Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual, Transgender & Queer as a 3 Dollar Bill

[DartSmohen]

When I was growing up in London, I was friends with some of the original hippies. They were a great bunch. Within that group there were a few who were "queer". No one minded. Once they knew you were strait, they interacted with you as a normal buddy.

A lot of the TV programs (in their humerous way) would portray a gay as being as camp as a row of tents, all lisping and mincing around. Being a homo was considered abnormal. There was the usual rounds of "gay-bashing", a guy would go into a bar, pick up a gay, lead him outside and the gay would get a good beating from those waiting outside. I have seen this happen in Soho on more than one occasion. The police simply turned a blind eye and smirked.

We had the Jeremy Thorpe case. a Liberal MP was accused of being a shirtlifter. His career ended right there.

It was funny with by hippy buddies. My mother was on Scn staff, I was at school and I had this bunch of guys I hung out with at the weekend.

Not all gays are limp-wristed fairies. Some of them are REALLY hard as nails. Just off Tottenham Court Road, a couple of them were walking along hand in hand. A group of yobos started calling out to them. Someone threw a bag of chips at them. Oh, dear!

Two ambulances were required to cart the yobbos off to hospital. Two police came and tried to get pushy about what happened. BIG mistake! Two police officers ended up receiving medical treatment.

That is the thing about hippies, they move around. They "crash" where they want and go where they want.

The police wanted statements from those of us sitting in the bar where this took place. It was funny, about 18 witnesses were apparently all in the toilet (one cubicle) ant the time and saw nothing, instant amnesia seemed to have struck as well.(including me).

Over the years a tolerance and accaptance has come in.

We had a Brazilian guy at St Hill. Sergio Fonceca De Ribero. Very wealthy, gay as a jaybird, used to wear mink capes, hair implants. He was frequently in Ethics for hitting on his landlady's sons. Mick Parkee had no idea how to deal with it.

But his openness and frankness about being gay got across to the staff and public alike. He was totally accepted. (The reg's had to keep their TR's in when regging him).

Throughout Scn there have been people who are lesbian or gay. They had to suppress their emotions because Hubbard was homophobic.

I have processed numerous gays and lesbians. I never held with the maxim that they were "1.1".

Amazing how one man's prejudices put a colour on our overall approach to others.

 

[Björkist]

When I was growing up in London, I was friends with some of the original hippies. They were a great bunch. Within that group there were a few who were "queer". No one minded. Once they knew you were strait, they interacted with you as a normal buddy.

A lot of the TV programs (in their humerous way) would portray a gay as being as camp as a row of tents, all lisping and mincing around. Being a homo was considered abnormal. There was the usual rounds of "gay-bashing", a guy would go into a bar, pick up a gay, lead him outside and the gay would get a good beating from those waiting outside. I have seen this happen in Soho on more than one occasion. The police simply turned a blind eye and smirked.

We had the Jeremy Thorpe case. a Liberal MP was accused of being a shirtlifter. His career ended right there.

It was funny with by hippy buddies. My mother was on Scn staff, I was at school and I had this bunch of guys I hung out with at the weekend.

Not all gays are limp-wristed fairies. Some of them are REALLY hard as nails. Just off Tottenham Court Road, a couple of them were walking along hand in hand. A group of yobos started calling out to them. Someone threw a bag of chips at them. Oh, dear!

Two ambulances were required to cart the yobbos off to hospital. Two police came and tried to get pushy about what happened. BIG mistake! Two police officers ended up receiving medical treatment.

That is the thing about hippies, they move around. They "crash" where they want and go where they want.

The police wanted statements from those of us sitting in the bar where this took place. It was funny, about 18 witnesses were apparently all in the toilet (one cubicle) ant the time and saw nothing, instant amnesia seemed to have struck as well.(including me).

Over the years a tolerance and accaptance has come in.

We had a Brazilian guy at St Hill. Sergio Fonceca De Ribero. Very wealthy, gay as a jaybird, used to wear mink capes, hair implants. He was frequently in Ethics for hitting on his landlady's sons. Mick Parkee had no idea how to deal with it.

But his openness and frankness about being gay got across to the staff and public alike. He was totally accepted. (The reg's had to keep their TR's in when regging him).

Throughout Scn there have been people who are lesbian or gay. They had to suppress their emotions because Hubbard was homophobic.

I have processed numerous gays and lesbians. I never held with the maxim that they were "1.1".

Amazing how one man's prejudices put a colour on our overall approach to others.

Cool story. It's definitely good that tolerance and acceptance (of all suppressed peoples) seems to be increasing in our world. Thank a liberal, right?

A Scientologist explained her interpretation on homosexuals being 1.1 as the person was 1.1 while the specific act of homosexuality was occurring and was not necessarily in that chronic tone.

Another made the comment, "Not every 1.1 is a homosexual, but every homosexual is 1.1."

There was a woman who was lesbian onlines at a mission where I was on staff and the Reg, who was female, told her not to be surprised if she eventually became straight. The lady told her, "Don't be surpised if I don't."

 

[gomorrhan]

You're right, Outlawgal: sex has nothing to do with thetans, it has only to do with bodies. Thetans, in fact, haven't been proven to exist. Bodies, on the other hand, are pretty evident.

Consciousness, while influenced by gender, societal norms, cultural baggage, conditioning, etc., seems very neutral, to me. I don't see women as having different minds than men, only very different experiences, identifications, and so on.

Personally, I don't care if people enjoy humping anybody, or anything, as long as it's consensual. For me, I can understand how a person can "get off" with just about anyone, but what turned me on early, often, and reliably was women, and so I went that way. I don't condemn or judge people who find men attractive, be they women, men, or whatever.

 

[Anne Ominous]

Hi everyone,

Just in case you missed it or don't use it, Enturb has a very funny thread running at the moment. Basically some Dutch Anons pulled a fast one on their local OSA goons, and tricked Julia Rijnvis (I think that's her name) into handing out leaflets claiming that Marvin Gaye was the "leader" of Anonymous. Yep, you read that correctly.

This has led to a number of atrocious puns along the lines of 'Why does CoS hate Gayes?'...

http://forums.enturbulation.org/15-media/osa-marvin-gaye-leader-anonymous-22900/

 

[Zinjifar]

Hi everyone,

Just in case you missed it or don't use it, Enturb has a very funny thread running at the moment. Basically some Dutch Anons pulled a fast one on their local OSA goons, and tricked Julia Rijnvis (I think that's her name) into handing out leaflets claiming that Marvin Gaye was the "leader" of Anonymous. Yep, you read that correctly.

This has led to a number of atrocious puns along the lines of 'Why does CoS hate Gayes?'...

http://forums.enturbulation.org/15-media/osa-marvin-gaye-leader-anonymous-22900/

That's hilarious. Mikey Gormez, webmaster for http://whyaretheydead.net had a long standing 'net-crush' on Julia.
http://www.whyaretheydead.net/misc/osababes/main.html


Zinj

 

[Dulloldfart]

Hi everyone,

Just in case you missed it or don't use it, Enturb has a very funny thread running at the moment. Basically some Dutch Anons pulled a fast one on their local OSA goons, and tricked Julia Rijnvis (I think that's her name) into handing out leaflets claiming that Marvin Gaye was the "leader" of Anonymous. Yep, you read that correctly.

Thanks very much. That is hilarious! I hope someone gets the story on YouTube. And Digg.

Paul

 

[free1996]

Oh, hon. I'm so sorry to read this.

I'm sorry, too, that this is such a late response. I was in hospital when you posted this, and I'm just getting back onto the board, catching up with my life.

Is there a women's center or women's clinic nearby you? Or any folks who have experience helping people through coming to terms with a past like you're describing?

I'm hoping you live nearby some good friends and extended family who can support you through healing from that time. I'm in NYC, and if you ever wanna sit down and talk over coffee or dinner, send me a private message -- I'd be honored to be there for/with you.

xo

kate

Thanks for your thoughts. I'm fine now. This happen when I was very young-now 33 yrs old. I've gone through alot of healing. I would still love to met you for coffee one day as I love bold,brave, courages women such as yourself and would love to hear your stories. I read the post when you were in and out of the hospital. I'm glad your doing good.

 

[La La Lou Lou]

Hi Outlawgal, Ive seen a video about transgender issues. My boyfriend was thinking about changing into a lady so he bought it off the net. I thought it rather interesting, and then I saw you and being ex so and cheered. She's going ahead with it, on hormones and Psyche approval half done.

We still correspond and care a lot about each other, but I am a gay man, and really need the all bits to be there, that's why Im not with a woman. It's just too complicated. I toyed with dressing myself, but even if I looked more convincing than some I wasnt fooling myself and Im happy to be a man on the outside and a woman inside. Besides I like what Ive got, and I dont really like straight men as a huge generality I prefer shirtlifters.

I had been on staff but the Go threw me out, as they found me a bit of a security risk, and really despite people having done tr's and grades, no one really wanted to talk about it. I got into the SO, despite the GO throwing me off class 4 staff, and despite the LSD, I think I acted generally quite camply, certainly when I told someone I was getting married they said, what to a woman? Who the hell was I trying to fool, myself obviously.

Homosexuals were 1.1 traditionally, we were despised for being who we were, so had to hide the sexual side of ourselves, had sex in toilets with people you didnt know the name of, (so they couldnt get blackmailed), who were or were pretending to be straight, but so frustrated they would have you give them oral, and as they were thinking about their girlfriend at the time it was acceptable. We were never allowed to show affection to partners in public. The queerbashers were out in force. If you are so violently rejected by society how can you not be covertly hostile to that society. It's changed at least in the UK, all my family know about me, and my, now, expartner's changes, my exwife, my kid, the whole family, and no one demands I stop being who I am! I can look the world in the eye and say 'so what if I am a poof!' The world has changed, but I think it will be a long time till the scn world catches up. And don't worry with DM at the healm it'll be destroyed very soon.

 

[Wisened One]

:welome: to ESMB, La La Lou Lou!

Look forward to hearing more of your stories!

 

[michaelangelo]

Gays in Scio.

If Scio (LRH) did not accept gays it says a lot about Ron. I live in Brighton where gays are toally accepted as it has a big gay scene. I'm not gay but have no problem with it. I heard of a couple of gay celebs in scio but I will not mention their names. I'm glad that you are now able to be yourself.

 

[byte301]

Welcome LaLaLouLou! lol Can I just call you Lou from now on?

 

[La La Lou Lou]

It's a little informal to just have one syllable, and we've hardly been introduced.
When we know each other better I'll let you call me La,
L L L Lou (lol)

 

[Mark A. Baker]

If Scio (LRH) did not accept gays it says a lot about Ron. I live in Brighton where gays are toally accepted as it has a big gay scene. I'm not gay but have no problem with it. I heard of a couple of gay celebs in scio but I will not mention their names. I'm glad that you are now able to be yourself.

The fact that LRH didn't accept gays is not that surprising. He grew up in the EARLY 20th CENTURY in RURAL AMERICA, a place and time not noted for tolerance of "alternate" lifestyles. LRH DIED in 1986 after a lengthy period of self-induced ISOLATION from society.

Stonewall didn't happen until the '60s. The "sexual revolution" didn't become widespread in the U.S. until the '70s. And open attitudes about sexuality have altered IMMENSELY during the last 40 years.

You might as well blame George Washington for being a slaver, Moses for being a zionist, and Augustus Caesar for universal tyranny. The man reflects the times.

The fact that the Co$ hasn't altered views on gays is indicative of it's LEADERSHIP being stuck in a suppressive valence.



Mark A. Baker

 

[Voltaire's Child]

Exactly. He was rather old fashioned. I remember in Science of Survival, I think it was, he said some very silly and old fashioned things about the roles of women. Yet he had all sorts of female execs, etc, in CofS.

He would be close to a century old if he were around right now, woudlnt' he?

 

[michaelangelo]

Re huubard and gays.

Quote: "The fact that LRH didn't accept gays is not that surprising. He grew up in the EARLY 20th CENTURY in RURAL AMERICA, a place and time not noted for tolerance of "alternate" lifestyles. LRH DIED in 1986 after a lengthy period of self-induced ISOLATION from society".

Re above.
I thought that Ron Hubbard grew up all over the world, travelled far and wide and met and befriended many diverse cultures, would that include gays?). At least thats what has been written about him I think.

 

[Mark A. Baker]

Quote: "The fact that LRH didn't accept gays is not that surprising. He grew up in the EARLY 20th CENTURY in RURAL AMERICA, a place and time not noted for tolerance of "alternate" lifestyles. LRH DIED in 1986 after a lengthy period of self-induced ISOLATION from society".

Re above.
I thought that Ron Hubbard grew up all over the world, travelled far and wide and met and befriended many diverse cultures, would that include gays?). At least thats what has been written about him I think.

A. Don't believe everything you hear.

B. Don't assume other people, places, cultures, or times are just like yours only "different".


You might want to do a cultural study of english speaking areas of the world in the early 20th century to get some background on what attitudes were prevalent. There are reasons that Great Britain no longer has an empire, French is no longer the dominant "language of diplomacy", the Vatican has lost it's hold over the catholic "faithful", etc..

Or, as Lao Tzu put it (er ... loosely): Things Change.


Mark A. Baker

 

[michaelangelo]

Hubbard and gays.

Because one grew up up in early 20th century rural America does not give anyone the excuse not to accept gays. Ron did more than not accept gays he actively persecuted them. If you look at what happenned to his own son who was gay and found dead in his car. I have known people who grew up in places like Hubbard did. But they did not persecute people for being gay.

 

[Voltaire's Child]

I was told by someone once that he had many staff who worked closely with him at St Hill who were gay.

 

[degraded being]

The fact that LRH didn't accept gays is not that surprising. He grew up in the EARLY 20th CENTURY in RURAL AMERICA, a place and time not noted for tolerance of "alternate" lifestyles. LRH DIED in 1986 after a lengthy period of self-induced ISOLATION from society.

Stonewall didn't happen until the '60s. The "sexual revolution" didn't become widespread in the U.S. until the '70s. And open attitudes about sexuality have altered IMMENSELY during the last 40 years.

You might as well blame George Washington for being a slaver, Moses for being a zionist, and Augustus Caesar for universal tyranny. The man reflects the times.

The fact that the Co$ hasn't altered views on gays is indicative of it's LEADERSHIP being stuck in a suppressive valence.



Mark A. Baker

Before (insert year) every person was intolerant/racist/homophobic - and what ever other nasty attitude you can think of. They were all like that.

Is that what you're saying?

What about those on the receiving end of those attitudes?

Oh yeah, I get it, they are not important, or maybe they weren't people, it's not THEM that we're talking about right?

 

[Mark A. Baker]

Because one grew up up in early 20th century rural America does not give anyone the excuse not to accept gays. Ron did more than not accept gays he actively persecuted them. If you look at what happenned to his own son who was gay and found dead in his car. I have known people who grew up in places like Hubbard did. But they did not persecute people for being gay.

It's the PAST. The people from those times are, for the most part, DEAD. Get over it. I've known many people in my life who were fine individuals but whose prejudices & bigotry reflected the social standards of their communities. They could be both genuinely lovely as well as hateful, sometimes at the same time.

"Active persecution" differs according to perspective. In the south in the early sixties "whites only" was not regarded as "active persecution". It reflected a "community standard". "Racism" was something practiced by vicious Klansmen, not "genteel southerners". It took the enforcement of civil rights laws and court orders to alter the cultural climate to effect an understanding that "separate" is NOT "equal".

The times past were different cultures. They have similarities to present cultures and they have differences. By what standard to you judge them? Are you willing to be judged by their standards?

Focus your efforts on DOING BETTER YOURSELF rather than on how "WRONG" the people of those times were.

If you want to play the "judgement game" then try imagining how others will ( and do!) judge YOU for your own attitudes and actions towards others.



Mark A. Baker