What's new

Rathbun Talks About Mike Rinder

Carmel

Crusader


LOL... saved by the little smiley! :coolwink:

Upon the advice of counsel, and under the protections afforded me by the 5th Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America, I respectfully decline to answer your "Admit it" question on the grounds that it may tend to identify me as a bullbaiting satirist. :hattip:

:lol: :thumbsup:
 

Terril park

Sponsor
I agree with what you've said here Mark (that which I've quoted above, from your post). However, I don't believe that this is the issue for a lot of us, when it comes to MR.

To me, in his postings (on his blog), he comes across with a certain superiority, a righteousness, and a lack of willingness to look at what he did. I don't expect him to spill the beans on all, straight up, but he has been out some years now, and I would at least expect him to be looking at doing so - Given the persona that he is presenting, it doesn't appear likely that this is going to happen. It would appear that he doesn't need or want that "privacy to sort through his stuff", like most do take and need. Instead it would appear that he is now on a 'new' steam train in another direction and is content with leaving what he did while in the SO, buried under the carpet. I was more than willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, but the more I see, the more that "willingness" is deteriorating.

I still am waiting to see where MR goes from here, and I am still reserving judgment to some extent (although I don't hold much hope). However, when people rave on about MR and give him some kind of "hero status", it makes me sick. Given his history in the CofS, he is far from any kind of hero - I think that this is the issue, and the thing that many of us find irksome .......'the' thing that 'creates' such an adverse reaction to MR.

If I was a mate of his, and I wanted to do him a favour, I'd be telling him to pull his bloody head in, and take a look at this issue.

When Marty first posted here he was bashed and challenged. He commented that there was a right time and place to do certain things.

He is at war with an organisation with truckloads of money, lawyers, PIs, OSA and so on. All he has is some data and some friends.

His reports to the SP times was an apparently foolhardy request to RTC
asking them to sue him. He has made similar requests to both Monique Yingling and Bert Fields.

Re DM beating up staff he has admitted quite publically that he was also guilty.

But this war is it seems only just beginning and its one where Marty clearly has to hold his cards close to his chest.
 

Panda Termint

Cabal Of One
LOL... saved by the little smiley! :coolwink: (Damn, I almost enjoyed a moment of serious righteous indignation before you spoiled it and made me laugh! )

And Furthermore....

Upon the advice of counsel, and under the protections afforded me by the 5th Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America, I respectfully decline to answer your "Admit it" question on the grounds that it may tend to identify me as a bullbaiting satirist. :hattip:
Fair enough! :)
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
Schwimmy ....

Get into your best sanctimonious and priglike mode and meet HelluvaHoax and I at the front door at the 'convention' ...


:dieslaughing:

PS Wear your hat so we know it's you ...

I went to one of the FZ conventions. There were people there harassing them- or trying to. They were in CofS. Is that really the sort of company you guys would like to keep or behave like?
 

SchwimmelPuckel

Genuine Meatball
I went to one of the FZ conventions. There were people there harassing them- or trying to. They were in CofS. Is that really the sort of company you guys would like to keep or behave like?
Nah! - Too boring, not nearly offensive enough! - Needs much more yelling of obscenities and mooning and stuff.

(WTF are we talking about anyway?)

:wiggle:
 
Allright, we're not in any basic disagreement then..

Fundamentally, I don't think we are in disagreement.


I do not think Miscavige is the source of this mess however.. Hubbard is.

:yes:

Oversimplification. This mess has a LOT of sources. However, I concur that Hubbard is the PRIMARY source of this mess. He had a LOT of help though.

Where we might differ is in our various beliefs of how much of the mess to attribute specifically to his volitional actions vs how much was as a result of possible mental disabilities.


Mark A. Baker
 
Last edited:
You defend the gracious and illustrious Mr Mark Baker ...

DB, do you mean it? :biglove:


even when he sinks to foul worded insults. I was actually quite shocked.

Yeah, well you can attribute it to the fact that I was a merchant seaman at one time. Some skills you never lose. :angel:


I have come to look up to Mr Baker and respect his knowledge and the extraordinary demenour with which he conducts himself in these forums.

I want to attest now to: I fully understand the colloquialism common to parts of the former Commonwealth and widely known as "giving the mickey". :)


Mark A. Baker
 
I agree with what you've said here Mark (that which I've quoted above, from your post). However, I don't believe that this is the issue for a lot of us, when it comes to MR.

To me, in his postings (on his blog), he comes across with a certain superiority, a righteousness, and a lack of willingness to look at what he did.

What, Carmel? You are surprised to find evidence of "serfacs" in a human being, much less one recently departed from the senior ranks of the Co$? :)


I don't expect him to spill the beans on all, straight up, but he has been out some years now, and I would at least expect him to be looking at doing so - Given the persona that he is presenting, it doesn't appear likely that this is going to happen. It would appear that he doesn't need or want that "privacy to sort through his stuff", like most do take and need. Instead it would appear that he is now on a 'new' steam train in another direction and is content with leaving what he did while in the SO, buried under the carpet. I was more than willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, but the more I see, the more that "willingness" is deteriorating.

Perhaps. It's hard to tell. What he's doing on the public sphere need not reflect what he is focused on privately. Either way I see no reason to interfere with his efforts.


I still am waiting to see where MR goes from here, and I am still reserving judgment to some extent (although I don't hold much hope). However, when people rave on about MR and give him some kind of "hero status", it makes me sick. Given his history in the CofS, he is far from any kind of hero - I think that this is the issue, and the thing that many of us find irksome .......'the' thing that 'creates' such an adverse reaction to MR.

It appears to be a common reaction. I'm curious if that may not be for many a continuing "projection" of disappointment from the collapse of "Ron the Idol".

Personally, I don't believe in "heros" or "saviors". Those who believe in such things will find them in odd places.


If I was a mate of his, and I wanted to do him a favour, I'd be telling him to pull his bloody head in, and take a look at this issue.

And I'd agree, that would be good advice.


Mark A. Baker
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
Perhaps. It's hard to tell. What he's doing on the public sphere need not reflect what he is focused on privately. Either way I see no reason to interfere with his efforts.

Where his effort runs to revising history (His own and Scientology's) denying crimes and promoting the theory that all that's 'wrong' with Scientology is David Miscavige, I think it's valuable to label it as bullshit. I'm not sure whether that's 'interference'. No doubt the 'true believers' who want Marty as their savior won't care, but, if the public perception of his efforts is that he's just another Scientology PR flak with delusions of glory and heroism that may indeed interfere with his aspirations.

Zinj
 
If you recall, I never originated a post to the gentleman in question. For whatever reason only he perhaps knows, he posted an unsolicited, ugly, hate-filled, personal attack.

No apology for his behavior was subsequently posted.

So, that (last post) was my answer.

So far I've seen nothing to indicate that I have actually done anything for which an apology is due. Should I change my view in this I will be happy to publicly issue one.

I saw your prior post as continuing a stream of invective directed at some guy, somewhere else, who is not active on this site, and who is currently most publicly involved in pursuing a public challenge to the most abusive parts of the Co$ organization.

He's got a bit of "history". So do many here on ESMB and elsewhere in the "ex" community. Nothing new there. He has invited those who feel victimized to contact him privately to discuss the matter. That is somewhat unusual. John 8:7 :angel:

So far the only apologies I'm seeing owed are by you & a few of your friends. You owe them to MR. I don't believe he is anticipating such a thing.

If you wish to pm to me to discuss why you think I owe you an apology, I will be happy to respond to you. Should your arguments prove persuasive, you will get one made publicly on this thread.

Personally I'm inclined to the view that many ex-scientologists might well benefit from pursuing some form of "12 Step Program" as a part of "decompressing" from their involvement in the cult. Chief among the principles of such a program is that of not seeking to shift blame. The operant aspect of that should be obvious to any long term scientologist, whether "ex" or practicing.


Mark A. Baker
 

Terril park

Sponsor
Where his effort runs to revising history (His own and Scientology's) denying crimes and promoting the theory that all that's 'wrong' with Scientology is David Miscavige, I think it's valuable to label it as bullshit. I'm not sure whether that's 'interference'. No doubt the 'true believers' who want Marty as their savior won't care, but, if the public perception of his efforts is that he's just another Scientology PR flak with delusions of glory and heroism that may indeed interfere with his aspirations.

Zinj

His mission is different to yours Zinj. He's going b:eyeroll: alls to the wall to attack DM.

To attack LRH, even if he wanted to, would compromise that mission.

Lets see how it all plays out.:yes: And munch popcorn
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
His mission is different to yours Zinj. He's going b:eyeroll: alls to the wall to attack DM.

To attack LRH, even if he wanted to, would compromise that mission.

Lets see how it all plays out.:yes: And munch popcorn

If Marty Rathbun wanted to take down David Miscavige, the only limitation would be that he will be taken down himself. They're the 'Mutually Assured Destruction Twins'. Apparently you're not disputing that Rathbun is blatantly lying; you just think it serves some purpose for you.

Zinj
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
So far I've seen nothing to indicate that I have actually done anything for which an apology is due. Should I change my view in this I will be happy to publicly issue one.

I saw your prior post as continuing a stream of invective directed at some guy, somewhere else, who is not active on this site, and who is currently most publicly involved in pursuing a public challenge to the most abusive parts of the Co$ organization.

He's got a bit of "history". So do many here on ESMB and elsewhere in the "ex" community. Nothing new there. He has invited those who feel victimized to contact him privately to discuss the matter. That is somewhat unusual. John 8:7 :angel: So far the only apologies I'm seeing owed are by you & a few of your friends. You owe them to MR. I don't believe he is anticipating such a thing. If you wish to pm to me to discuss why you think I owe you an apology, I will be happy to respond to you. Should your arguments prove persuasive, you will get one made publicly on this thread.
Personally I'm inclined to the view that many ex-scientologists might well benefit from pursuing some form of "12 Step Program" as a part of "decompressing" from their involvement in the cult. Chief among the principles of such a program is that of not seeking to shift blame. The operant aspect of that should be obvious to any long term scientologist, whether "ex" or practicing.

bon voyage, dude!
 

I told you I was trouble

Suspended animation
I went to one of the FZ conventions. There were people there harassing them- or trying to. They were in CofS. Is that really the sort of company you guys would like to keep or behave like?

Fluff ... it was said in jest (obviously!).

:p

Although, since you ask, it would make little difference to me whether they were CofS or FZ ... a rude and arrogant scientologist is still a rude and arrogant scientologist regardless of which camp it emanates from, and rudeness/arrogance to HH was the issue, at the time, but I think we have all moved on now.

:happydance:
 

I told you I was trouble

Suspended animation
[/I]

HelluvaThx!

Convention sounds cool. When/Where is it? Hope I can make it to party with y'all!

Actually....I have a very big announcement to make at the Convention. After much soul searching, I have finally found the RIGHT ITEMS for the 2 personalized Listing & Nulling Questions that were C/Sed for me by my advanced spiritual guide:

who the F@CK are YOU?

who died and made you the GREAT ARBITER GOD?


The gains were beyond my wildest dreams and I can't wait to share them and help get everyone on to this super-theta rundown!!!

Cool HelluvaHoax ... we all need a charming 'advanced spiritual guide' like that ... (not).


I may have to change my mind about the convention though (I think I'll be washing my hair that day).

:p
 
So far I've seen nothing to indicate that I have actually done anything for which an apology is due. Should I change my view in this I will be happy to publicly issue one.

I saw your prior post as continuing a stream of invective directed at some guy, somewhere else, who is not active on this site, and who is currently most publicly involved in pursuing a public challenge to the most abusive parts of the Co$ organization.

He's got a bit of "history". So do many here on ESMB and elsewhere in the "ex" community. Nothing new there. He has invited those who feel victimized to contact him privately to discuss the matter. That is somewhat unusual. John 8:7 :angel:

So far the only apologies I'm seeing owed are by you & a few of your friends. You owe them to MR. I don't believe he is anticipating such a thing.

If you wish to pm to me to discuss why you think I owe you an apology, I will be happy to respond to you. Should your arguments prove persuasive, you will get one made publicly on this thread.

Personally I'm inclined to the view that many ex-scientologists might well benefit from pursuing some form of "12 Step Program" as a part of "decompressing" from their involvement in the cult. Chief among the principles of such a program is that of not seeking to shift blame. The operant aspect of that should be obvious to any long term scientologist, whether "ex" or practicing.


Mark A. Baker

Yeah that's exactly what they need, an AA like "12 Step Program" with people you and Marty selling cocktails and beers after the meetings in the parking lot, from the trucks of your cars in your plaid polyester used car salesman's suits ... as you preach the evils of alcohol
 

Terril park

Sponsor
If Marty Rathbun wanted to take down David Miscavige, the only limitation would be that he will be taken down himself. They're the 'Mutually Assured Destruction Twins'.

Possibly you're correct, but I thought whistleblowers got legal protection?


Apparently you're not disputing that Rathbun is blatantly lying; you just think it serves some purpose for you.

Zinj

I've not said anything about Rathbun lying. He hasn't said all he intends to say as yet IMO.

Getting rid of DM would be a very acceptable purpose for me.
 
Possibly you're correct, but I thought whistleblowers got legal protection?




I've not said anything about Rathbun lying. He hasn't said all he intends to say as yet IMO.

Getting rid of DM would be a very acceptable purpose for me.

Marty is not a whistleblower, he is one of Miscaivige's bootlickers who got kicked to the curb by Miscaivige and now wants to cover his ass while he tries to play cult on his own.
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
Fluff ... it was said in jest (obviously!).

:p

Although, since you ask, it would make little difference to me whether they were CofS or FZ ... a rude and arrogant scientologist is still a rude and arrogant scientologist regardless of which camp it emanates from, and rudeness/arrogance to HH was the issue, at the time, but I think we have all moved on now.

:happydance:

I know that it was a jest. But there are reasons I responded as I did.
 
Top