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Scientology security kills man with sword

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PMD said:
Actually the Roman Catholic Church saved lives with their inquisition, believe it or not. In Christian "Squirrel Land", ie Germany and France, hundrerds of thousands of people died in religious wars while the Inquisition killed little over one thousand people during it's application. You need to see context Alex.

LRH's opinions are biased by old Anglo-Saxon propaganda against Spain and the Catholic Church.

Still in this case CoS security should have used a tazer or pepper spray. But they are equipped to kill, totally DM.
Click to expand...

"little over a thousand"?????

Are you kidding me?

Check this out, for starters.


http://www.chick.com/reading/comics/0114/godfathersindex.asp
 
NonScio said:
Ummm...uh, you refer to comic book for historical documentation?
So, "Chick Comics" sets some sort of new standard for historical
research?
Click to expand...

Death tolls are given by historians such as Will Durant, who, in The Reformation (1957), cites Juan Antonio Llorente, General Secretary of the Inquisition from 1789 to 1801, as estimating that 31,912 people were executed from 1480-1808. He also cites Hernando de Pulgar, a secretary to Queen Isabella, as estimating 2,000 people were burned before 1490. Philip Schaff in his History of the Christian Church gave a number of 8,800 people burned in the 18 years of Torquemada. Matthew White, in reviewing these and other figures, gives a median number of deaths at 32,000, with around 9,000 under Torquemada [1]. R. J. Rummel describes similar figures as realistic, though he cites some historians who give figures of up to 135,000 people killed under Torquemada. This number includes 125,000 asserted to have died in prison due to poor conditions, leaving 10,000 sentenced to death. (Death rates in medieval and early modern prisons were generally very high, thanks in part to inadequate sanitary conditions and a poor diet.) There are no death toll figures available for the massacres of 1391, 1468 or 1473. These numbers will likely never be known.

there are controversial disputes as to these numbers, however.
 
NonScio said:
Ummm...uh, you refer to comic book for historical documentation?
So, "Chick Comics" sets some sort of new standard for historical
research?
Click to expand...

Just thought it would be an easy medium for people to assimilate quickly.

If you want more scholarly info, read

'The Two Babylons' by Alexander Hislop

here's a link;

http://www.biblebelievers.com/babylon/

Or, for a more modern account, read 'A Woman Rides the Beast' by Dave Hunt

http://www.amazon.com/Woman-Rides-Beast-Catholic-Church/dp/1565071999

Read the customer comments at the bottom of the above page.
 
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TheSneakster said:
You are citing a Jack Chick fun-DUH-mentalist religious tract as if it were a valid history text ? :eyeroll:

Are you as looney as Jack Chick, himself? :duh:

Michael "The Sneakster" Hobson
I am *not* anonymous.
Click to expand...

Just because it is brief, and in an illustrated form, doesn't mean it's necessarily wrong, does it?

See my post above yours for further confirmation.
 
Rmack said:
Just thought it would be an easy medium for people to assimilate quickly.

If you want more scholarly info, read

'The Two Babylons' by Alexander Hislop

here's a link;

http://www.biblebelievers.com/babylon/

Or, for a more modern account, read 'A Woman Rides the Beast' by Dave Hunt

http://www.amazon.com/Woman-Rides-Beast-Catholic-Church/dp/1565071999

Read the customer comments at the bottom of the above page.
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o.k.-now I am going to go OT, please...do not quote Jack Chick. If you want to stay credible, do not quote Jack Chick.:duh:
 
As I said earlier in this thread, Churches have more armed security guards than you might think.

Here is a link to the story I referred to earlier.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,316322,00.html

The self inflicted wound that this link mentions is complete spin apparently put there by someone or ones who didn't want any positive stories of private citizens with guns saving lives. The guy was taken down by a female undercover security guard who unloaded a Browning Hi-Power into the guy.

It should be on the front pages, "heroic woman saves many lives by shooting crazed gunman". It would have for sure been on the front pages if she hadn't stopped this guy, who had previously written his intention of being the worlds most prolific mass murderer by killing hundreds.

But, the story was spun, saying he shot himself, which is not so front-page worthy. They keep mentioning the shot himself bullshit despite clear evidence from the many eye witnesses.
 
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klidov said:
o.k.-now I am going to go OT, please...do not quote Jack Chick. If you want to stay credible, do not quote Jack Chick.:duh:
Click to expand...

Neither of those books are written by Jack Chick.

The comic book format is part of a synopsis of a book written by a former Jesuit priest who left the RCC after being in inner circles. His existence is documented up one side and down the other, but people still challenge the veracity of his disclosures.

None of the stuff I linked is authored by Jack Chick.
 
Rmack said:
Neither of those books are written by Jack Chick.

The comic book format is part of a synopsis of a book written by a former Jesuit priest who left the RCC after being in inner circles. His existence is documented up one side and down the other, but people still challenge the veracity of his disclosures.

None of the stuff I linked is authored by Jack Chick.
Click to expand...

No-but the books offered are sold on his site. In addition, (Former) Jesuit Priest Father Alberto Rivera has been called to task several times (starting in the early 80's) for exaggerating & falsifying information about his time in the Roman Catholic Church.

He is the Priest, of whom you speak.

For the record, I am not a Catholic. And the church has commited vicious crimes against humanity. But how the Catholic Church (and it's abuses) ties into a story about a Man who was abused by the Cof$, and killed after having a psychotic breakdown simply looks like a redirect.

And to Alex-what are your crimes? Instead of discussing the abuse of this Man at the hands of the cult, let's mention that the Catholic church has a violent past too.

Attack, not defend, right?

I think any discussion of what another church has (or has not) done is merely a smokescreen. Let's talk about THIS case.
 
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how long ago was Mario in?

LA Times:
Authorities said they were not sure why Mario Majorski, 48, traveled from Oregon to the center Sunday morning but indicated he had "created problems" for the church in the past, said Det. Wendi Berndt
"From that we believe there is some sort of mental issue," Berndt said.



>>> anyone know how long ago Mario Majorski was in Co$?

2) what does "created problems" mean???
 
Rmark

Attack, not defend, right?

I think any discussion of what another church has (or has not) done is merely a smokescreen. Let's talk about THIS case.[/QUOTE]


ditto

PLZ do not reply to Rjark post/s
PLZ do not reply to Alex Post/s
PLZ do not FEED them
 
James Wagner
Staff writer
Los Angeles Times
202 W. 1st St.
Los Angeles, CA 90012
O: (213) 237-7001
C: (703) 470-0717


ANYONE with accurate info, CALL immediately, this reporter is waiting for good info.

Or call me, if you want, Chuck Beatty, 412-260-1170, Pittsburgh
 
Div6 said:
According to http://www.truthaboutscientology.com/stats/by-name/m/mario-majorski.html

He is an L-11 completion. There is no way they would ever let a heavy psych case on the L's. But we have seen that they are no longer delivering the L's properly, as witness Lisa McPherson and Jason Beghe, for example.......

So, this is no "dis-gruntled ex-psych case"...


Also:


SCIENTOLOGISTS SUE UCLA
University is also named a defendant

ACT - 14

Copyright (C) 1993 Homer Wilson Smith
Redistribution rights granted for non commercial purposes.


From Free Spirit Vol 10, Issue 2

The Church of Scientology, bristling from public criticism by a
nationally recognized psychiatrist and UCLA professor, has sued the
outspoken educator and the university.

In a lawsuit filed this week in Santa Monica Superior Court, two
student followers of the controversial church claim that Dr. Louis J.
West has waged a smear campaign of religious intolerance and hatred on
university time.

The church calls the psychiatrist's persistent verbal attacks a
violation of both U.S. Constitution and state statutes. Such religious
persecution is against the law, church leaders say. And taxpayers are
paying a hefty price for it, they say.

Kendrick L. Moxon, the attorney who filed the lawsuit Wednesday on
behalf of UCLA students John VAn Dyke and Mario Majorski, said "major
First Amendment concerns" are at stake. It is illegal to discriminate
against someone because of race, sex or religion.

Pat Alston
Staff Writer, Daily Breeze
Click to expand...

Exactly, agreed.

he's done work for OSA and Moxon, per this article, which is on the propaganda side of things, so I agree.

We need more info.

LA Times is waiting for good info still:

James Wagner
Staff writer
Los Angeles Times
202 W. 1st St.
Los Angeles, CA 90012
O: (213) 237-7001
C: (703) 470-0717
 
klidov said:
No-but the books offered are sold on his site. In addition, (Former) Jesuit Priest Father Alberto Rivera has been called to task several times (starting in the early 80's) for exaggerating & falsifying information about his time in the Roman Catholic Church.

He is the Priest, of whom you speak.

For the record, I am not a Catholic. And the church has commited vicious crimes against humanity. But how the Catholic Church (and it's abuses) ties into a story about a Man who was abused by the Cof$, and killed after having a psychotic breakdown simply looks like a redirect.
Click to expand...

I would be interested in any links concerning Rivera being 'called to task'

I'm sorry if I redirected this thread, but I've done lots of research on the RCC, (most of it NOT connected to Chick Publications) and it hit a 'button' with me when it was suggested earlier that the Inquisition only killed a little over a thousand!

BTW, Chick Pubs didn't originally publish either of the full books I linked to. "The Two Babylons" was published in the 1800's! Do you want some links that have nothing to do with Chick? Can do, but that would be 'redirecting' this thread even more.

I'm not completely off topic, though. The Swiss Guard has got to be one of the most elaborate and certainly the oldest form of church security, which is the main subject of this thread. So, can you forgive me?:blush:
 
BlvdNights said:
The one possibly bad thing to come out of this is that AnonOrange's dumbass friends, AngryGayPope and Monamia went to CC last night for a flash raid AND Pope was yelling while cops and Moxon watched.

LA Anons advise to stay the fuck away from these three. This hurts the anti-scientology movement.
Click to expand...

Quite the contrary, if the info can be relayed to the on the ground flash raiding protestors, had someone emailed AGP or anon orange the info that Mario worked priorly for Moxon, in the suit Moxon pulled or attempted to pull on UCLA against Jolly West, then this whole goddamn Hubbard anti psych stuff comes full circle.

The damn story is Hubbard's fraud therapy, can't help mental case people like Mario, but then OSA Moxon legal ploys against our culture's scholars like West are slammed with Moxon led, Mario assisting, ploys.

Had we goddamn gotten this info to AGP, then AGP could be shouting the truth, and causing Moxon to wince like Moxon should, for Mario is caught up in the Hubbard false fraud therapy, a reject, but a someone that OSA stoops to use, all because ALL of us variously duped jerks, who followed this goddamn Hubbard blueprint.

NO.

AGP and those on the ground, flash raiding, let's get them the ammunition to shout in protest, the TRUTH about the whole mess.

CONNECT THE DOTS and give that info to those with the balls to protest!!!!
 
Glorifying, celebrating, or praising the alleged swordsman, even in jest, is unbelievably counter-productive and, well, stupid.

Making a joke out of this is also unbelievably counter-productive and stupid.

This situation is not a joke. Someone is dead. All available evidence indicates the shooter killed him because he reasonably believed he, or others, were in danger of being killed or suffering grievous bodily harm.

It does Critics, Exes and Anons no good to come across as glorifying and celebrating violence. Or, at minimum, as insensitive assholes.
 
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Thanks, but I, for one, don't need any warnings about who I'm dealing with. I am very good at figuring out who to listen to, and who to ignore. When people take an interest in "Dead Agenting" people, that doesn't influence me at all. I take everyone on their own merits.

So you know, ESMB doesn't exist as an anti-scientology forum. It is a forum for ex-scientologists to discuss whatever, and one of the topics is a healthy desire to see the Church disbanded and scientologists properly regulated, but not everyone here is an activist against the Church, some are just here to talk and tell their story, while reading another's story.

I hope you will share your own!
 
BlvdNights said:
Did you know all the facts last night? No? Why? Because no one knew.

SO you wanna send two people who have a history of not knowing the facts and being sketchy peaceful protesters out without all the facts?

.....wow.
Click to expand...


I work to get anyone who is protesting GOOD accurate info, that connects the dots, that makes the truth come out!

That's the point.

More ex's with the capability to flush out the history, quickly, so that those with the nerve to protest have the freshest most accurate info, is my recommendation of how to assist those that are front line flash raiding.

Otherwise, yes, I agree with your drift.

I don't go for trashing anyone in this anti Scientology game.

Better to share the truth, so it can get out, as fast as possible, to whomever is gonna protest for stopping the disgraces.

Mario was used by OSA/Moxon, that's evident in the Bruin article.

Lots more still to be learned.

But the irony already, is Mario has done OSA ploy work.

And the tragedy is Mario attacks those he used to help.

There is much to think about, and I will do whatever I can to help sanely go forward out of this Scientology/Hubbard mess that I helped bolster for 27 years of my Sea Org staff member life.

I'm not into momentary sniping. Who cares about that in the long run.

Help whoever is protesting be a better protestor and get more truth effectively into the public awareness one way or another.

http://tinyurl.com/ywhgaf
 
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