FCDC circa 1970

[Long Gone]

Speaking of guns, did you ever shoot rats with George Spingler out in the alley behind 2125 "S" Street? Big cat-sized rats. They would dance in the moonlight like furry expeditors.

Thanks for the FR's name, Div VI. Now I can put that thread back in the pool

I was mugged/robbed once during my years on staff. I guess it was something of a rite of passage. We often had people get body routed in who took advantage of the lax security and would walk out with stuff they snatched from purses or coat pockets.

The only dancing rat I saw behind the building was one that had been poisoned and was rolling around in its death throes. I guess it was dropping its body!

Whatever happened to Spingler? Last I heard he was online in LA but that was a long time ago.

 

[Colleen K. Peltomaa]

I remember Tony Settons in estates. There was someone else also - might have been Bill

I remember Helen also as a public. One of the VIPs.

Food for Thought. What a great place. It was banned before Franks got there - it was one of the first things I was told after routing onto staff. In hindsight, one of the glaring red flags that I should have paid attention to.

I remember People Pickle and a little sandwich shop on the corner of Florida and R - where Nora's is now I think.

Also, the Cold Duck - little bar/dive next to Food for Thought.

What would have happened to you if you had decided to exercise your own self-determinism and go and eat there anyway?

 

[Colleen K. Peltomaa]

There is a rather large population of black people in Washington DC. Did the church execs have any programs to recruit black people?

 

[Div6]

There is a rather large population of black people in Washington DC. Did the church execs have any programs to recruit black people?

Not when I was in....most of the public were crackers from the 'burbs. There were a few on lines, and a couple on staff even, but no "campaign" was ever surveyed and targetted in that direction. Mostly off of the bodyrouting/promo handout line....

 

[Long Gone]

What would have happened to you if you had decided to exercise your own self-determinism and go and eat there anyway?

And possibly lose my chance for eternal spiritual freedom??? Perish the thought.

 

[Colleen K. Peltomaa]

Your last supper, eh?

Does anyone recall Steve Lauer (spelling?)? He was the course supervisor for Div 6.

 

[Long Gone]

Your last supper, eh?

Does anyone recall Steve Lauer (spelling?)? He was the course supervisor for Div 6.

haha ... yes, my last supper as a potentially free being.

I remember Steve. He was around for a long time after I left but no idea where he ended up.

 

[chipgallo]

I believe Steve Lower married Cheryl Hoover, whose teenage son declared me an SP in 1991. Whenever we picket the place, I'll ask about him for you.

 

[Colleen K. Peltomaa]

I believe Steve Lower married Cheryl Hoover, whose teenage son declared me an SP in 1991. Whenever we picket the place, I'll ask about him for you.

Great, thanks

When I was there he was not married and he had a young daughter. His daughter seemed like a past-lifer. He was a real stable terminal for that Org.

 

[ThisFenceHurts]

The Ullmans were in Clearwater in the mid 90s...they had two daughters, one of whom (Ursula? Shannon?) was on staff at Tampa Org as late as 2006 from my source.



The Missonis family was also in Clearwater some time ago. One son, Russel, is in the SO. Another, Grant, married veteran Scientologist John Gludovatz\\\\\\\' daughter Erica a few years ago. Again, both were on staff at Tampa Org as late as 2006.



Bill Witter is selling real estate in Clearwater -

http://www.equityprorealty.com/company.htm

He divorced his wife, Eve, in the mid-90s and their son, Michael, has been in the SO since then as far as I am aware. At one time Bill was business partners with Barclay Bean in Clearwater.


There was a John Ruane who worked at several Scientology schools in Clearwater in the mid-90s. He was involved in infiltrating CAN with the GO in the 70s and may have been declared along with business partner Randy Payne, founder of Lite School in Clearwater and Hungary. There was also a John Ruane who was a course supervisor somewhere who passed away quite some time ago.



Tina Dillard divorced Ty long ago and lived in Clearwater in the mid-90s. Apparently has gone bat-shit crazy and was dealing with health issues and a near-Declare. Her daughter, Olivia, is married and was a public at Tampa Org as late as 2006.

If anyone is familiar with Arlington, the Washburn family (I forget the guy\'s name, but his wife is Roberta and they had two children, Neal and Darrel) was living in Tampa as late as 2006, running a Scientology school called The Washburn Academy in Clearwater, just a half block from where the remains of The Apollo are kept under lock and key. The father, Roberta, and Darrel all were working at the school, along with Mary Float and Sean Smith (former D of T at the Coachman as well as other posts). Neal was Div 6 Sup at Tampa Org.

Oh yes, Richard is the father\'s name. Richard Washburn. I believe that his brother is also living in the Clearwater area.




Hope this data helps!

 

[Div6]

<snip>


Tina Dillard divorced Ty long ago and lived in Clearwater in the mid-90s. Apparently has gone bat-shit crazy and was dealing with health issues and a near-Declare. Her daughter, Olivia, is married and was a public at Tampa Org as late as 2006.

<snip>
Hope this data helps!

Hi ThisFenceHurts,

Can you elaborate on this a bit more? Declared for what? Wasn't she an VIII completion? She also had a son, Adrian, I believe. They were both adopted IIRC. She always was a bit "edgy" but "bat-shit crazy?"

Please, when you have time, do tell.



I think Richard Olsen is alo in Tampa now. He and Sue were divorced a while back, and I think he re-married. Any word on Jack Becker?

 

[ThisFenceHurts]

Hi Div6,

Tina was in fact an old OTVIII and was in the middle of the new OTVII when she began having severe health issues, something similar to MS, if I recall. She had disagreements with management at one point. She began to speak scathingly of Ty and taught her daughter to do the same. My dealings with her were scary. Continuous dramatization and serious anger-management issues. However, I only knew her briefly. She may just have been having a rough patch with the illness and CoS trouble. Perhaps I have mis-characterized her, but, to me, she was as bat-shit crazy as anyone I\\\'ve ever met. And I have noticed that people often went off the deep end on VII for awhile, often accompanied by severe physical illnesses...some never recovered, and some went on to do new VIII and actually seemed to calm down and become nice people. So I may have simply met her at the wrong time!

You do recall correctly, Olivia and Adrian were adopted. Adrian joined the Army and was stationed in Iraq as late as 2006. A big change from the black fingernails and skinny kid I met in the 90s.

No data on the others that you mention, sorry.

 

[Div6]

Hi Div6,

Tina was in fact an old OTVIII and was in the middle of the new OTVII when she began having severe health issues, something similar to MS, if I recall. She had disagreements with management at one point. She began to speak scathingly of Ty and taught her daughter to do the same. My dealings with her were scary. Continuous dramatization and serious anger-management issues. However, I only knew her briefly. She may just have been having a rough patch with the illness and CoS trouble. Perhaps I have mis-characterized her, but, to me, she was as bat-shit crazy as anyone I\\\'ve ever met. And I have noticed that people often went off the deep end on VII for awhile, often accompanied by severe physical illnesses...some never recovered, and some went on to do new VIII and actually seemed to calm down and become nice people. So I may have simply met her at the wrong time!

You do recall correctly, Olivia and Adrian were adopted. Adrian joined the Army and was stationed in Iraq as late as 2006. A big change from the black fingernails and skinny kid I met in the 90s.

No data on the others that you mention, sorry.

Wow. Thanks TFH. She and Ty had "issues" from day 1 apparently. Were you SO? On the delivery lines? I'm curious about your statements re: "going off the deep end" on VII. Was it all "on GAT VII?" With DM suppressing the lines, its a wonder anyone is still sane in those parts...

Adrian is in Iraq? Wow...trading one hell for another. Was he not so gung ho on Scn?

 

[ThisFenceHurts]

Nope, not SO. My comments are all purely my observation as a public.

My definition of \\\"off the deep end\\\" may be different than yours, I don\\\'t mean these people turned into babbling psychotics. More like Stepford Wives. Lights on but nobody is home. Suddenly going from family-oriented to ignoring children and letting them avoid going to school and allowing them to run free all day long with no supervision. Suddenly purchasing hordes of MEST like sportscars or boats. Dumping the 2D and dating/marrying/screwing around, often with people of much younger age.

Now I understand that these behaviors are not restricted to those on VII. I am just saying that people who did not bow to all the pressures of Scn for years and years, maintaining good lives for themselves an their families, would just seem to check out mentally and fall into the familiar Scn behavior patterns above while on VII. I mean these people were just not the same people that they were before starting VII. Much like the later Ron seemed like a different person than the earlier Ron.

I am not an expert in this area, for sure, and the occurrence of these behavior changes may just be coincidental with other things going on. They may be anecdotal and not representative of the whole.

One thing is for sure. GAT separates the robots from the free-thinkers. When a 7 year old can flunk you on the Ethics Specialist Course or Level IV Course because you quote MORE from the reference than is in the GAT Drill Book, or you don\\\'t pause long enough on a comma in a verbatim patter drill, something is horribly wrong.


Adrian was never gung-ho on Scientology...he wasn\'t really gung-ho on anything. Very withdrawn, wouldn\'t make eye contact, ran away often. I only spoke with him once and not at great length. Olivia, OTOH, is extremely gung-ho and even was on staff briefly at Tampa Org.

 

[Div6]

This is fascinating to me. I hope you don't mind my asking more questions.
What you describe sounds like the usual "mid-life crises" kind of stuff...dump the family for a younger woman, etc. All "out-ethics" indicators, if you will....
So much for "scientology works".

Indeed GAT makes robots. Robots are PTS to the thing they are robotic to.
I don't know if you know Pierre Ethier (class XII at flag)..he has an interesting web site at www.upperbridge.org. His take on GAT is very "enlightening".

I remember bouncing both of those kids on my knee. (They both know they are adopted? I'd hate to have them find out via this thread.



What browser are you running? Are you on a linux client? The backslashes are usually used as "escape" characters in certain programming situations...

 

[ThisFenceHurts]

Div6, looks like we are following each other around the board!

I agree with you about the similarity between mid-life crises and the behavior I am describing. The big difference that I see is that, usually, mid-life crises present with almost desperate symptoms...like the person is searching for something - lost youth, missed opportunity, whatever. It's called a CRISIS for a reason.

The Scns on VII that I have noticed are decidely NOT in crisis mode. No visible desperation. Instead, a zombie-like quality. This is not everyone, mind you. Almost like what you would expect of a person who is running on post-hypnotic suggestion. Now I am not claiming that GAT OT VII is somehow creating this state. But it is weird and I lost some very good friends (oh they still talked to me but were out-to-lunch).

Pierre has some interesting takes on things. I've enjoyed reading his summations, and he is much more qualified than I am to extrapolate any serious conclusions about GAT and new OT VII!

Adrian and Olivia both know that they are adopted. No worries there!

I believe I have fixed the annoying / problem.

 

[Div6]

Div6, looks like we are following each other around the board!

I agree with you about the similarity between mid-life crises and the behavior I am describing. The big difference that I see is that, usually, mid-life crises present with almost desperate symptoms...like the person is searching for something - lost youth, missed opportunity, whatever. It's called a CRISIS for a reason.

The Scns on VII that I have noticed are decidely NOT in crisis mode. No visible desperation. Instead, a zombie-like quality. This is not everyone, mind you. Almost like what you would expect of a person who is running on post-hypnotic suggestion. Now I am not claiming that GAT OT VII is somehow creating this state. But it is weird and I lost some very good friends (oh they still talked to me but were out-to-lunch).

Pierre has some interesting takes on things. I've enjoyed reading his summations, and he is much more qualified than I am to extrapolate any serious conclusions about GAT and new OT VII!

Adrian and Olivia both know that they are adopted. No worries there!

I believe I have fixed the annoying / problem.

Thanks for that.

Zombies eh?

One of the "requirements" for Solo NOTs is 200 hours audited MINIMUM.

Lots of opportunity there for over-run and other various forms of subtle spiritual abuse.....besides being just a stupid "ARBITRARY".

I'm sorry to hear that. Scngsts can be some of the most entertaining people around, when they are not zombies....

 

[Long Gone]

I suspect the two John Ruane's described above are one in the same. I was not aware that he had passed away.

John was the brother of Maddy Ruane, who was married to Jeff Dietz back in the 70's. Have no idea what happened to either Jeff or Maddy.

Jack Becker passed away many years ago.

Never knew Tina that well. When she and Ty used to come into the org they would get the mini-royalty treatment, so they always seemed a little inaccessable to me. Didn't Ty later run the DC Celebrity Center mission?

 

[chipgallo]

Ty took over the Mass Ave mission from Mark and Ellen Jones and moved it to 16th Street. He got declared as part of the "ridge on the Bridge" handling, ostensibly for not routing Clears up the line to org/Flag. I took over ED duties for a year but the Financial Police wrecked the place fiscally and most public didn't want to return.

 

[ThisFenceHurts]

There are definitely two separate John Ruanes. I heard of the death of one in the mid-90's but the other was still active into the 2000's.

Ty Dillard must have done his A-J or whatever because he is now occasionally listed here and there in various church pubs as one of the top FSM's in the US.