Scared

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
Ackerland is a helpful and patient person with people hurt by the cult.
Yes, that is true. But I moved on. I made in the last time lots of things for my personal healing that you all don't know.

I don't need a "babysitter" anymore, I needed one a while ago....

... and at this point I disagree with Ackerland. In the begining is contact over the internet better than nothing. I was to scared to post on ESMB and I had no other German alternative, than WWP. I knew nothing other.
 

Free to shine

Shiny & Free
Tell me please what you don't understand. I will try to explain.

I do very well understand, what you all wrote, but maybe you don't understand what happen.
At the moment I want to close the book, of the things that happen in the last ca. two years (Gaslighting, contact to Anons, contact to OSA...) and I want to move on.


But always when I think, now it is closed, it isn't closed.

I am not scared anymore, it was only because of this one stupid man... It was a very evil thing to hear that a person everything recorded and may be he did much more.

The fear is gone eg I called MrNobody and we had a very nice and long telephone call.

I don't have the feeling to go back to the Cult. I am over this point. I am lucky to be free and to learn lots of things.

At the moment I am doing lots of things that I never made...(thanks for this advice "Free to Shine") and I enjoy time with my family. It's a great world. ...eg today I had a great day with my family. I also enjoy time with my friends. I often help my grandmother, she is demented. It's nice to listen to her stories. I hope she is able to tell them very long.

I am not alone and I am having contacts. But sometimes I have the feeling they don't understand me in some things.
The members on ESMB do understand me and I can read and learn to find my way.

But I also want to fight against this evil cult. It doesn't exists lots of places where I can do this in German. I can't discuss very good in English. That is the reason why I post at the German Anti Scientology pages. ...and I do there nothing wrong. ..and it is my right to that. I do that what I want. I don't let me forbid this.

I wrote in the begining, I want to close the book of the things that happen in the last 2 years, but I want to get along with my childhood in Cof$ and what happen because of this childhood. I am the result of Hubbards evil education advices.

I get more and more me. I know more and more what I want. I get more and more self trust
.

That's great to hear Nicole. I don't understand all the personal relationships here or what happened, I do know that finding people who have an understanding of what it is like to be a result of 'Hubbard education' as a child is very important. When you are raised within a group that does not allow you to think for yourself, and plans every move in your life for you, it is terribly hard to break away and takes a great deal of courage.

You have done that and my hat is off to you. :hattip: If you have slipped and fallen along the way, well it happens. The important thing is what you do after that and it's very understandable that you want to fight the cult, this is part of finding yourself as a person outside that group. You are getting along fine here, don't worry too much about the English. :biggrin:
 

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
That's great to hear Nicole. I don't understand all the personal relationships here or what happened, I do know that finding people who have an understanding of what it is like to be a result of 'Hubbard education' as a child is very important. When you are raised within a group that does not allow you to think for yourself, and plans every move in your life for you, it is terribly hard to break away and takes a great deal of courage.

You have done that and my hat is off to you. :hattip: If you have slipped and fallen along the way, well it happens. The important thing is what you do after that and it's very understandable that you want to fight the cult, this is part of finding yourself as a person outside that group. You are getting along fine here, don't worry too much about the English. :biggrin:


I don't understand this too... I needed help (I got gaslighted from OSA) I asked for help, got in the begining help, than they (maybe) thought I am OSA (I behaved like a Scientologist), I got kicks in my a..., I got in contact with a Scientologist (OSA) and trolled them, because I was angry and got there what I needed a "understanding and help". Than MrN came and helped me. This is the very short version. The person that scared me and blackmailed me, is a totaly other story and has nothing to do with Anonymous. This was OSA or a totaly crazy person.


May be the Anons tell me what there happen, what they thought about me. Why they thing I followed them and maybe Rheinländer tells me what the person he asked talked about me...

As long no Anon tell me what happen from February until June last year I can't bring light in the darkness.

Imo it was in the begining a big missunderstanding, because I didn't said the truth about my Scientology past and the "fear of OSA was there", and OSA worked without that OSA was there :unsure: (in the begining)...

But I really don't want to think about it anymore, I would like to hear answers. I won't get them :whistling: and so I move on and do that what I want and enjoy my life. As long I will get no answers I close my "Anon book" and hope the involved Anons treat others in similar situation with more respect.


Thanks for this post FTS.:)
 

MrNobody

Who needs merits?
I don't understand this too... I needed help (I got gaslighted from OSA) I asked for help, got in the begining help, than they (maybe) thought I am OSA (I behaved like a Scientologist), I got kicks in my a..., I got in contact with a Scientologist (OSA) and trolled them, because I was angry and got there what I needed a "understanding and help". Than MrN came and helped me.

<snip>

Minor correction: I just was here, posting what I post, which usually is just my sometimes controversial opinion. :biggrin:

It was you who made the 1st step by PMing me, because you felt touched by a totally unrelated post I had made.

So it was you who took the 1st step, and, IMO, that was the only way it could have worked. Had I PM'd you 1st, my PM would have just ended up on your blocklist - either on the ESMB ignore-list, or at least on your personal "mental" ignore list. So whatever I had to say would have just gone poof.

So yeah, it was you who had to take the 1st step, and you did. Thanks for giving me that opportunity.

:cheers:, MrN

Ps: Where's my beer? :coolwink: :p
 

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
Minor correction: I just was here, posting what I post, which usually is just my sometimes controversial opinion. :biggrin:

It was you who made the 1st step by PMing me, because you felt touched by a totally unrelated post I had made.

So it was you who took the 1st step, and, IMO, that was the only way it could have worked. Had I PM'd you 1st, my PM would have just ended up on your blocklist - either on the ESMB ignore-list, or at least on your personal "mental" ignore list. So whatever I had to say would have just gone poof.

So yeah, it was you who had to take the 1st step, and you did. Thanks for giving me that opportunity.

:cheers:, MrN

Ps: Where's my beer? :coolwink: :p

I saw very early that I couldn't handle you, all I tried didn't work. I found my master. Than you made this one heartbreaking post and I thought may be I could tell him, what happen... May be he doesn't think I am crazy or something like that. I told you from the Fair Game. Regulary I had heard I need dox, or go to a "Sektenberatungsstelle" or go to a doctor. ... and you believed me, you knew about what I talked, you gave it a name: Gaslighting and you gave me another name Paulette Cooper and I started to read about it and I thought, yes that it is. Than you gave me tips, how I can "handle" this gaslighting and you took my fear away with that great "Forget OSA" PM (you should publish it)... and I started to write you everything... You didn't only listen, you gave tips and comments and sometimes I thought OMG now he breaks the contact, but you didn't. That surprised me and I am still surprised about it. I am surprised that you treat me like a "normal" person and that doesn't do lots of people. Not in the real life and not in the internet. ..and even as I sometimes fall on my way, you were there and said I should stand up and walk again.

:flowers2:

Nicole

@ Anons: I was this morning with my family four hours in the "Sauerländer" forest, we had lots of fun, know they are all tired and I had time to write here. :)

@MrN: You will get your beer or coffee.:biggrin:
 

MrNobody

Who needs merits?
I saw very early that I couldn't handle you, all I tried didn't work.

LOL, yeah, unless I'm doing my job as a band member, I pretty much just march to the beat of my own drum, which might be hard to handle for others at times. :biggrin:

I found my master.

I'm not sure how well that phrase translates to English, so I think it's appropriate to point out that I'm nobody's master. (No pun intended, or is it?)

Than you made this one heartbreaking post and I thought may be I could tell him, what happen... May be he doesn't think I am crazy or something like that. I told you from the Fair Game. Regulary I had heard I need dox, or go to a "Sektenberatungsstelle" or go to a doctor. ... and you believed me, you knew about what I talked, you gave it a name: Gaslighting and you gave me another name Paulette Cooper and I started to read about it and I thought, yes that it is. Than you gave me tips, how I can "handle" this gaslighting and you took my fear away with that great "Forget OSA" PM (you should publish it)...

I did post a re-worded, shortened and de-personalized version of it, somewhere here on ESMB.

and I started to write you everything... You didn't only listen, you gave tips and comments and sometimes I thought OMG now he breaks the contact, but you didn't. That surprised me and I am still surprised about it. I am surprised that you treat me like a "normal" person and that doesn't do lots of people. Not in the real life and not in the internet. ..and even as I sometimes fall on my way, you were there and said I should stand up and walk again.

Why should I break contact? Every person I've ever met online or IRL was/is their own kind of crazy, so you're indeed quite normal in that regard. That aside, I've witnessed quite some crazy stuff in my life, so I know that not everything is crazy just because it sounds crazy.

:flowers2:

Nicole

@ Anons: I was this morning with my family four hours in the "Sauerländer" forest, we had lots of fun, know they are all tired and I had time to write here. :)

@MrN: You will get your beer or coffee.:biggrin:

Hmmm, beer.... :) :) :)


:cheers:, MrN
 

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
I'm not sure how well that phrase translates to English, so I think it's appropriate to point out that I'm nobody's master. (No pun intended, or is it?)
I guess I translated wrong..."Ich habe meinen Meister gefunden" but not "Meister" as Jesus or Hubbard :biggrin: (never again), "Meister" because you always new how I wanted to handle you.

Hmmm, beer.... :) :) :)


:cheers:, MrN
ok .... :):):)

:smoochy:
Nicole

@ the Anons between my two post I sat in the sun and read a book (criminal story) I made the laundry and now I will cook the dinner: a selfmade pizza. After the dinner (I guess) I will sit with my husband in de garden and drink a beer or two. At July 16th (your raid is planned that day in Düsseldorf) I will go with one of my best friends to a Söhne Mannheims concert... :cheers2:
 

MrNobody

Who needs merits?
I<snip>
because you always new how I wanted to handle you.
<snip>

See? The thing is: If I believed that statement, I would lull myself into a false form of certainty and security, which would mean danger. So I will not do that. :wink2:
 

Lurker5

Gold Meritorious Patron
Tell me please what you don't understand. I will try to explain.

I do very well understand, what you all wrote, but maybe you don't understand what happen.
At the moment I want to close the book, of the things that happen in the last ca. two years (Gaslighting, contact to Anons, contact to OSA...) and I want to move on.


But always when I think, now it is closed, it isn't closed.

I am not scared anymore, it was only because of this one stupid man... It was a very evil thing to hear that a person everything recorded and may be he did much more.

The fear is gone eg I called MrNobody and we had a very nice and long telephone call.

I don't have the feeling to go back to the Cult. I am over this point. I am lucky to be free and to learn lots of things.

At the moment I am doing lots of things that I never made...(thanks for this advice "Free to Shine") and I enjoy time with my family. It's a great world. ...eg today I had a great day with my family. I also enjoy time with my friends. I often help my grandmother, she is demented. It's nice to listen to her stories. I hope she is able to tell them very long.

I am not alone and I am having contacts. But sometimes I have the feeling they don't understand me in some things.
The members on ESMB do understand me and I can read and learn to find my way.

But I also want to fight against this evil cult. It doesn't exists lots of places where I can do this in German. I can't discuss very good in English. That is the reason why I post at the German Anti Scientology pages. ...and I do there nothing wrong. ..and it is my right to that. I do that what I want. I don't let me forbid this.

I wrote in the begining, I want to close the book of the things that happen in the last 2 years, but I want to get along with my childhood in Cof$ and what happen because of this childhood. I am the result of Hubbards evil education advices.

I get more and more me. I know more and more what I want. I get more and more self trust.

Nic, please don't be afraid to post whatever you want. I meant nothing sinister in my comment. I had a hard time following what you wrote. That could be me . . . I'd actually like to know more and understand better, but if you want to close this chapter of your life, then do that. Let's move on.

With my comment, I also meant that I have noticed cultural differences between countries that sometimes lead to misunderstandings. Especially with humor, sarcasm, irony. People take offense and get defensive without knowing that was not the intent.

Or maybe I got it all wrong . . . :confused2: That is what I meant by lost in translation. :wave:
 

MrNobody

Who needs merits?
Nic, please don't be afraid to post whatever you want. I meant nothing sinister in my comment. I had a hard time following what you wrote. That could be me . . . I'd actually like to know more and understand better, but if you want to close this chapter of your life, then do that. Let's move on.

With my comment, I also meant that I have noticed cultural differences between countries that sometimes lead to misunderstandings. Especially with humor, sarcasm, irony. People take offense and get defensive without knowing that was not the intent.

Or maybe I got it all wrong . . . :confused2: That is what I meant by lost in translation. :wave:

Hi Lurker5,

If I may chime in here?

Cultural and language differences indeed often lead to misunderstandings, but I don't think Nicole felt offended by what you wrote - she just tried to clarify.

Basically Nicole said that she's had quite a roller coaster ride during the past 2 years or so - between the cult, Anons, OSA, etc. Then, after she thought she had found a new friend and thought things would be a bit calmer and more stable for her, this new friend betrayed and blackmailed her. So it was back to the roller coaster for her. For now, she just wants some peace and wants to enjoy her new-found freedom and her life. That's basically it, as far as I understand it.

If I misrepresented anything, she will surely correct that, when she logs on next time.

What makes her English hard to understand at times, is that she mixes English and German grammar and sentence structures, but that'll get better with time and practice.

So if there's something you didn't understand, just ask, and she'll probably be willing to clarify. I'll help out too, if I can and if necessary.

:cheers:, MrN
 

Smilla

Ordinary Human
In the past I looked at me and I saw that I am scared, it is a deep fear.

I am scared of "Wogs", I am scared of "SPs" and I am scared of Anons. I try to control this fear. I know it is "implant" from Co$ to control me.

It makes me unhappy. :bigcry:

Sometimes I get panic :nervous: and than I react very angry without a big reason.

Sometimes I can control this fear and sometimes not.

eg I have contact to "Non Scientologist", Anons and people here on ESMB who I can trust, but regulary I can't trust. Sometimes I ask the people I trust what to do in special situations, but I can't ask allways people what to do.

My question is, what can I do to control this fear? Has someone here the same problem?:unsure:

The main thing is to treat yourself with exquisite kindness. Treat yourself the way you would treat the person you love most. Do whatever you need to do to feel safe. If others don't understand, do it anyway. Take good care of your body. Eat good food. Get enough sleep. Enjoy some uplifting entertainment - beautiful music and art. Spend time out in the beauty of nature - even if it's just to sit in a nice park. Spend some time being lazy and unproductive without feeling guilty. Play. I have had difficulties with extreme fear in the past, and still do at times. The road is long, but the rewards are real. Life can get better.
 
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Lurker5

Gold Meritorious Patron
Hi Lurker5,

If I may chime in here?

Cultural and language differences indeed often lead to misunderstandings, but I don't think Nicole felt offended by what you wrote - she just tried to clarify.

Basically Nicole said that she's had quite a roller coaster ride during the past 2 years or so - between the cult, Anons, OSA, etc. Then, after she thought she had found a new friend and thought things would be a bit calmer and more stable for her, this new friend betrayed and blackmailed her. So it was back to the roller coaster for her. For now, she just wants some peace and wants to enjoy her new-found freedom and her life. That's basically it, as far as I understand it.

If I misrepresented anything, she will surely correct that, when she logs on next time.

What makes her English hard to understand at times, is that she mixes English and German grammar and sentence structures, but that'll get better with time and practice.

So if there's something you didn't understand, just ask, and she'll probably be willing to clarify. I'll help out too, if I can and if necessary.

:cheers:, MrN

Thank you, MrN, that helps a lot :yes:. Yes, I was aware she was mixing the German/English sentence structures. Most of the time I can follow. I am getting better too. :biggrin: It's that little gap that is left, where so much drops off, or gets misunderstood - so your explanation has helped. :thumbsup:
 

BunnySkull

Silver Meritorious Patron
The only thing I'd like to add is that Nicole needs to accept responsibility for the betrayal and her dishonest actions. It's not some anons "failure" that she decided to do dirty work for the cult. One thing that never helps these situations is if the person doesn't take responsibility for their behavior, blaming others or one's past just becomes a way to excuse the behavior and that usually leads to repeating it.

Being upset with others for not being "anchor" points when they had no clue they had been assigned the role of anchor is absurd. Esp in light of the fact you were dishonest with them from the start.

She's getting a lot of well meaning sympathy here but don't you guys find her org. Post strange? (it's now been changed) She writes about fear and not knowing who to trust yet Nicole was the one not to be trusted, but she doesn't say anything about her recent involvement and work for OSA. She wasnt being very truthful in her OP and makes accusations about others blackmailing her. Now it all seems it boils down to being outed as an OSA tool and a few people being rightfully upset about it and threatening to give evidence about her OSA work to authorities.

I think Nicole needs to get far away from protest and critic groups, ESP away from any exes and anons who need to protect their identity. She needs to get real professional help not obsessively cruise ex-Scio boards grubbing for sympathy and understanding. She wants people here to tell her betraying anons wasn't her fault and let's blame absolutely all of her actions on the evil cult. We are not the ones to forgive her for her betrayal. If she needs that then she should address those who her actions hurt, only they can offer forgiveness. It's fine to be understanding but not to try to release her from responsibility or repercussions of her own decisions. It's having to face the fallout from these types of action that can prevent repeating it in the future.

Obviously Nicole is still quite messed up in the head and the best thing for her to do is get off the computer and get real professional counseling.
 
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MrNobody

Who needs merits?
The only thing I'd like to add is that Nicole needs to accept responsibility for the betrayal and her dishonest actions. It's not some anons "failure" that she decided to do dirty work for the cult. One thing that never helps these situations is if the person doesn't take responsibility for their behavior, blaming others or one's past just becomes a way to excuse the behavior and that usually leads to repeating it.

Being upset with others for not being "anchor" points when they had no clue they had been assigned the role of anchor is absurd. Esp in light of the fact you were dishonest with them from the start.

She's getting a lot of well meaning sympathy here but don't you guys find her org. Post strange? (it's now been changed) She writes about fear and not knowing who to trust yet Nicole was the one not to be trusted, but she doesn't say anything about her recent involvement and work for OSA. She wasnt being very truthful in her OP and makes accusations about others blackmailing her. Now it all seems it boils down to being outed as an OSA tool and a few people being rightfully upset about it and threatening to give evidence about her OSA work to authorities.

I think Nicole needs to get far away from protest and critic groups, ESP away from any exes and anons who need to protect their identity. She needs to get real professional help not obsessively cruise ex-Scio boards grubbing for sympathy and understanding. She wants people here to tell her betraying anons wasn't her fault and let's blame absolutely all of her actions on the evil cult. We are not the ones to forgive her for her betrayal. If she needs that then she should address those who her actions hurt, only they can offer forgiveness. It's fine to be understanding but not to try to release her from responsibility or repercussions of her own decisions. It's having to face the fallout from these types of action that can prevent repeating it in the future.

Obviously Nicole is still quite messed up in the head and the best thing for her to do is get off the computer and get real professional counseling.

BunnySkull, I can see your point, but Nicole has been quite honest here on the board. Maybe these two threads can shine some more light on where she's coming from?

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?21755-Nicole
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?21828-It-s-time-to-tell-my-story...
 

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
The only thing I'd like to add is that Nicole needs to accept responsibility for the betrayal and her dishonest actions. It's not some anons "failure" that she decided to do dirty work for the cult. One thing that never helps these situations is if the person doesn't take responsibility for their behavior, blaming others or one's past just becomes a way to excuse the behavior and that usually leads to repeating it.

Being upset with others for not being "anchor" points when they had no clue they had been assigned the role of anchor is absurd. Esp in light of the fact you were dishonest with them from the start.

She's getting a lot of well meaning sympathy here but don't you guys find her org. Post strange? (it's now been changed) She writes about fear and not knowing who to trust yet Nicole was the one not to be trusted, but she doesn't say anything about her recent involvement and work for OSA. She wasnt being very truthful in her OP and makes accusations about others blackmailing her. Now it all seems it boils down to being outed as an OSA tool and a few people being rightfully upset about it and threatening to give evidence about her OSA work to authorities.

I think Nicole needs to get far away from protest and critic groups, ESP away from any exes and anons who need to protect their identity. She needs to get real professional help not obsessively cruise ex-Scio boards grubbing for sympathy and understanding. She wants people here to tell her betraying anons wasn't her fault and let's blame absolutely all of her actions on the evil cult. We are not the ones to forgive her for her betrayal. If she needs that then she should address those who her actions hurt, only they can offer forgiveness. It's fine to be understanding but not to try to release her from responsibility or repercussions of her own decisions. It's having to face the fallout from these types of action that can prevent repeating it in the future.

Obviously Nicole is still quite messed up in the head and the best thing for her to do is get off the computer and get real professional counseling.

Ich muss vielleicht noch etwas genauer werden, damit begreiflich wird warum ich diesen Thread gestartet habe.

Im Februar hat ein Mann bei mir Hilfe gesucht, er hat angegeben, seine Tochter sei in Scientology, sie sei dort aufgewachsen und er bräuchte Hilfe und Unterstützung um sie rauszuholen. Er hätte auch zu anderen Ex - Scientologen Kontakt, die ihm unterstützen würden, aber da ich nun mal in $cientology aufgewachsen bin und seine Tochter auch, könnte ich ihm vielleicht helfen sie besser zu verstehen. Ich zögerte anfänglich, habe aber gesehen zu welchen Ex - Scientologen er Kontakt hat und meine Zweifel runtergeschluckt. Ich telefonierte mit ihm und ich traf mich mit ihm an einem neutralen Ort. Dieser Mensch nahm dann immer mehr Zeit von mir ein mit Fragen über seine Tochter, Raid Planungen etc und er versuchte immer mehr in mein privates Leben einzudringen, was ich aber ständig abblockte. Ähnliches machte er mit den anderen Ex und Kritikern, er spielte uns gegenseitig aus. So das wir uns anfingen zu streiten. Ein Ex (ein schon länger ausgestiegener und erfahrener Kritiker) hat sich dann mit diesem Mann heftig gestritten. Thema war u.a. ich und meine OSA Vergangenheit... Dieser Mann hat dann teilweise abgeänderten Chats von mir mit ihm an den einen Ex weitergeleitet... auch hat er erzählt, dass er grundsätzlich alle Telefonate und Gespräche aufzeichnet. Daraufhin wurden alle, die mit diesem Mann im Kontakt waren gewarnt. Ich brach den Kontakt daraufhin umgehend ab und verbat mir jeglichen Kontakt. Dieser Mann hatte aber persönliche Dinge von mir, nichts weltbewegendes ein Buch, eine DVD und ein Flyer. Diese drohte er mir in einer Mail an meine Stadtverwaltung zu schicken, da ich aber auch von den veränderten Chats im Vorfeld wusste etc, bekam ich eine kurzzeitige und völlig unlogische Panik.
Auch eine Angst davor, wen ich überhaupt noch trauen kann und wem nicht.

Die andere Sache ist meine OSA Geschichte bei den Anons für die ich die volle Verantwortung übernehme und dies auch immer getan habe. Hätte ich darüber nichts gesagt, hätte dies kein Mensch wirklich gewusst, genauso, wie kein Mensch weiß, ob diese Aktion oben eine OSA Operation war oder ob der Kerl einfach nur durchgedreht ist.

Diese beiden Sachen haben sich hier in diesem Thread vermischt. Sie haben nichts miteinander zu tun. Außer damit, dass der oben genannte sich auch an einige Anons rangemacht hat und diese auch gewarnt wurden.

Was mich einfach nur ein wenig stört... Ich habe alles offen gelegt alles gesagt was ich getan habe und es wird von Seiten der Anons behauptet ich hätte sie verfolgt, dies habe ich defintiv nicht getan und Rheinländer schreibt hier er hätte mit jemanden gesprochen der etwas wußte, ich hätte dies gerne näher erklärt. Denn ich hatte nie persönlichen Kontakt zu der Düsseldorfer Org, so dass mich dort niemand kennen dürfte. Deswegen verstehe ich diese Aussage nicht und ich finde es schade, dass mir nicht darauf geantwortet wird. Denn dies nun offen zu legen, bedeutet auch einen Schutz für Anon, denn diese Person kann nicht die Wahrheit erzählt haben. Rheinländer denk darüber nach... Ich habe euch nun gewarnt!

Ich kann verstehen, dass andere zum Selbstschutz keinen Kontakt mehr mit mir haben möchten. Dies ist einfach so.

Die andere Sache ist die, ob ich psychologische Hilfe in Anspruch nehme oder nicht ist meine absolute private Angelegenheit und ich werde dies nicht in der Öffentlichkeit bekanntgeben.

MrN würdest du dies noch mal übersetzen... Danke :)
 

MrNobody

Who needs merits?
Ich muss vielleicht noch etwas genauer werden, damit begreiflich wird warum ich diesen Thread gestartet habe.

Im Februar hat ein Mann bei mir Hilfe gesucht, er hat angegeben, seine Tochter sei in Scientology, sie sei dort aufgewachsen und er bräuchte Hilfe und Unterstützung um sie rauszuholen. Er hätte auch zu anderen Ex - Scientologen Kontakt, die ihm unterstützen würden, aber da ich nun mal in $cientology aufgewachsen bin und seine Tochter auch, könnte ich ihm vielleicht helfen sie besser zu verstehen. Ich zögerte anfänglich, habe aber gesehen zu welchen Ex - Scientologen er Kontakt hat und meine Zweifel runtergeschluckt. Ich telefonierte mit ihm und ich traf mich mit ihm an einem neutralen Ort. Dieser Mensch nahm dann immer mehr Zeit von mir ein mit Fragen über seine Tochter, Raid Planungen etc und er versuchte immer mehr in mein privates Leben einzudringen, was ich aber ständig abblockte. Ähnliches machte er mit den anderen Ex und Kritikern, er spielte uns gegenseitig aus. So das wir uns anfingen zu streiten. Ein Ex (ein schon länger ausgestiegener und erfahrener Kritiker) hat sich dann mit diesem Mann heftig gestritten. Thema war u.a. ich und meine OSA Vergangenheit... Dieser Mann hat dann teilweise abgeänderten Chats von mir mit ihm an den einen Ex weitergeleitet... auch hat er erzählt, dass er grundsätzlich alle Telefonate und Gespräche aufzeichnet. Daraufhin wurden alle, die mit diesem Mann im Kontakt waren gewarnt. Ich brach den Kontakt daraufhin umgehend ab und verbat mir jeglichen Kontakt. Dieser Mann hatte aber persönliche Dinge von mir, nichts weltbewegendes ein Buch, eine DVD und ein Flyer. Diese drohte er mir in einer Mail an meine Stadtverwaltung zu schicken, da ich aber auch von den veränderten Chats im Vorfeld wusste etc, bekam ich eine kurzzeitige und völlig unlogische Panik.
Auch eine Angst davor, wen ich überhaupt noch trauen kann und wem nicht.

Die andere Sache ist meine OSA Geschichte bei den Anons für die ich die volle Verantwortung übernehme und dies auch immer getan habe. Hätte ich darüber nichts gesagt, hätte dies kein Mensch wirklich gewusst, genauso, wie kein Mensch weiß, ob diese Aktion oben eine OSA Operation war oder ob der Kerl einfach nur durchgedreht ist.

Diese beiden Sachen haben sich hier in diesem Thread vermischt. Sie haben nichts miteinander zu tun. Außer damit, dass der oben genannte sich auch an einige Anons rangemacht hat und diese auch gewarnt wurden.

Was mich einfach nur ein wenig stört... Ich habe alles offen gelegt alles gesagt was ich getan habe und es wird von Seiten der Anons behauptet ich hätte sie verfolgt, dies habe ich defintiv nicht getan und Rheinländer schreibt hier er hätte mit jemanden gesprochen der etwas wußte, ich hätte dies gerne näher erklärt. Denn ich hatte nie persönlichen Kontakt zu der Düsseldorfer Org, so dass mich dort niemand kennen dürfte. Deswegen verstehe ich diese Aussage nicht und ich finde es schade, dass mir nicht darauf geantwortet wird. Denn dies nun offen zu legen, bedeutet auch einen Schutz für Anon, denn diese Person kann nicht die Wahrheit erzählt haben. Rheinländer denk darüber nach... Ich habe euch nun gewarnt!

Ich kann verstehen, dass andere zum Selbstschutz keinen Kontakt mehr mit mir haben möchten. Dies ist einfach so.

Die andere Sache ist die, ob ich psychologische Hilfe in Anspruch nehme oder nicht ist meine absolute private Angelegenheit und ich werde dies nicht in der Öffentlichkeit bekanntgeben.

MrN würdest du dies noch mal übersetzen... Danke :)



Translation: Translator's comments and questions in [green square brackets].

I probably have to be more precise, so that it's understood why I started this thread.

In February, a man had asked me for help. His daughter allegedly was in Scientology, she grew up there and he'd need help and support to get her out
He allegedly also had contacts to other Ex-Scientologists. who would support him, but since I've grown up up in Scientology. just like his daughter did, I could probably better help him to understand her. At 1st I hesitated, but after I had seen with which Ex-Scientologists he's been contact with, I suppressed my doubts. I had phone conversation(s) with him and met him at a neutral location. This person took up more and more of my time - asking more and more questions about his daughter, raid plannings. etc. and he tried to invade my private life more and more, which I was constantly blocking. He did similar stuff to the other Exes and critics, playing each one of us against the others, so thast we began to fight. One Ex (who's been out for a long time and who was an experienced critic) then had a very aggressive discussion with this guy. Topic was, amongst other stuff, I and my OSA-past...

Then this man forwarded partially altered Chat-logs between me and him to this one Ex... He also told that he basically always records ach and every phone conversation

Thereafter, everyone who's been in contact with this man, has been warned [by whom?] I canceled the contact immediately afterwards and made it clear that no further contact was desired.

But this man still had some of my personal stuff. nothing serious, a book, a DVD and a flyer. He threatened to send this stuff to my town's governmental office, [AFAIK a current or former employer of Nicole] but since I already knew about the altered chat logs etc, I got into into a totally illogical short-term-panic attack.

I also suffered of angst, since I didn't know anymore whom to trust and whom not to trust.

The other thing is my OSA-story with the Anons, for which I'm taking full responsibility, which is what I always did. Hadn't I told anything about it, no one had ever known about it, just like no one knows whether the situation described above had been an OSA-OP or whether this guy is just crazy.

These twlo things got mixed up in this thread, but they're totally unrelated. Except the fact that this guy also had contacted some Anons and that these had also

What's disturbing me just a bit ... I've laid it all out in the open and I've told what I had done, and now the Anons say I had followed them, which I definitely didn't do, and Rheinländer writes he had talked to someone who knew something; I'd like to have a more in-depth explanation about that. Because I never had any personal contact to the Düsseldorf Org, so that nobody there could have known me.

That's why I don't understand this statement and it's sad that I don't get any answers for that one. Because putting it all put in the open now, is also a protection for Anonymous, since this person cannot have told the truth. Rheinländer , just think about it, you are now warned

I can understand that others don't want to have further contact with me, for reasons of self-protection. That's just that.

The next thing is: Whether I make use of psychological help or not, is absolutely my private concern, and I will not announce it publicly

End of Translation
 

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
Translation: Translator's comments and questions in [green square brackets].

Thereafter, everyone who's been in contact with this man, has been warned [by whom?] I canceled the contact immediately afterwards and made it clear that no further contact was desired.
They got warned by the long time gone Ex Scientologist and critic. I don't know, if he wants that I tell his name.

But this man still had some of my personal stuff. nothing serious, a book, a DVD and a flyer. He threatened to send this stuff to my town's governmental office, [AFAIK a current or former employer of Nicole] but since I already knew about the altered chat logs etc, I got into into a totally illogical short-term-panic attack.
A former employer. I wasn't there as OSA. I never spoke with the blackmailing man about this work...


Thanks MrN! :)
 

Markus

Silver Meritorious Patron
Translation: Translator's comments and questions in [green square brackets].

I probably have to be more precise, so that it's understood why I started this thread.

In February, a man had asked me for help. His daughter allegedly was in Scientology, she grew up there and he'd need help and support to get her out
He allegedly also had contacts to other Ex-Scientologists. who would support him, but since I've grown up up in Scientology. just like his daughter did, I could probably better help him to understand her. At 1st I hesitated, but after I had seen with which Ex-Scientologists he's been contact with, I suppressed my doubts. I had phone conversation(s) with him and met him at a neutral location. This person took up more and more of my time - asking more and more questions about his daughter, raid plannings. etc. and he tried to invade my private life more and more, which I was constantly blocking. He did similar stuff to the other Exes and critics, playing each one of us against the others, so thast we began to fight. One Ex (who's been out for a long time and who was an experienced critic) then had a very aggressive discussion with this guy. Topic was, amongst other stuff, I and my OSA-past...

Then this man forwarded partially altered Chat-logs between me and him to this one Ex... He also told that he basically always records ach and every phone conversation

Thereafter, everyone who's been in contact with this man, has been warned [by whom?] I canceled the contact immediately afterwards and made it clear that no further contact was desired.

But this man still had some of my personal stuff. nothing serious, a book, a DVD and a flyer. He threatened to send this stuff to my town's governmental office, [AFAIK a current or former employer of Nicole] but since I already knew about the altered chat logs etc, I got into into a totally illogical short-term-panic attack.

I also suffered of angst, since I didn't know anymore whom to trust and whom not to trust.

The other thing is my OSA-story with the Anons, for which I'm taking full responsibility, which is what I always did. Hadn't I told anything about it, no one had ever known about it, just like no one knows whether the situation described above had been an OSA-OP or whether this guy is just crazy.

These twlo things got mixed up in this thread, but they're totally unrelated. Except the fact that this guy also had contacted some Anons and that these had also

What's disturbing me just a bit ... I've laid it all out in the open and I've told what I had done, and now the Anons say I had followed them, which I definitely didn't do, and Rheinländer writes he had talked to someone who knew something; I'd like to have a more in-depth explanation about that. Because I never had any personal contact to the Düsseldorf Org, so that nobody there could have known me.

That's why I don't understand this statement and it's sad that I don't get any answers for that one. Because putting it all put in the open now, is also a protection for Anonymous, since this person cannot have told the truth. Rheinländer , just think about it, you are now warned

I can understand that others don't want to have further contact with me, for reasons of self-protection. That's just that.

The next thing is: Whether I make use of psychological help or not, is absolutely my private concern, and I will not announce it publicly

End of Translation

Well - now I'm getting interested - very interested indeed.
Especially this: "...,since this person cannot have told the truth." May you please PM me why you are so sure that this person is not telling the truth.

And please tell me in detail about what exactly he is not telling the truth.

Thank you Nicole
Love
Markus
 

morizo

Patron
Translation: Translator's comments and questions in [green square brackets].

I probably have to be more precise, so that it's understood why I started this thread.

In February, a man had asked me for help. His daughter allegedly was in Scientology, she grew up there and he'd need help and support to get her out
He allegedly also had contacts to other Ex-Scientologists. who would support him, but since I've grown up up in Scientology. just like his daughter did, I could probably better help him to understand her. At 1st I hesitated, but after I had seen with which Ex-Scientologists he's been contact with, I suppressed my doubts. I had phone conversation(s) with him and met him at a neutral location. This person took up more and more of my time - asking more and more questions about his daughter, raid plannings. etc. and he tried to invade my private life more and more, which I was constantly blocking. He did similar stuff to the other Exes and critics, playing each one of us against the others, so thast we began to fight. One Ex (who's been out for a long time and who was an experienced critic) then had a very aggressive discussion with this guy. Topic was, amongst other stuff, I and my OSA-past...

Then this man forwarded partially altered Chat-logs between me and him to this one Ex... He also told that he basically always records ach and every phone conversation

Thereafter, everyone who's been in contact with this man, has been warned [by whom?] I canceled the contact immediately afterwards and made it clear that no further contact was desired.

But this man still had some of my personal stuff. nothing serious, a book, a DVD and a flyer. He threatened to send this stuff to my town's governmental office, [AFAIK a current or former employer of Nicole] but since I already knew about the altered chat logs etc, I got into into a totally illogical short-term-panic attack.

I also suffered of angst, since I didn't know anymore whom to trust and whom not to trust.

The other thing is my OSA-story with the Anons, for which I'm taking full responsibility, which is what I always did. Hadn't I told anything about it, no one had ever known about it, just like no one knows whether the situation described above had been an OSA-OP or whether this guy is just crazy.

These twlo things got mixed up in this thread, but they're totally unrelated. Except the fact that this guy also had contacted some Anons and that these had also

What's disturbing me just a bit ... I've laid it all out in the open and I've told what I had done, and now the Anons say I had followed them, which I definitely didn't do, and Rheinländer writes he had talked to someone who knew something; I'd like to have a more in-depth explanation about that. Because I never had any personal contact to the Düsseldorf Org, so that nobody there could have known me.

That's why I don't understand this statement and it's sad that I don't get any answers for that one. Because putting it all put in the open now, is also a protection for Anonymous, since this person cannot have told the truth. Rheinländer , just think about it, you are now warned

I can understand that others don't want to have further contact with me, for reasons of self-protection. That's just that.

The next thing is: Whether I make use of psychological help or not, is absolutely my private concern, and I will not announce it publicly

End of Translation

Are you suggesting that an OSA spy was spied on by an OSA spy while spying on Anons or had you blown by that point of time yet and the OSA spy was spying on you as ex-OSA spy, trying to 3P you? I really don't understand your story because there seem to be contradictions and/or omissions and once they are pointed out there's always another bunny hopping out of the top hat.

I think people want to help by asking you to get professional psychological assistance because they want to be sure you get healed so you don't blame or spy on people who help you anymore and so you feel better. And it would be a relief to know you are getting this psychiatric or psychological assistance. Most of the things you discussed on this board are very personal even of a nature that would be subject to a psychiatric therapy. AFAIK no one has asked IF you are getting treated, but suggested you to do so.

One more thing: You as OSA were stalking the german wwp mod until he urgently asked you to leave the board and to never contact him anymore, right? We had some wwp links about it here.

Now you write that the exact same thing you did to the German wwp mod has happened to you. You must be kidding.

Were you doing it first to Rheini and the other guy who can't be trusted (do you mean OSA right?) afterwards to you or had he done it first to you and you then did it to Rheini? :confused2:

Never mind. I asked Emma to cancel my membership here. I really am not patient enough.
 
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