My story

[Terril park]

This is very interesting Whatever. Many in the Freezone got stopped at clear on the bridge. Especially those natural clear. I know of one who was refused OT levels, despite being class VI. He later cogged it was probably because he'd run upper level type data earlier on the bridge. Most get handled easily in the Freezone

http://www.freewebs.com/techoutsidethecofs

http://internationalfreezone.net

 

[The Oracle]

Thank you so much for taking me on the adventures of such a colorful life!

I simply could not pull myself away from the monitor!

You are simply an extraordinary person!

You will find the benfits from all of it rolling out before you like a red carpet!

You certainly have talents, skills and insight far beyond the average person.

You are extremely valuable!

All the best and Bravo!



T.I.

 

[ron's hat]

.....He later cogged it was probably because...

I hope you excuse me if I ask a simple question............but how does somebody 'cog' on something that was 'probably'? Could you please explain what a cognition is? And if it means that you become aware of something that 'probably' is...well, what's the difference between a cognition and a guess?

 

[Bea Kiddo]

Part XVI

Ok, this is pretty close to the end here.

Having been in the RPF a number of times and hating the RPF, being way overaudited on FPRD, not even on my own track, evaluations up the kazoo, constant ethics handlings, constant fixing of ME, instead of the groups abberation, I was pretty much frustrated, fed up and did not care. And yet I continued to pretend that I was part of the group and doing my job to Clear the planet. Yep, I pretended all the way to security, my Comm Ev and all the way to getting out the door. My mother thinks I will do A to E. But, after a break from Scn and reflections, I don't think that is something I will do anytime soon.

(I was about to submit this part and remembered another important part to this story which I had not mentioned yet, so it is interjected here One of the auditors at ASHO, named Cathy, was a Class VI Intern who was having a lot of trouble with everything: her pc's, her life, her family, her internship, everything was really a mess. And she was not taking the time to sort them out and was just trying to kinda get through each day. Then one day IAS regged her for 50,000, which she donated. Soon after that, who knows if it is related, she blew in her car and was driving all over. She was recovered (I dont recall how) and the folder sent to me and the Senior C/S to figure out what to do with her. When we looked through all the info, it turned out she was majorly introspected and ......... yep - you guessed it. The big ol' rundown for her too!!! Introspection RD. (I wonder, was it what I needed and that was why everyone else was getting it? No. Not really, but why were there so many, huh?). So I ended up C/Sing it and someone else was auditing it. I never saw the outcome of it because I got busted before she finished.


So, somewhere in there, I got into a several day fling with another staff member. One of the really big problems with that from the church standpoint was that it was a person of the same sex as me. We did not even go very far or do much, just enough to get me in a lot of hot water. I don't even have those tendencies, never did and only did it to get out. (I guess I decided to just say it here because if anything ever did come up from them about me, it would be this. Because that is all there is. But I think a point the Illusioness made on another thread about RFW and how they offend people they don't even know would be the same here on this. Putting this thing I did as a bad thing could make THEM look bad in the eyes of alot of people that are now accepting this type of thing). And anyways, I have been in a relationship with a member of the opposite sex (same person) for over 2 years now.

Anyways, this thing happened and I did not come clean on it. And the other person supposedly tried to kill themselves (not true) and then put under watch and they assigned me to audit them. I should have refused. But I audited her and never mentioned anything about the truth, and she was offloaded quickly. So then several months later it all came out, because they couldnt hold it in anymore and it was reported.

And so security called me and wanted me to go down to security for a talk and that was the begining of the end. Cool. I was under 24 hour watch and on decks for like 3 months (because I had to get a Comm Ev and sec check and its hard to find auditors for OT's, and things like that). So I got declared by Comm Ev for that and then got a sec check and left.

------------------------------------

I did get to talk to my mom a number of times through all of that and we had some good talks. She helped me financially because she bought my meter from me, which gave me more money to start out with. She also really wanted me to do my A to E and return to lines. She told me she loves me, and we hugged and I left. She knew where I was going. We talked about it, looked at it on a map and everything. (I have since moved though so she does not know where I am).

Unfortunately, she has never mentioned me to family or checked on me at all. I dont know if this is her own doing, or the church.

------------------------------------

Meanwhile, I was sent to live with a couple other people who were declared who were willing to help out. I could not stay there long because the guy was (and still is) obsessed with me. He has some weird ideas about me stalking him spiritually. I am about ready to get a restraining order from him.

-------------------------------------

Meanwhile, I went to a reunion of my family, which I had never been to. People were so glad to see me there. They were also suprized that I was allowed to go. I had a nice long conversation with my grandparents. My grandfather was concerned that I would be going back into the church and didnt want that. I was suprized to find out really how anti-Scn my grandparents are. They never would say stuff to me when I was in, but when I got out, and they knew I was really out, they laid out how they really felt, about the years of frustration, about the embarrassment of their daughter, who they tolerate now, but barely speak to. It's a sad, sad situation.

And I get vacation time at work, paid. And I have already made time to see them several times and they love that. They are so suprized that I am able to visit so much. More than ever in my life.

I can't say my life is awesome or anything. Because there are downfalls. My mother, who I will probably never see, my father, who is declared and is not responding to letters or phone calls and I dont know why. My brother, who is still connected to my mom and Scn, so I can't talk to him either.

-----------------------------

Another conversation with my mom was the "PR" story to tell my grandparents. I was to tell them what happened and that I have to fix things. But she even told me when they passed, send flowers, dont go to the funeral because she was going to be there. I agreed at the time.

-----------------------------
So that is basically it. Part II was left out and still is at this point. It is a very hard one for me. I may post it later. And also, copying Mate, there will be reflections I am sure. Lots of things to add, with having been in for so long.

Phew. Hope it was a good read, I kept you entertained, and you have learned what it is like being raised in the Sea Org. And, in my mind, I never got a chance to chose if I wanted to be there or not. I guess I assumed it was my only choice. I was afraid of WOGS, afraid of having to find a job (before I joined, not after. After I left I was not concerned about it at all).

Send in questions or input. And peace to you all.

 

[Terril park]

I've found your story fascinating and hope you write part 2 sometime.

Something I've observed is that those who made it to the high levels of training you have are very smart and able. And I'm referring to before the training. I'm curious as to whether many kids raised in the SO achieved
what you did. I've certainly never seen any post publicly that they had.

How many others were receiving introspection rundowns?

You ever want to audit and C/S in the Freezone let me know.

http://www.freewebs.com/techoutsidethecofs

http://internationalfreezone.net

 

[popsweetland]

Ok, this is pretty close to the end here.

<snip>

-----------------------------
So that is basically it. Part II was left out and still is at this point. It is a very hard one for me. I may post it later. And also, copying Mate, there will be reflections I am sure. Lots of things to add, with having been in for so long.

Phew. Hope it was a good read, I kept you entertained, and you have learned what it is like being raised in the Sea Org. And, in my mind, I never got a chance to chose if I wanted to be there or not. I guess I assumed it was my only choice. I was afraid of WOGS, afraid of having to find a job (before I joined, not after. After I left I was not concerned about it at all).

Send in questions or input. And peace to you all.

Dear Whatever -

Thank you, for having the strength, courage, and integrity to post this gut wrenching odyssey. It is enlightening and inspiring to me and I am sure to numerous others who do not post.

"And, in my mind, I never got a chance to chose if I wanted to be there or not." This was not only "in your mind" this was in the real world, "YOU WERE NEVER GIVEN A CHANCE TO CHOOSE". You were born into a highly manipulative and controling cult that actually became worse after the demise of Hubbard. I do NOT condone what it was while Hubbard was alive, but it got worse far worse after his death.

Fluffy (Claire) said in a post a few weeks ago, "this is not the 'ology' I signed up for." The current COS is not the 'ology' that ANY of us signed up for, but you were never even given the chance to "sign up" (or not) for anything. At least most of us get the chance to examine our lives at the time we made the decison to "join" and to examine what we "thought" we were joining and why we were joining it.

You are an inspiration to those of us finding finding our own way out of Hubbard's "huge and complex labyrinth". He created a sophistry that contains some powerful truths but contains many more lies, half-truths, acceptable truths, logical traps, and extensive and deep mental manipulation. His heir (David Miscavige - the TTK- "temper tantrum kid")
has corrupted the best of it and strengthened the worst of it.

Thank you, and I look forward to Part II if and when the time is right for you.

Best regards -

Popsweetland

 

[freet43]

Thank you for sharing your story, Whatever. I greatly appreciate that you've been so honest and open, and it means a lot to me.

I had no idea the extent of the trauma that those raised in the SO went through, and it is extremely valuable for me to get that understanding. I'll explain why.

My story is somewhat different from many on this forum, in that I left 28 years ago and I personally did not live through the stuff that many others on this forum have.

I left when I could not reconcile what I saw the organization becoming. It was difficult to do, as I am still a firm supporter of the tech and my days on staff were some of the best days of my life. And, I've lived a very full and successful life - before and after my years in Scn.

In addition to the crap and criminality that I was becoming aware of, I really wanted to "have a life". I wanted time to have a family.

I saw at FSO how families had 1 hour of time together per day., and I later heard that even that was not guaranteed. I saw at our mission, how even the top execs had a difficult time raising children, with the hours that were required, and how children were being raised by nannies. I knew I couldn't do it - I wanted to raise my children myself.

After I left, I married someone who had never been in and had 2 sons. Although my husband was aware of my time on staff, after a certain point in time we never discussed Scn at all. Ever. I had left that life behind, and focused on my studies, family and later work.

I had made a conscious decision NOT to raise my children as Scn and had thought that as they got older, and could have a choice, that I may bring it up then.

I did not want to force any religion on them and I wanted them to have a normal life. I wanted them to be able to make their own choices (I thought children in Scn did not have a normal life, much like children of other organized religions). They were brought up a-religious, as I certainly did not align with any mainstream religions. And, their father had defected from a country where the official religion was atheism.

I also no longer trusted the Scn. organization. I wanted my children to have an education and the opportunity to support themselves, without being dependent on the whims of those in charge of Scn. organizations. Too many good people were getting declared, and I saw the criminality escalate.

Now, I did apply the tech throughout the time I have been out.

Knowing who I am, and the workability of the tech was never a consideration.

I know that reality is not shared with many on this forum, but that is my reality.

It worked for me, and my pcs, and many people I knew and know, and it had a lot to do with why I am who I am today and I will not deny that.

So my sons never knew anything about Scn, or that I had been on staff. At the same time, I also applied much of what I learned in living my life and raising my sons.

I could give many examples, but that's not the focus of this post. There were a lot of wins raising young children, which I attribute to the tech, and if anyone is interested I may share later.

Everything went well, until they entered the tough teenage years and their dad was out of the picture.

A father is extremely important to sons especially.

I had worked my way up to a demanding management position with significant time committments, and I also was not spending the time that I should have with my sons, when it was the most important time of their lives.

My sons were starting to question who and what they were, and trying to figure life out, wondering what their purpose is, etc. They were searching and experimenting, as many of us did in those years. Despite my best efforts to teach them about drugs, they both got heavily involved and their lives took a drastic turn for the worse.

They needed help, and I was not the one to help them, and for many reasons, I also am not a fan of psychology or psychiatrists, but I was willing to look and talk to some to see if they could help my sons.

I was not able to find anyone that I could agree with, so then I took a look again at Scn.

But, the more I looked, the more I saw the ugliness that the organization had become.

(My views on psychs is a whole 'nother story, and was formed prior to getting into Scn. - I can share that at some point also. I addressed some of that previously, but there is lots more).

I then found the FZ - I even found someone who is a psychologist as well as a FZoner .

By this time, my sons had watched South Park, and that, and the crazy stuff the church was doing is their impression of Scn. They did their own research of all the grimy details of people who died and what good people were put through.

They are not willing to look at the tech or get the help I know they would get through the FZ.

So, I have had major regrets about keeping Scn from them while they were growing up.

I've thought that at least they would likely not have done drugs.

Your story, Whatever, helps me see the other side.

What my sons could have been subjected to.

There is also the other side of those that raised their children as Scn, only to have their children be forced to disconnect from them. Those are some of the most destructive actions that the church has ever done, in my opinion.

Yes, the organization is so corrupt, that my sons could possibly be worse off if I'd gotten them involved earlier.

Or they could have been forced to disconnect from me, as I have always been one to speak out about injustices.

Now, I'm not saying that you are worse off, Whatever - only you would know that.

What I see, is that you have lived through a lot, but that you've got your act together. I can tell you are a wonderful person and I wish you all the best.

Thank you so much, Whatever.

 

[The Oracle]

Dear Whatever,

Thanks for sharing. I can assure you nobody out here thinks the less of you for for the guilt trips run on you in the Church for such ordinary explorations.

You are very big to be so forgiving of your mother for her hat dump on being a parent, her inability to care about her child, and for her treason.

As it is, one is supposed to climb over the backs of their parents to forward civilization in a better way.

Often when we have surpassed them and cannot idolize them anymore, we fall into a disgust looking back.

That is the time when we have to go back, lift them up, and carry them on our backs for a while whether we survived in spite of them, or because of them.

I hope for your sake you can keep on walking and not look back.

 

[Bea Kiddo]

Thanks guys - you all brought tears to my eyes (in a good way).

Reflections are next.... (part II is gonna have to wait. It is rough for me to tell, and could have ramifications).

---------------

When I was really young, in the CEO, there were a few things that happened that I remembered:

We all used to take showers together in a big room. They never had enough towels and so we would have to run around inside the shower room, wall to wall, to dry ourselves off.

I remember when I was 5 a bunch of kids came up to me and told me that two kids were going to try to have sex and we were all going to go watch. We all cramped into this tiny bathroom (right nest to the reception desk, actually, I wonder why they didn't notice). Well, they got naked and tried but it didnt go anywhere. Ha ha.

-----------

I was playing around jumping on a bed with Seth Price and I ended up hitting my head (I was about 7) and made a big gash on my head. I do not remember it hurting, but I remember being really upset because I was getting blood all over my favorite outfit. They took me to see Dr. Shields to get fixed up. I was protesting the whole way. I was telling her that it was illegal and she could not touch me without my mom. She told me to stay calm and she was trying to sew up my head. I was moving all around. I remember thinking that I needed a new tactic, because she was not going away. I told her that it was past my bedtime and I had to go. I tried to get up again, and my mom came over (she had just showed up, having been on post and not around when I got injured) and told me to hold still. I was mad at her for siding with the docotor. I thought she should just take me right out of there (when I found out I was getting stiches, wow, I was so excited!!! Everybody else had them, now I had them!! So cool!).

------------------

Able Schwartz was another kid around that time who was very out of control. I remember one time he poured gas all around the bed of Sammy Garcia and then lit it on fire, with her in it. We were all standing around watching the flames, trying to see if she was going to wake up. All the sudden we saw a fire man coming up the stairs! We were so excited to see a fireman (this poor girl could have been killed!) and then we found out it was Terry Hammy (our nanny) and we were all like "AWWW, MAN!!! Its only Terry". Poor guy. He was alirght.

And another time Able found a beebee gun or something and went to the roof of the big blue and started shooting the pigeons up there (I think by then, he was posted as an exterminator, because the post fit him well, I guess).

Another time, when he was still a kid, he put a firecracker up the rear of a cat and killed it. That made me cry. I wondered why this kid was allowed to do all that.

------------------

(all this stuff in this reflections section is from the 70's)

I barely remember the Melrose building. That was where everyone lived originally. I do remember the yard there and playing in it. Then after that, we moved to the complex (which was white at that time). Then they acquired the Fountain building (which is right across the street from the complex, next to the parking garage that they have). I remember when we got that other building, which was called the ATA (Apollo training academy - was for schooling for kids and also for mid aged kid/teens to grow up. The CEO was for the baby's and toddlers). It was raining that first day we moved over there. And they had a cool fire engine shaped jungle gym thing that we could play on in the back. Cool.

--------------------

One time my brother and I decided to get pigeon eggs from the roof of the fountain building. (Well, its not really the roof - it is under the roof, but above the ceilings in the apartments). So we went down to check it out and he ended up falling through the roof into the room of our friends the Wrights (or Walzers): Chin Dao, Mettayya, Sayadina, Dharma and the later on Lahai (I dont know how to spell). They were all eating dinner at home (which, come to think of it, we never did) and we landed right there!

Well, Mettayya was my age and we were friends. I kept in touch with her until the late 80's. She was working as a receptionist at a mission in Florida, but then she got married to someone and totally switched religions and was long gone out of Scn.

---------------------

It's interesting to me to remember some of these names of people from way back when. There are more that I grew up with, in different time periods, but come to mind here, if anyone knows them: Cassavius Tabayoyan, Kim Fries, Sandy Fries, David and Andrew Harris, Bill and Suzanne Feeley, Jennifer and Justine Lipton, Suzanne Reynolds (Wendels step kid I think), Mettayya and that whole gang of sisters. Brings back feelings of the better times.

More reflections later.

 

[Mick Wenlock]

Ok, this is pretty close to the end here.

Having been in the RPF a number of times and hating the RPF, being way overaudited on FPRD, not even on my own track, evaluations up the kazoo, constant ethics handlings, constant fixing of ME, instead of the groups abberation, I was pretty much frustrated, fed up and did not care. And yet I continued to pretend that I was part of the group and doing my job to Clear the planet. Yep, I pretended all the way to security, my Comm Ev and all the way to getting out the door. My mother thinks I will do A to E. But, after a break from Scn and reflections, I don't think that is something I will do anytime soon.

The further 'out' we get, the less likely it is that we will return.

So, somewhere in there, I got into a several day fling with another staff member. One of the really big problems with that from the church standpoint was that it was a person of the same sex as me. We did not even go very far or do much, just enough to get me in a lot of hot water. I don't even have those tendencies, never did and only did it to get out. (I guess I decided to just say it here because if anything ever did come up from them about me, it would be this. Because that is all there is. But I think a point the Illusioness made on another thread about RFW and how they offend people they don't even know would be the same here on this. Putting this thing I did as a bad thing could make THEM look bad in the eyes of alot of people that are now accepting this type of thing). And anyways, I have been in a relationship with a member of the opposite sex (same person) for over 2 years now.

The only people that care about this are the OSA twits. One of the hard things I found after getting out was that this smearing DA crap is actually powerless in the extreme.

Meanwhile, I was sent to live with a couple other people who were declared who were willing to help out. I could not stay there long because the guy was (and still is) obsessed with me. He has some weird ideas about me stalking him spiritually. I am about ready to get a restraining order from him.

If he is anywhere near you geographically then get the restraining order - and enforce it.

Meanwhile, I went to a reunion of my family, which I had never been to. People were so glad to see me there. They were also suprized that I was allowed to go. I had a nice long conversation with my grandparents. My grandfather was concerned that I would be going back into the church and didnt want that. I was suprized to find out really how anti-Scn my grandparents are. They never would say stuff to me when I was in, but when I got out, and they knew I was really out, they laid out how they really felt, about the years of frustration, about the embarrassment of their daughter, who they tolerate now, but barely speak to. It's a sad, sad situation.

after we got out my wife was very suprised to find out how much her father (and other family members) disliked and mistrusted Scientology and were very unhappy that she was in it.

Being in the SO one loses track of a social skill called being polite I think. I mean they we are wandering around telling out little lies about how we are doing, how much we earn, why we cant make it home for funerals, christmas, weddings etc and we assume that because our family don't rip our faces off that they approve. Nope, they are trying very hard to be polite.

I can't say my life is awesome or anything. Because there are downfalls. My mother, who I will probably never see, my father, who is declared and is not responding to letters or phone calls and I dont know why. My brother, who is still connected to my mom and Scn, so I can't talk to him either.

A great example of how Scientology and the Sea Org lay waste to families.

Another conversation with my mom was the "PR" story to tell my grandparents. I was to tell them what happened and that I have to fix things. But she even told me when they passed, send flowers, dont go to the funeral because she was going to be there. I agreed at the time.

This was the part that got me to respond.

This is my opinion and advice only - others may think waaay dfferently.

Don't EVER allow Scientology or Scientologists to tell you how to behave or what to do merely to accommodate them and their insane beliefs.

For a couple of years after I was out and when I was first on the net (Dennis may remember..) I was pretty diffident and careful about telling someone who was a Scientologist that I was declared and that they should not be talking to me. Then I started to get a clue (slowly) that this was a truly nutty way to do things.

I do not care what Scientology and Scientologists believe, I do not care what restrictions or weird taboos they place on themselves. If my being somewhere or talking or posting makes them unable to be there, talk or write - that's their problem, not mine.

AS for your mother's admonition about your grandparents funeral - do what you wish to do. Your mom is free to do the same.

Great story whatever - thanks for sharing it.

 

[Alanzo]

Mick wrote:

I do not care what Scientology and Scientologists believe, I do not care what restrictions or weird taboos they place on themselves. If my being somewhere or talking or posting makes them unable to be there, talk or write - that's their problem, not mine.

This is an interesting point.

Scientology, with its glue-like definition of "RESPONSIBILITY" and its emphasis on CONTROL and ETHICS, tends to make a person what the psychs call "co-dependent".

It's a very important concept to learn, although it can be difficult to sometimes find a straight definition for it. The best I could come up with was "trying to control others for fear of the consequences of their actions".

Note it says THEIR actions.

In Scientologese, it could be stated "Misownership of problems", or trying to solve problems of which you are not the source.

I agree fully with Mick: if you believe you should attend a funeral because you believe you should, then you should. Other peoples' problems are their own.

One of the benefits of leaving Scientology is no longer being under its insane and destructive control.

Make sure you reap ALL of those benefits for yourself.

Alanzo

 

[krsanna]

You mention on page 11 Able Schwartz, a kid my son played with when I was in the Sea Org. I remember when Able set the room on fire and killed a cat with a firecracker. I have a horror story about Able that was never talked about, because I handled the situation directly as a result of a guardian angel deal. However, my son did cut school with Able for 1 entire semester in the 2nd grade. By that time the kids had been put in a public school, and the school did not bother to let me know my son had skipped classes for several months. I went ballistic and eventually got my son assessed at Applied Scholastics and tutored, so he did well in school overall.

You may have known my son, who was also 2nd generation Scientologist. My son went to the ATA when he was 6 then went to the public school. He was a wiz on the games at New York George's and the waitresses liked him. In retrospect I realize that the public school where the Sea Org kids attended had a load of problems, because of the kids from the neighborhood plus the Sea Org kids. LA schools in general had a head lice problem, probably, in part, because the warm temperature was a good breeding ground. My son had head lice several times at a suburban school (San Fernando Valley).

I routed out of the Sea Org in 1982 and left Scientology in 1984. I was one of the early "ex's" who did a protest march around the complex until the FBO came out with a checkbook and refunded money. By that time, I had learned that LRH had sold his name and copyrights to the RTC in 1982 and I had seen Miscavige at work first hand. The 2D situation in the Sea Org was one reason I decided to leave, and it wasn't just the kids. It was the view of the 2D in general, often as a convenience so staff could be more effective in the org without being distracted by the 2D.

I'm glad things are going better for you now. Please feel free to PM me if you would like.

Krsanna

 

[Bea Kiddo]

adding on to 88 - 89 era

More reflections here. In 88 - 89 I was holding reception for the PAC Gold Office. I was a kid and did not know much about Scn or anything, but a few things occured there that I would like to mention.

-------

One thing was that we were still playing event videos that had Vicky Aznaran in them. This would have been late 88. I am not sure when the change over occured (with COB). But I remember one public watching the video and deciding to join the Sea Org because there were so many hot chicks in the Sea Org. (Now there's the right purpose, ha ha). He thought VA was one of the hot ones.

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There was no line set up properly for the e-meter recertification line. Our office was a recruit office and an Int Readiness Unit (with Maggie Denton and Mike Gilcrest as auditors, and I think Tom Pope and William Carey as recruiters). So public would try to drop off meters and I would take them and send them uplines. They sent them back to me and told me that it was not a proper line and the public had to mail them in, or give them to Bridge. Bridge doesnt and never did handle meters. So there was a big dispute, meanwhile the public getting pissed because they would not let me accept them, though I was perfectly willing to do it. This went on for months.

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Another common thing would be people calling in asking for directions to the Hemet location. I was not cleared and did not have a clue where it is. These would be truck drivers making deliveries and so forth. So then I would have to get one of the Int Cleared people onto the phone with them to give directions.

----------

One time the parents of someone uplines showed up there and started a whole thing about that they were not leaving until they saw their son. Well, there son was uplines. She was really upset because I would not give her any information, plus I had none to give! She was a wog and I hadn't the slighest idea what to say. So then someone Int Cleared called uplines and got the son on the phone and they talked. She was fine. After she came up to me and asked me why I didnt just tell her that her son was in Canyon Country (I dont even know where that is now).

-------------

Wendel was the CO Gold for a stint there and he asked that I stay with his daughter in an apartment a couple of blocks off the base. They suspected she had been molested or something and they wanted a female around her so she would feel safe. So I stayed there for 6 months or so, while her parents were away.

-------------

When I was WAY younger (just remembered this) - maybe this was early 80's or so, if anyone knows the date better, please help. I am not good with dates. I ended up babysitting the child of Aurthur Hubbards wife. It was not his child, but he was married to someone who had a kid. They lived on the 8th floor of Lebenon Hall - they had the entire floor made into a penthouse for him, with a balcony and all. It was pretty nice actually. The kid was alright. He had a tarantula in a cage and he taught me that they are not deadly and you could actually play with them, which we did on many occasions (maybe that is why I like spiders and I have never been afraid of them).

---------------

During this time Peter Schless was recruited for the Sea Org. I remember it because someone mentioned to me that he had taken LSD, but his approval to join the SO was overridden by his recruiter (hint, short, blond, bossy, took over running a religion) and he went through his EPF in like a week and his clearances in 24 hours and he was whisked away uplines.

There was a heavy push on musicians going uplines right in this time period, and I dont remember the names of them all, but they were all whisked uplines in very short order right in that same time period with Peter. Some of them are still there.

Right around this time, Ray Mithoff and his wife came through for Clearances too from Flag. They were whisked away in a day or two.

----------

These were all just things I saw - but in my own life, I was just answering phones, reading novels on post time (yep!), ditching study time, leaving early from post and practicing dancing. There was a whole group of us that were dancing and we actually did several performances in that time period.

(if anything seems confusing or doesnt make sense, feel free to ask me and I will try to clarify. My dates are jumbled up in the story a bit, cause I jump around in time, sorry about that!)

 

[Div6]

Whatever,

Thanks for your recollections. I was on staff during the early part of your career, in a Cl V org. It is fascinating to get the R factor from a 2nd Gen So person. Keep em coming!

 

[Lulu Belle]

When I was WAY younger (just remembered this) - maybe this was early 80's or so, if anyone knows the date better, please help. I am not good with dates. I ended up babysitting the child of Aurthur Hubbards wife. It was not his child, but he was married to someone who had a kid. They lived on the 8th floor of Lebenon Hall - they had the entire floor made into a penthouse for him, with a balcony and all. It was pretty nice actually. The kid was alright. He had a tarantula in a cage and he taught me that they are not deadly and you could actually play with them, which we did on many occasions (maybe that is why I like spiders and I have never been afraid of them!)

Arthur's wife at that time name was Lori. She was French. They were married around 1982.

I didn't remember them having the 8th floor of Leb Hall at the time. From what I recall, they had a room in the Main Building. Arthur got the 8th floor room a few years later. From what I was told, it was LRH's wish that that suite get renovated for his children, and Arthur was the only one left in the SO at that time.

I remember that Arthur was quite paranoid about people coming to his room. He had a gun collection.

Lori was apparently a real problem to management. I think she was a fairly new Scientologist and new in the Sea Org. She talked way too much. She wound up first retreading the EPF and then, I think about a year later, she was routed out altogether. She and Arthur got divorced.

I have no idea whatever happened to her.

 

[Lulu Belle]

During this time Peter Schless was recruited for the Sea Org. I remember it because someone mentioned to me that he had taken LSD, but his approval to join the SO was overridden by his recruiter (hint, short, blond, bossy, took over running a religion) and he went through his EPF in like a week and his clearances in 24 hours and he was whisked away uplines.

There was a heavy push on musicians going uplines right in this time period, and I dont remember the names of them all, but they were all whisked uplines in very short order right in that same time period with Peter. Some of them are still there.

Peter wasn't the only person "invited" to join the SO at Int who had taken LSD.

There were three fine artists at the time who were working in the LRH Art Bureau. Barry Shereshevsky, Rick Rodgers and someone named Jeannie (I think her name was Jeannie Hall). When they moved the Art Bureau uplines with PDO these three, who, if I recall correctly, had all taken LSD, were "invited" by DM to go.

All three of them declined.

I'm sure they were "persona non grata" after that.

 

[Lulu Belle]

There was no line set up properly for the e-meter recertification line. Our office was a recruit office and an Int Readiness Unit (with Maggie Denton and Mike Gilcrest as auditors, and I think Tom Pope and William Carey as recruiters).

Weren't Debbie Truax/Gillian and (I think) Lynette Hall recruiters there at that time as well? Do I have the same time period?

I think for a period Brian Andrus was recruiting for RTC there also.

So public would try to drop off meters and I would take them and send them uplines. They sent them back to me and told me that it was not a proper line and the public had to mail them in, or give them to Bridge. Bridge doesnt and never did handle meters. So there was a big dispute, meanwhile the public getting pissed because they would not let me accept them, though I was perfectly willing to do it. This went on for months.

Yeah, I remember the "issues" with trying to get Gold to cert and repair meters.

Bridge actually did handle meters at one time. I think it was up until the early 80s or so meters were built at Bridge in the old Bridge building. It was called "HEM" (presumably for "Hubbard E-Meter").

 

[Bea Kiddo]

Yeah, Debbie was a b*tch. Excuse me. I did not get along with her at all.

Lynette too. From what I recall, her husband got declared and she divorced and went uplines. He go declared because he figured out how to not have to answer his merc (like email) messages. And I think he was showing others how to do it too. You could save the message, then delete it, then delete the saved message, or something like that. And it got him declared. But I remember her still being around and maybe even making it uplines. Not for sure though.

I do remember Brian Andrus too. Short, brown hair, maybe brown eyes. Kinda cute. Very "tone 40" for lack of a better way to put it.

------

About Arthur - so it must have been 82. He definitely had a wife and definitely lived on the 8th floor of Leb Hall when I was babysitting the kid. Funny thing is, I had just come back from Florida. And why did I just come back from Florida? Because my brother and I were directly connected to our dad, who was a declared SP and he was coming onto the SO property. To disconnect, my mom took us back to LA (actually, she blew Flag and came back to LA and got in trouble for it).

It's weird, with all their pyscho-ness about security that they would let me around Arthur and all, with me having just been DIRECTLY connected to an SP, and it was still at the time not fully handled.

-----------

Thanks for your help Lulu. You are really helping me out with dates and stuff. And remembering more names. I think, because I was a kid, things were quite differently recorded for me as memory, know what I mean?

 

[Lulu Belle]

This was the part that got me to respond.

This is my opinion and advice only - others may think waaay dfferently.

Don't EVER allow Scientology or Scientologists to tell you how to behave or what to do merely to accommodate them and their insane beliefs.

For a couple of years after I was out and when I was first on the net (Dennis may remember..) I was pretty diffident and careful about telling someone who was a Scientologist that I was declared and that they should not be talking to me. Then I started to get a clue (slowly) that this was a truly nutty way to do things.

I do not care what Scientology and Scientologists believe, I do not care what restrictions or weird taboos they place on themselves. If my being somewhere or talking or posting makes them unable to be there, talk or write - that's their problem, not mine.

AS for your mother's admonition about your grandparents funeral - do what you wish to do. Your mom is free to do the same.

You know, Mick, I'm sure you're right about this.

But I have to admit I have trouble with this, too.

I have deliberately avoided situations where I would be communicating with a "Scientologist in good standing" because I didn't want to "get them in trouble".

The reason for this is that when I was in, I had a couple of situations where a person that I had known who left the church got me in trouble by implying that we were still in contact with each other. And a "wog" friend of mine from before I got into Scientology did something similar.

To me, it's sort of sort of a "respect" thing. If you were a Scientologist, you know the deal. You know that you could be causing this person a lot of hassle; possibly a lot of money, by them being in contact with you.

I didn't like it when it happened to me, and so I try not to do it to others.

Then again, if "respecting" Scientology's beliefs means cutting yourself off from family, that's a whole different thing.

I have very mixed feelings about this whole issue. I guess I'll have to work through them.

 

[Dulloldfart]

He go declared because he figured out how to not have to answer his merc (like email) messages. And I think he was showing others how to do it too. You could save the message, then delete it, then delete the saved message, or something like that. And it got him declared.

Useless merc trivia:
I was in the HGB from around 1989 to 1995, and remember two ways to do it. MERCURY was (still is?) the INCOMM e-mail system, pretty nifty actually in some ways, such as differentiating an answer from an ack. If a senior sent you an origination, you had to answer it, i.e. you would hit the "answer" key and type whatever you wanted. If the response was satisfactory, the senior would send you an ack using the "ack" key. When you got the ack, you could shred it. End of cycle. But you couldn't shred an origination, and you couldn't shred an answer, and you couldn't ack an origination either. There was a single key for "Ack and shred", and in response to a satisfactory answer you could just hit it, and it would send a "Thank you" back, and shred the comm cycle, and bring up the next one, all within one second. If you didn't answer a merc (SO slang for an e-mail on this system) within 24 hours, it staledated, and you got chitted or worse, so it got to be a big deal to not staledate your merc traffic.

Anyway, one way to avoid the staledating was to hit the answer key, delete the incoming message, and instead write an origination to the person who had sent you the original message. The other person would see what looked like an origination from you, and answer it, which you could then ack and shred, thereby ending the comm cycle and (for now) getting out of handling the original origination. Maybe the first person would notice you had avoided the original comm cycle, or maybe not.

The other way was if you had two separate log-ons, for two separate hats, you could forward the original message to your other ID, then go through the answer/ack cycle between your own IDs.

These methods were only temporary, putting off some dire punishment for a short time, as everyone knew that you were doing something funky if you didn't answer up within 24 hours.

Note that you couldn't just say, "OK, I've got your order, I'm working on it" as that qualified as a "wilco", and you would have to show some genuine progress. Some Programs Chiefs would have literally two hundred or more mercs a day to handle. Totally insane set-up.

Paul