Lermanet.com's great finds Re Scientology

[JustSheila]

Cat, that's an awesome quote!

I've just finished reading Alinsky's ten points and I'm just floored! Wish I'd read Alinsky decades ago and I'm keenly interested in everything he has to say. He's laser sharp with politics and control, scarily so, and his concept of politics is exactly how the Democratic party has always operated in Chicago.

They call it the "City that Works", but it is a city that works by rules beyond the rules set out in laws. Alinsky! That explains it. I have a lot of friends who work for the City of Chicago and the stuff that goes on behind the scenes is mind-boggling. The Democratic Party pulled an Alinsky when they blackmailed a senator to retire to give Barack Obama a spot so he could show SOME kind of political experience before running for the Presidency. The Senator he replaced was actually very good, too, better than Obama, and Sen Obama didn't do a thing while in office in Illinois beyond set up his connections and Presidential campaign.

Another example, I was not kidding the Anons when I told them that the Chicago Org would never open. The City does not want it, it will be wound up in red tape forever.

I''ll be reading more Alinsky now that I've been introduced and am interested in anything you might think would make a good discussion. Fascinating!

 

[Cat's Squirrel]

Cat, that's an awesome quote!

I've just finished reading Alinsky's ten points and I'm just floored! Wish I'd read Alinsky decades ago and I'm keenly interested in everything he has to say. He's laser sharp with politics and control, scarily so, and his concept of politics is exactly how the Democratic party has always operated in Chicago.

They call it the "City that Works", but it is a city that works by rules beyond the rules set out in laws. Alinsky! That explains it. I have a lot of friends who work for the City of Chicago and the stuff that goes on behind the scenes is mind-boggling. The Democratic Party pulled an Alinsky when they blackmailed a senator to retire to give Barack Obama a spot so he could show SOME kind of political experience before running for the Presidency. The Senator he replaced was actually very good, too, better than Obama, and Sen Obama didn't do a thing while in office in Illinois beyond set up his connections and Presidential campaign.

Another example, I was not kidding the Anons when I told them that the Chicago Org would never open. The City does not want it, it will be wound up in red tape forever.

I''ll be reading more Alinsky now that I've been introduced and am interested in anything you might think would make a good discussion. Fascinating!

You're welcome. That quote actually came from Alinsky's "Rules for Radicals", which I read a long time ago and is well worth a read. He wrote another one called "Reveille for Radicals", which I don't know so much about having only glanced at it once.

 

[degraded being]

IMHO, much of the topic here is old hat to many of us who have been around. I think it's the fact that Mockingbird posts about this stuff as if no one knows about it.As if no one knows who Arnie is and what he's accomplished or written about in the past. That it's the best thing since sliced bread when it's been around and considered for many years. As if we are all ignorant here when many of us aren't. It does get tiring after a while to have this all repeated and repeated over and over again as if it's the sole solution to all that ails a scientologist.

What was written by ITYIWT in a tad bit of frustration with a sense of humor is being blown up to make it appear as if she's OSA and she certainly is not OSA or forwarding OSA agenda. The idea is to read the internet. What is being posted on ESMB recently about this hypnosis stuff can be found already on the internet. Particularly over at Lermanet.com IMHO, often a simple summary with a link to the referenced info would suffice.

What she said. I quite like the analytical/deconstruction method of decompression, and I am interested in the hypnosis/persuasion aspects of how people get control over others.
However, some people have limited interest in that, or no interest. That doesn't mean that they do not, cannot, or have not gotten rid of their mental ties to scientology.

 

[degraded being]

"When I speak of a control system for planet earth I do not want my words to be misunderstood: I do not mean that some higher order of beings has locked us inside the constraints of a space-bound jail, closely monitored by psychic entities we might call angels or demons. I do not propose to redefine God. What I do mean is that mythology rules at a level of our social reality over which normal political and intellectual action has no real power.… Myths define the set of things scholars, politicians, and scientists can think about. They are operated upon by symbols, and the language these symbols form constitutes a complete system. This system is metalogical, but not metaphysical. It violates no laws because it is the substance of which laws are made. Jacques Vallée, The Invisible College, 201–202.

What he said too.

 

[I told you I was trouble]

IMHO, much of the topic here is old hat to many of us who have been around. I think it's the fact that Mockingbird posts about this stuff as if no one knows about it. As if no one knows who Arnie is and what he's accomplished or written about in the past. That it's the best thing since sliced bread when it's been around and considered for many years. As if we are all ignorant here when many of us aren't. It does get tiring after a while to have this all repeated and repeated over and over again as if it's the sole solution to all that ails a scientologist.

What was written by ITYIWT in a tad bit of frustration with a sense of humor is being blown up to make it appear as if she's OSA and she certainly is not OSA or forwarding OSA agenda. The idea is to read the internet. What is being posted on ESMB recently about this hypnosis stuff can be found already on the internet. Particularly over at Lermanet.com IMHO, often a simple summary with a link to the referenced info would suffice.

Lol, yes that pretty much covers it ... I do like to see some "opposition" to some of the stranger ideas around here (and have done since the day I joined ESMB) because if there isn't any it could appear to a newbie or a lurker glancing at ESMB, that we all still think along similar cult-like lines ... and we don't.



I very much care about people at that scary stage of just leaving the cofs, they are at their most vulnerable and need time to work things out for themselves ... I doubt they need righteous, aggressive people marketing their latest "philosophy" and bombarding them with "suggestions". These "helpful" people seem to me to be desperate to get their own names in lights but I would hope not at the expense of others who are trying to think straight and regain some space.

I truly believe that laughter and the light touch (along with intelligent deconstruction and discussion of the subject) has much merit, hubbardy lectures and the excessive use of clay, perhaps not so much.

If those of us that have been around for a while stay too quiet some of our more "radical" inmates will take over the asylum and nobody wants to see that.

Ya, what I find instructive is to see who is attacking or otherwise trying to put down what and whom.

Here we have an example of a guy who spends enormous amounts of time posting to help others . . . and so this is a thing to attack or ridicule!?!

Just goes to show the lack of class of those who do the attacking, ridiculing and attempting to put down . . . along with those who support or otherwise rationalize it.

And as to giving it a bye on the basis of venting frustration??? What bollocks . . . apart from condoning narcissism, umm, isn't getting frustrated that another is doing something away from you, directed at helping others, a little self-centered to be frustrated at it!?!

It's a simple proposition: look who is doing good and acting to help others . . . then look at who is putting such action down and those who condone and/or support the put downs . . .

Good common sense dictates whom a sane person would choose to have any discourse or relationship with.

R

It's funny you should say that Rog, because my good common sense dictates that I should run as fast as possible away from creepy, egotistical weirdos that still "audit their body thetans" daily and can only seem to think via hubbards crazy tek (and try hard to encourage others to do the same) ... but then I'm a particularly nasty, self centred, narcissistic OSA bitch from hell, so I suppose that's to be expected.

Happy Christmas Roger ... I hope your "spiritual team-mates" allow you to at least have Christmas day off.

 

[Gib]

IMHO, much of the topic here is old hat to many of us who have been around. I think it's the fact that Mockingbird posts about this stuff as if no one knows about it. As if no one knows who Arnie is and what he's accomplished or written about in the past. That it's the best thing since sliced bread when it's been around and considered for many years. As if we are all ignorant here when many of us aren't. It does get tiring after a while to have this all repeated and repeated over and over again as if it's the sole solution to all that ails a scientologist.

What was written by ITYIWT in a tad bit of frustration with a sense of humor is being blown up to make it appear as if she's OSA and she certainly is not OSA or forwarding OSA agenda. The idea is to read the internet. What is being posted on ESMB recently about this hypnosis stuff can be found already on the internet. Particularly over at Lermanet.com IMHO, often a simple summary with a link to the referenced info would suffice.

Sure it's old hat, but it depends on who one is talking to as an audience here, you old hats, I guess I might be an old hat now,

or some reader.

I recall when first reading here as a non member and Veda posting the Brain Washing Manual several times, well I finally clicked on it and read it. It opened my eyes, it took repetition of the message for me to actually read the link.

Same is true for TAJ and Alanzo repeating about Plato.

If you think MB is talking to you, well, maybe he is not. :confused2:

I'm on the Dean Wilbur kick and Hubbards use of Rhetoric to trap. I have no idea if anybody here has ever read the links I posted to explain Rhetoric since Hubbard used it (except MB has). :confused2:

I recall when ITYIWT changed her avatar some time ago. I actually PM'd her and told her I liked her old one better. She responded she lost it, But she found it again.

Trouble, I do think people will work it out, what's wrong with some added explanations and resources to get educated from the Hubbard mind trap.

I agree with Bent Corydon, http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthre...-L-Ron-Hubbard&p=988825&viewfull=1#post988825

With this in mind, I wish to state that no matter what my fate may be, that one thing is absolutely true: I wholeheartedly support all of those who are working to make known the many hidden facts about this amoral and exploitative organization, and expose the truth about its founder, L. Ron Hubbard.​

 

[I told you I was trouble]

Sure it's old hat, but it depends on who one is talking to as an audience here, you old hats, I guess I might be an old hat now,

or some reader.

I recall when first reading here as a non member and Veda posting the Brain Washing Manual several times, well I finally clicked on it and read it. It opened my eyes, it took repetition of the message for me to actually read the link.

Same is true for TAJ and Alanzo repeating about Plato.

If you think MB is talking to you, well, maybe he is not. :confused2:

I'm on the Dean Wilbur kick and Hubbards use of Rhetoric to trap. I have no idea if anybody here has ever read the links I posted to explain Rhetoric since Hubbard used it (except MB has). :confused2:

I recall when ITYIWT changed her avatar some time ago. I actually PM'd her and told her I liked her old one better. She responded she lost it, But she found it again.

Trouble, I do think people will work it out, what's wrong with some added explanations and resources to get educated from the Hubbard mind trap.

I agree with Bent Corydon, http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthre...-L-Ron-Hubbard&p=988825&viewfull=1#post988825

With this in mind, I wish to state that no matter what my fate may be, that one thing is absolutely true: I wholeheartedly support all of those who are working to make known the many hidden facts about this amoral and exploitative organization, and expose the truth about its founder, L. Ron Hubbard.​

Nothing wrong with it at all Gibby, I wouldn't like to see ESMB drowning in it though.

Also, people do move on (which has to be a good thing) and they should be "allowed to" without other people (possibly still angered, damaged or obsessed) trying to make them feel guilty.

 

[mockingbird]

Well I started this thread in response to a request to put Arnie's stuff up for the interested and if there are any I suggest they read it !

I also am interested in evaluating what is a valid stat for OSA ( with logic and Socratic method not cult methods or doctrine ) and helping those stats crash .

I have tried to help lots of OSA stats go up - I know I helped some operations fail in the past .


They want dead and silent critics to be affluence highest ever !

I want SO execs in prison for cult crimes to be affluence highest ever - we can beat Snow White !!!


It is like the Saint Hill size for this - the cult make break point !!!

I think if DM and a couple dozen of the right execs get twenty five to life for the right crimes - it WILL break the cult !


I know it is a broad purpose a star high goal but I know it is your purpose too !!!


I am interested in Karen's input on people who come to threads and say they do not want to hear it - as if they are forced to or something !

When HUNDREDS more read the same threads and click like and thanks and LOL .

Would you stop posting your threads for less than ten people who say it is old hat or boring or tell them to stick their...

 

[RogerB]

Mockingbird is correct . . .

One does not stop doing what should be done because some of the idiot classes want to put you down . . . to allow them to stop you is to let the idiot class rule: and that ain't a good idea.

R

 

[I told you I was trouble]

I'm not fluent in idiot Roger ... could you please speak more slowly?


​

 

[cleared cannibal]

Well I started this thread in response to a request to put Arnie's stuff up for the interested and if there are any I suggest they read it !

I also am interested in evaluating what is a valid stat for OSA ( with logic and Socratic method not cult methods or doctrine ) and helping those stats crash .

I have tried to help lots of OSA stats go up - I know I helped some operations fail in the past .


They want dead and silent critics to be affluence highest ever !

I want SO execs in prison for cult crimes to be affluence highest ever - we can beat Snow White !!!


It is like the Saint Hill size for this - the cult make break point !!!

I think if DM and a couple dozen of the right execs get twenty five to life for the right crimes - it WILL break the cult !


I know it is a broad purpose a star high goal but I know it is your purpose too !!!


I am interested in Karen's input on people who come to threads and say they do not want to hear it - as if they are forced to or something !

When HUNDREDS more read the same threads and click like and thanks and LOL .

Would you stop posting your threads for less than ten people who say it is old hat or boring or tell them to stick their...

As I have said in the past if one doesn't like a thread don't read it.

I think these posts are very valuable as many are continually leaving the cult and they need an easy one stop shop.

I wish I had time to read all of them.

Keep up the good work MB

 

[Lone Star]

Mockingbird is correct . . .

One does not stop doing what should be done because some of the idiot classes want to put you down . . . to allow them to stop you is to let the idiot class rule: and that ain't a good idea.

Roger

<snipped>

.....Oh, never mind.

Far be it from me to help DM and OSA silence Arnie, Mockingbird, and/or Roger.

I am hereby severing my ties to ITYIWT and AnonMary. I am leaving the "idiot class"!