 

Magoo

Gold Meritorious Patron
IMHO, many people that were born in, long term staff or SO, even public ... we were super accomplished liars, lies allowed us to manage the cognitive dissonance. I know people who were loosing their home, their cars, their families, etc. that said they were doing great!!!!! Impossible, but when in, I could come up with stories for myself and others that made everything OK! If we said how we were really doing, then our efforts, and perhaps the tech would be a failure.

100% true, Mike. This was a *huge* wake up call for me, after 7 years on OT 7...
knowing many, many peeps (Self included) either seriously F*** up or dead, and the OT 8's (my Ex was one)
SERIOUSLY FUCKED UP. After awhile....you have to go :wtf: ????

Of course everyone HAS to say how *great* things are. To those who don't know....no it is not "ordered"...it's just
built in by peer pressure, really, and Hubbard's tech re how bad "Downstats" (people not doing well) are...so gawd
forbid you end up on *that* boat! My wake up call began when I started reading self-improvement books to try to
fix my massive migraine headaches while on OT 7. OT 7 never worked for me, at all, for one minute from Day ONE.

But I slugged along, trying to make it work. Both Nancy Many and I were friends and we secretly began reading
and sharing this great books on self-improvement. We even listened to a psych on the radio :omg::omg::omg: <<<true fax
Little did I know but those books helped strip off lots of the mind control.

Anyways, thanks, Mike. Good point! :yes:

 
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